300WM - Every day rifle

ths84

Well-Known Member
Good afternoon all,

After the spectacular H4H shoot this weekend gone (many thanks 8x57) and seeing a lot of stunning rifles around I am now looking for a new 300WM which will become my every day rifle from foxes up to boar etc.

I have a budget of around £1500 with scope, not so fussed about having a mod or even being screw cut but it does need to be a wood stock.

I have seen the CZ 550 Medium Lux and it looks nice but I am open to opinions on this, the M70 classic isn't due into the UK until December this year.

I am not looking to reload so some ideas on factory rounds as well would be brilliant!

Thanks in advance.
 
I think CZ has discontinued the 550 Safari in 300 Win Mag, which has iron sights, and upgraded wood. That is a nicely balanced rifle, with just a slightly shorter barrel than most 300 WMs. CZ puts a really good barrel on their rifles.

I didn't not realize you cannot get the Winchester M70 over there. If you are going to shoot a large scope, the straight comb on the stock of the Supergrade is nice. These are beautiful rifles.
Model 70 Super Grade, Bolt Action Deer Elk Big Game Rifle -- Winchester Repeating Arms -- Product Model

300 WM is a lot of rifle for most game smaller than an American elk, really into its own with bullets 180-gr or more. If you get one, you really should consider hand loading. It won't cost you $200 to set up. Then you can make some milder loads with 125 gr for fox and 150 gr for deer and practice.
 
I was thinking of this in the abstract only the other day. I recently bought a Sako 85 in Stainless Laminate in 30-06 for boar and moose although I will probably use it for larger/tougher deer too. My 'go-to' rifle generally is a 6.5x55 Sauer.

Anyway, now I've got used to the round, I was thinking 'hmmm - should I have just put a different barrel on the Sauer and used it for everything?'

A shooting mate bought the same rifle in 300WM with the idea that he will use it for everything except long range fox for which he has a .204.

Both of us would rather dig our eyes out with a shovel than reload and we have found that Norma (150 and 180) and RWS Evo (180) fly very well. I would have thought that you could put together a package around a Tikka T3 within your budget. Tikka certainly do well with factory ammo. If I was trying to put together a do-it-all combo, I would look at a variable scope - maybe 2-8 or 2-10 or 3-12

Have you considered stepping down a shade to, say, 30-06? Still a great all-rounder with slightly longer legs than a 308, but not quite as heavy hitting as the 300WM.

regards


Ian
 
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Since rabitter brought up the .30-06, I will give my second to that. The .30-06 and 7x64, because of the case size, are very versatile, with the huge selection of bullets in both calibers. The .300 WM is a more specialized cartridge, above the .30-06, just as the .270 is below it. The .30-06 comes with a huge variety of factory ammunition, from 123-gr to 220 gr. You will surely find several factory loads which shoot well. Unless you are shooting game at 400 yards, it doesn't bring any advantage over the 30-06.

Two of my best shooting .30-06s ( I own 9 ) are the Tikka T3 Lite SS, and an older Remington 700 Synthetic BDL SS, both right out of the box pouring every factory and military loading into small groups. I paid less than $500 for each of them at the time. That is where I would go, and then you would have lots left for a scope, case, sling, and ammo. If you like wood, try to find an older M700 BDL with little use. The one I have had since 1967 shoots better every year.
 
At reasonable hunting ranges the difference between a 30-06 and the 300 with the same bullet is not worth worrying about. What is significant is the inherent accuracy potential advantage offered by the 30-06 over the 300 WM. The WM headspaces on the belt whereas the 30-06 headspaces on the casing shoulder. The 30-06 alos has a longer neck holding the bullet more precisely and securely. Sure you can reload the WM to headspace on the shoulder but the OP does bnot want to reload does he.

SS
 
Spend half that amount on the rifle as you will need the other £750 to feed it factory ammo!!

Don't get me wrong I am almost considering getting rid of my .270 (almost...never happen)
but I reload for the 300Wm and at £35-55 a box of 20 you would need a very good reason not to reload if you do anything other than the odd trip here or there
Unless you want to use some of the 10's of 1000's of 145gr FMJ Privi that it is rumoured Henry Krank overordered and sells of at £70 a 100!

Don't listen the all the stuff spouted about neck length and belt headspacing
There is nothing wrong with the accuracy potential of the cartridge or any named brand of rifle...if there was numerous armed forces and police authorities wouldn't have adopted the 300WM as their light sniper round of choice.
I stopped headspacing off the belt after one firing.
pointless exercise IMO

As for comparing energy delivery.
No deer or pig will ever know the difference between getting hit in the vitals by a .308 180gr, or a .30-06 180gr or a 300WM 180gr.
but that's not the point really....

and secretly that's why you want one isn't it?!??!? :norty:

Something deeply satisfying with the slow thump in the shoulder as a 208gr leaves the muzzle at close to 3000fps
 
Very much so bewsher, I had a 300WM about a year ago but it was a Howa 1500 and it just didn't have that 'feel of a soul' so go rid of it. I did reload for it but that was because at the time I was doing a lot of shooting where as now its about 20 shots a month (if that) so spending £30 a month is fine in my eyes and I also have a 243 and a 22WMR which make up the cabinet.

Many saw the accuracy of the 22WMR monster at a 100m at the H4H shoot last weekend, there was even a "I'm going to do a headshot" 100m running deer straight in the eye :D
 
Don't listen the all the stuff spouted about neck length and belt headspacing

Now why do you suppose a lot of serious long range competitiors used the 30-338 WM, do yu think it might be because it offered a longer neck?

Armed Forces and police authroities are not neccesarily gun-savy so following there lead might result in going off the same cliff. Their leadership oftne makes buying decisions based on their gut-feelings and not neccesarily on any technical exxpertise.

SS
 
Good afternoon all,

After the spectacular H4H shoot this weekend gone (many thanks 8x57) and seeing a lot of stunning rifles around I am now looking for a new 300WM which will become my every day rifle from foxes up to boar etc.

I have a budget of around £1500 with scope, not so fussed about having a mod or even being screw cut but it does need to be a wood stock.

I have seen the CZ 550 Medium Lux and it looks nice but I am open to opinions on this, the M70 classic isn't due into the UK until December this year.

I am not looking to reload so some ideas on factory rounds as well would be brilliant!

Thanks in advance.

Do you already have an open slot for a .300 Magnum ? A mate of mine who is an RFD was denied a .300 Win Mag for use on UK deer, he was told that if you already had a 30 Cal magnum for deer then so be it but they will now not condition a new one for UK deer. He was granted for target and hunting abroad.

Regards

Ed
 
I have a dozen calibres from .22 to.375H&H.

For most game, from fox to red deer, from woodland, hill and mountain stalking I pretty much use my 300WM for everything.
 
Yep open ticket, Deer and AOLQ for the 300WM.

Do you already have an open slot for a .300 Magnum ? A mate of mine who is an RFD was denied a .300 Win Mag for use on UK deer, he was told that if you already had a 30 Cal magnum for deer then so be it but they will now not condition a new one for UK deer. He was granted for target and hunting abroad.

Regards

Ed


Conor1 - which rifle do you have in 300wm and do you use a mod on it?
 
I got a Browning x-bolt battue (non screwcut) in 300wm to go boar shooting last year and really like it. Have it with a scope on QD mounts but for boar use the battue, came with an adjustable rear sight as well. Out of all my rifles it's the one I most enjoy shooting, no deer with it yet but had various vermin (and boar)
Ammunition wise I'm using Lapua Mega 185gr for boar, but not sure of future availability. Have some Lapua loaded with a 165gr swift scirocco as well but am told that they are no longer loaded.
 
A little over your budget but my .300WM
Browning Maral
Very light but easy on felt recoil because of the fancy pad.
Grade 4 wood is standard
AOLQ
dec13113_zpse6289c1f.jpg


But its very violent on foxes even with 185 megas
Sweden
sweden201418_zpseb88176b.jpg
 
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Do you already have an open slot for a .300 Magnum ? A mate of mine who is an RFD was denied a .300 Win Mag for use on UK deer, he was told that if you already had a 30 Cal magnum for deer then so be it but they will now not condition a new one for UK deer. He was granted for target and hunting abroad.

Regards

Ed

He needs to go back and speak to them choosing his words more carefully.
No reason whatsoever why you can't have two 30cals conditioned for deer at the same time
I have 308 and 300wm (not to mention 270)
 
What is significant is the inherent accuracy potential advantage offered by the 30-06 over the 300 WM. The WM headspaces on the belt whereas the 30-06 headspaces on the casing shoulder. The 30-06 alos has a longer neck holding the bullet more precisely and securely. Sure you can reload the WM to headspace on the shoulder but the OP does bnot want to reload does he.

Don't listen the all the stuff spouted about neck length and belt headspacing
There is nothing wrong with the accuracy potential of the cartridge or any named brand of rifle...if there was numerous armed forces and police authorities wouldn't have adopted the 300WM as their light sniper round of choice.
I stopped headspacing off the belt after one firing.
pointless exercise IMO
Now why do you suppose a lot of serious long range competitiors used the 30-338 WM, do yu think it might be because it offered a longer neck?
A key advantage of the longer neck is supposed to be less throat burn especially in overbore cartridges, but even with the longer neck, you can bet that they weren't headspacing off the belt!
 
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+1 for Conor1
My 300wm launching 150gr Noslers is my go to for most of my UK shooting. Step up to180/200 for abroad.

And I have four .30 cals on my ticket for deer;)
 
He needs to go back and speak to them choosing his words more carefully.
No reason whatsoever why you can't have two 30cals conditioned for deer at the same time
I have 308 and 300wm (not to mention 270)

He has been back to them repetitively. They have stated that no magnum calibers 30 cal and above will be granted for UK deer. He asked if this was just Thames Valley Police and was told that no this was going to be countrywide. Those already with 30 + cal magnums conditioned for UK deer will not be affected.


Regards

Ed
 
He has been back to them repetitively. They have stated that no magnum calibers 30 cal and above will be granted for UK deer. He asked if this was just Thames Valley Police and was told that no this was going to be countrywide. Those already with 30 + cal magnums conditioned for UK deer will not be affected.


Regards

Ed

Excuse the long winded post but this really irritates me. The Police have a duty to administer the issue of FAC/SGC's from the standpoint of safety and security. That's it! Not there appropriate usage.
If he gives up it sets a precedence. Please urge him not to and he should contact BASC etc

There is no way they can limit the use of 300WM on deer Nationally. More to the point why would they want to!?
Moreover if he has that statement in writing please pass it on to the BASC as this would be a gross dereliction in the Police's duty as administrator to single out the usage of one range or calibres and effectively blanket ban them

He needs to contact the Chief Constable/Inspector and explain that he and his Firearm's office is in breach of UK Law in their restricted interpretation of the HO Guidance which is not their for their own obtuse amusement.
Perhaps he could ask the CC/CI to answer some simple stalking ballistics questions to qualify his judgement when he answers in his reply

-Why is the residential area he covers somehow different from the rest of the UK where many people have 300WM covered for deer?

-Is he an expert in the humane killing of deer? I know the answer but perhaps he can explain how he knows more about the terminal effects of large calibre HV bullets at range

-Is it the ME the MV or the bullet weight that most concerns him about these "fearsome" cartridges?
ME can be matched by any number of readily available cartridges
MV can be blitzed by any number of factory loads
Bullet weight is the same for .308, .30-06 etc

Should perhaps your friend have land that requires large species deer (highlight the resilience of Sika for example) to be shot at extended range that requires the use of a faster heavier bullet to maintain it IMPACT velocity/energy (rather than figures at the muzzle) in order to be considered humane. is the CI/CC really going to restrict your friends ability to kill humanely and will he be on hand should your friend be prosecuted for prolonging the death of an animal by any of the Animal Welfare organisations?

Draw his attention to the relevant parts of the HO Guidance

13.6 “Good reason” should be neither confined to need nor equated with desire. Most firearm
certificate holders possess firearms for reasons of their profession, sport, collectors or recreation,
and may properly wish to exercise discretion as to what types of firearms they choose for these
purposes. On the other hand, a simple wish to own a particular sort of firearm is not in itself
“good reason” without further supporting evidence of intentions. Chief officers of police should
be mindful of case law (Anderson v Neilans (1940) and Joy v Chief Constable of Dumfries and
Galloway (1966)) which suggests that the chief officer should consider the application firstly “from
the standpoint of the applicant rather than from that of a possible objector”. “Good reason” will
need to be demonstrated for each firearm to be held under section 1 of the 1968 Act.


13.17 The table at the end of this chapter provides guidance on whether, for the purposes of
establishing “good reason”, a particular calibre is suitable for shooting certain quarry. It
should be noted that the list of calibres is not exhaustive but will serve as a useful guide.


13.18 ‘Yes’ indicates that the calibre is suitable for the purpose, and pursuit of such quarry would
normally be a “good reason” to possess such a rifle. ‘No’ indicates that the calibre and
muzzle energy is unsuitable, unlawful or inhumane, and pursuit of such a quarry would not
therefore be a “good reason” to possess such a rifle. This, however, should not exclude the
use of a larger or more powerful firearm, for which “good reason” has been established,
to shoot smaller quarry (see 13.9). In some cases an applicant will want to possess two
similar weapons for the same category of use, for example, where an employer requires
the applicant to use a weapon for official purposes but the applicant also wants to hold
one for personal use (for example, deerstalking). Chief officers of police should also note
that many animals (including many birds) are protected by law (see chapter 14). Licensing
officers will also wish to have regard to other paragraphs in this chapter which offer more
detailed guidance in relation to specific quarry.



13.37 Some rifles intended for antelope and other plains game may also be suitable for deer, boar or other quarry shooting in this country. Once initial “good reason” has been established for a rifle in shooting “dangerous game”, it may also be considered for shooting the larger deer species and boar in Britain.

If he still hits a brick wall, get it for target shooting and convert when acquired!!

in the same way I had boar added to a deer rifle they can not restrict the adding of a quarry condition to a rifle that you already have established a good reason...ever!

10.38 There is no requirement to establish ‘good reason’ for additional conditions or the addition of quarry species to an existing condition where ‘good reason’ already exists for the possession of a firearm in the first instance (See chapter 13). Firearms should be conditioned to provide flexibility with quarry shooting by allowing all lawful quarry (see Appendix 3)
 
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Personally I'd contact the NGO as they seem to be pretty proactive when tackling firearns licencing issues
atb jim
 
Excuse the long winded post but this really irritates me. The Police have a duty to administer the issue of FAC/SGC's from the standpoint of safety and security. That's it! Not there appropriate usage.
If he gives up it sets a precedence. Please urge him not to and he should contact BASC etc

There is no way they can limit the use of 300WM on deer Nationally. More to the point why would they want to!?
Moreover if he has that statement in writing please pass it on to the BASC as this would be a gross dereliction in the Police's duty as administrator to single out the usage of one range or calibres and effectively blanket ban them

He needs to contact the Chief Constable/Inspector and explain that he and his Firearm's office is in breach of UK Law in their restricted interpretation of the HO Guidance which is not their for their own obtuse amusement.
Perhaps he could ask the CC/CI to answer some simple stalking ballistics questions to qualify his judgement when he answers in his reply

-Why is the residential area he covers somehow different from the rest of the UK where many people have 300WM covered for deer?

-Is he an expert in the humane killing of deer? I know the answer but perhaps he can explain how he knows more about the terminal effects of large calibre HV bullets at range

-Is it the ME the MV or the bullet weight that most concerns him about these "fearsome" cartridges?
ME can be matched by any number of readily available cartridges
MV can be blitzed by any number of factory loads
Bullet weight is the same for .308, .30-06 etc

Should perhaps your friend have land that requires large species deer (highlight the resilience of Sika for example) to be shot at extended range that requires the use of a faster heavier bullet to maintain it IMPACT velocity/energy (rather than figures at the muzzle) in order to be considered humane. is the CI/CC really going to restrict your friends ability to kill humanely and will he be on hand should your friend be prosecuted for prolonging the death of an animal by any of the Animal Welfare organisations?

Draw his attention to the relevant parts of the HO Guidance

13.6 “Good reason” should be neither confined to need nor equated with desire. Most firearm
certificate holders possess firearms for reasons of their profession, sport, collectors or recreation,
and may properly wish to exercise discretion as to what types of firearms they choose for these
purposes. On the other hand, a simple wish to own a particular sort of firearm is not in itself
“good reason” without further supporting evidence of intentions. Chief officers of police should
be mindful of case law (Anderson v Neilans (1940) and Joy v Chief Constable of Dumfries and
Galloway (1966)) which suggests that the chief officer should consider the application firstly “from
the standpoint of the applicant rather than from that of a possible objector”. “Good reason” will
need to be demonstrated for each firearm to be held under section 1 of the 1968 Act.


13.17 The table at the end of this chapter provides guidance on whether, for the purposes of
establishing “good reason”, a particular calibre is suitable for shooting certain quarry. It
should be noted that the list of calibres is not exhaustive but will serve as a useful guide.


13.18 ‘Yes’ indicates that the calibre is suitable for the purpose, and pursuit of such quarry would
normally be a “good reason” to possess such a rifle. ‘No’ indicates that the calibre and
muzzle energy is unsuitable, unlawful or inhumane, and pursuit of such a quarry would not
therefore be a “good reason” to possess such a rifle. This, however, should not exclude the
use of a larger or more powerful firearm, for which “good reason” has been established,
to shoot smaller quarry (see 13.9). In some cases an applicant will want to possess two
similar weapons for the same category of use, for example, where an employer requires
the applicant to use a weapon for official purposes but the applicant also wants to hold
one for personal use (for example, deerstalking). Chief officers of police should also note
that many animals (including many birds) are protected by law (see chapter 14). Licensing
officers will also wish to have regard to other paragraphs in this chapter which offer more
detailed guidance in relation to specific quarry.



13.37 Some rifles intended for antelope and other plains game may also be suitable for deer, boar or other quarry shooting in this country. Once initial “good reason” has been established for a rifle in shooting “dangerous game”, it may also be considered for shooting the larger deer species and boar in Britain.

If he still hits a brick wall, get it for target shooting and convert when acquired!!

in the same way I had boar added to a deer rifle they can not restrict the adding of a quarry condition to a rifle that you already have established a good reason...ever!

10.38 There is no requirement to establish ‘good reason’ for additional conditions or the addition of quarry species to an existing condition where ‘good reason’ already exists for the possession of a firearm in the first instance (See chapter 13). Firearms should be conditioned to provide flexibility with quarry shooting by allowing all lawful quarry (see Appendix 3)

Here here, well said.
Research your subject, record your evidence, and put it all in writing to the head of the Firearms department.

There are plenty of Win Mags conditioned for UK use, if your buddy fulfils the requirement of good reason there is no reason why it shouldn't be granted.

Don't roll over at the first hurdle.
 
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