Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 22

Thread: Iron sights

  1. #1

    Iron sights

    Hi all, following on from the interesting thread about teaching the youngsters to shoot and whether we should bother with iron sights. Has anyone shot a deer with iron sights? By iron I mean open sights or aperture sights. In my opinion a good aperture sight can be very accurate and given the correct light conditions and range can be ethical. Woodland or short range shots would be neccesary but this would add another dimension in having to get closer to your prey. Similar to the handicap accepted by bowhunters, black powder shooters and dry-fly fisherman, as long as it is done responsibley it would be more sporting.
    I believe that the major difference between UK stalkers and those from many other nations is that we have become more 'deer managers' and are losing the 'sportsmanship' from hunting. I accept that this may be neccesary in our modern times of DSC but I always wanted to be a hunter not a deer manager.
    What do others think?
    Matt

  2. #2
    Account Suspended
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    North Yorkshire
    Posts
    2,035
    Aperture sights are used on target rifles using a system of concentric circles to enclosed a round target within, surely you mean open v sights dont you?

  3. #3
    I've just bought a 7x64 Heym SR20 - which even though its near 15 years old has only had 100 shots put through it - most into sandbanks. It has open sights and Apel bases - i'm keen to get it on the range (once my Variation gets through so l can collect) then l can give it a go with the open sights! I was bought up on air rifles with open sights, and it wasn't until l could afford a scope that i eventually got one at 14 - so for possibly 6-7 years shot without. Now i know thats nothing like shooting a cf, but if you can remember what the old Webley's were like when you put a mainspring in, they had some considerable recoil! I should add that l was a bloody good shot with it too - my ferrets never went hungry! So i'm excited to give the iron sights a go at say 50 yards first then 80-100 and see how i get on!

    That is at targets though - i dont think l'd like to attempt to shoot a deer just yet with iron sights - i'd want a lot of practice at all ranges....

    T

  4. #4
    Shooting over open sights forms a part of my range work, it's good to revisit shooting as I learned it, some good scores on paper too! particularly when you have picked up a club rifle in a completely different calibre to your usual choice.
    (The Unspeakable In Pursuit Of The Uneatable.) " If I can help, I will help!." Former S.A.C.S. member!

  5. #5
    If you can consistently hit a target the size of a clay pigeon then you should be totally confident in shooting a deer. Many thousnads of deer are shot with open sights each year, and certainly in days of old many deer were shot with open sights. I know of one forum member who uses open sights and he has one beast in the larder with a clean shot at 80yds.
    Tried it out a couple evenings ago when testing some loads - there was a dder sized and shaped log in the woods - three shots with the open sights - and it would have been a dead animal with each shot.
    Would I use open sights on deer - yes provided the range was reasonable - within 80yds or so. Does a scope make things much easier - yes it does. I can see one of the key uses of open sights is in bad snowy type weather - scopes are a nightmare.

    And Tommo - very jealous of that Heym SR20 in 7x64 - they are lovely rifles. I have a left handed one in 243 and was originally looking for a 7x64 but could never find one. I spoke with Heym directly last year - they reckon the SR20 is a much better action than the new SR21. They still had a few SR20 actions on the shelf but had just sold the last left handed one. So instead bought a ferlach made 7x65r combination rifle to compliment the 243.

  6. #6
    And just picking up the sportsman aspect - fully agree with you. I hunt because I enjoy it everything from being out in the woods, observing nature at very close quarters and then being part of the food chain, shooting something and preparing it for the table. In these days of PC ness etc this does seem to have been forgotton, with all the pressure of cull targets etc.

    But a big part of being a sportsman / ethical hunter is ensuring a quick clean shot - and the best way of achieving that is getting close to the animal - the big part of stalking for me is the stalk - the actual shot is a very minor part and am fortunate that where I stalk I am not under pressure to meet targets.

    But can fully appreciate how those who are managing large deer populations with demanding cull targets need all the help they can from good scopes, bipods, moderators etc. allowing them to confidently and humanely shoot dear at ranges and in conditions where open sights and old rifles would not allow a humae shot to be taken.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Caprelous View Post
    Aperture sights are used on target rifles using a system of concentric circles to enclosed a round target within, surely you mean open v sights dont you?

    Oh dear Caprelous your education has been found wanting Aperture sights have been and are used for normal shooting and hunting. The aperture used for hunting is much larger that that used in target shooting and the actcual disc that srews intot eh windage arm is much smaller in size so it does not block out the view such as this:-


    That a Redfield Model 70 RWH aperture rear sight fitted to a BSA Model E sporting rifle. The fore sight is a 3/32 bead on a ramp.




    Now this is a simpler sporting aperture sight made by Parker-Hale for the BSA Model E ( I have recently acquired a new new condition on to replace this poor example.:-


    It lacks the refinement of the 1/4 Min clicks of the Redfield.


    This was from the sighting in session with the Redfield aperture sight after acquiring and fitting the higher fore sight needed for it and was shot with HXP 69 Surplus .303 ammunition.

    May I suggest that you acquire a copy of the book by Townsend Whelan called "The Hunting Rifle" ISBN: 0-935632-13-1

    It not only shows them but explains there use and adjustment .

    This is a fine example of English Express Iron sights and actually they provide a very good sight picture:-


    They are a far cry from the normal factory fitted irons found on most sporting rifles.

    Now in answer to the OP's question ..................... Nope not yet but I am working on it and in fact have fitted Refield 57 SME Aperture sight with a 0.080" hunting aperture disc fitted to a BSA 1st Pattern Monarch in 270 Win (BSA Drilled & Tapped the side of the action to take such sights) but have not sighted this one in yet as I need to get it moved on my FAC from collection only to be able to actually shoot it . My .270 Win BSA Majestic Fetherweight has a Parker-Hale 6EH sporting aperture rear sight fitted but with the windage arm removed so the 3-9x42 Lisenfeld scope can be fitted and used. The 6EH is sighted in and removing the windage arm with the actual aperture in it does not effect is setting.

    The main thing is that I feel that I need a bit more practice using the sperture sights before I consider serious hunting with them. Another stumbling block is that as I only go on let days and outings the guide/stalker often has reservations about one hunting with an iron sighted rifle. The last time I broached this subject when making a booking although he just said well you will handicapping your self the tone of voice said more ....................... much more so I used the scope as even though your a paying client one must also respect the providers wishes and expectations.

    It's funny that this subject came up today as it seems it's the clubs annual iron sighted full bore rifle comp tomorrow so I will get to shoot with the aperture sights for a reason .

    Although I have not done so as yet I will be drilling and tapping the action of one of the Parker-Hale rifles to accept a Lyman 57 SME aperture rear sight but have not made up my mind which one as yet. As I have an open slot for a .243 perhaps that might be the candidate? Although I did see a very nice NEW rifle at the Shooting Show at Newark it was a 6mm Remington and I already have the dies etc for 6mm Remington but it didn't have any irons on it.

  8. #8
    Hi SR20,

    The rifle l've bought was sat in a cabinet unshot for 5 years that the previous owner has said - he has only chopped it in for a 30-06 as he wanted something with a bit more punch for African small game!

    He has gone for an SR21, but having looked at the SR20 its spotless, the only wear marks on it is that the black has faided somewhat on the bolt

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Brithunter View Post
    Oh dear Caprelous your education has been found wanting Aperture sights have been and are used for normal shooting and hunting. The aperture used for hunting is much larger that that used in target shooting and the actcual disc that srews intot eh windage arm is much smaller in size so it does not block out the view such as this:-


    That a Redfield Model 70 RWH aperture rear sight fitted to a BSA Model E sporting rifle. The fore sight is a 3/32 bead on a ramp.




    Now this is a simpler sporting aperture sight made by Parker-Hale for the BSA Model E ( I have recently acquired a new new condition on to replace this poor example.:-


    It lacks the refinement of the 1/4 Min clicks of the Redfield.


    This was from the sighting in session with the Redfield aperture sight after acquiring and fitting the higher fore sight needed for it and was shot with HXP 69 Surplus .303 ammunition.

    May I suggest that you acquire a copy of the book by Townsend Whelan called "The Hunting Rifle" ISBN: 0-935632-13-1

    It not only shows them but explains there use and adjustment .

    This is a fine example of English Express Iron sights and actually they provide a very good sight picture:-


    They are a far cry from the normal factory fitted irons found on most sporting rifles.

    Now in answer to the OP's question ..................... Nope not yet but I am working on it and in fact have fitted Refield 57 SME Aperture sight with a 0.080" hunting aperture disc fitted to a BSA 1st Pattern Monarch in 270 Win (BSA Drilled & Tapped the side of the action to take such sights) but have not sighted this one in yet as I need to get it moved on my FAC from collection only to be able to actually shoot it . My .270 Win BSA Majestic Fetherweight has a Parker-Hale 6EH sporting aperture rear sight fitted but with the windage arm removed so the 3-9x42 Lisenfeld scope can be fitted and used. The 6EH is sighted in and removing the windage arm with the actual aperture in it does not effect is setting.

    The main thing is that I feel that I need a bit more practice using the sperture sights before I consider serious hunting with them. Another stumbling block is that as I only go on let days and outings the guide/stalker often has reservations about one hunting with an iron sighted rifle. The last time I broached this subject when making a booking although he just said well you will handicapping your self the tone of voice said more ....................... much more so I used the scope as even though your a paying client one must also respect the providers wishes and expectations.

    It's funny that this subject came up today as it seems it's the clubs annual iron sighted full bore rifle comp tomorrow so I will get to shoot with the aperture sights for a reason .

    Although I have not done so as yet I will be drilling and tapping the action of one of the Parker-Hale rifles to accept a Lyman 57 SME aperture rear sight but have not made up my mind which one as yet. As I have an open slot for a .243 perhaps that might be the candidate? Although I did see a very nice NEW rifle at the Shooting Show at Newark it was a 6mm Remington and I already have the dies etc for 6mm Remington but it didn't have any irons on it.
    God! I love this guy! You can come hunt with me any time, BH!
    I have no less than a dozen rifles with aperture sights and if you have reasonable eye-sight they will deliver scope like accuracy. I have killed many deer with open sights; the first being with a Model 1894 Winchester 30-30 shot at about 70 yards and killed outright. I grew up with "iron" sights of all kinds and learned to shoot with them. It is the only way to teach kids how to shoot, in my opinion. My favorite 7x57 hunting rifle sports a Redfield front sight and Receiver (aperture) sight as well as a 4X scope. The Redfield receiver sight has a button you can depress and lift out the top part of the sight leaving the base in place. I keep this in my knapsack along with a small screw-driver. If my scope gets damaged, I can remove it and the bases, and then slip in the top half of the receiver sight and be ready to hunt again. The top slide has a small set-screw that acts as a vertical stop so you retain your zero when replaced. It's a nice arrangement.~Muir

    PS: Drill and tap both of them! That's what plug screws are for!


    This is six shots from my 30-40 Krag-Jorgensen at 100M using a receiver sight.
    Last edited by Muir; 13-03-2010 at 14:54.

  10. #10
    I learned with open sights on an old bsa 22 and a majestic 22hornet which I shot my 1st roe and red with [oops]. I know where you are coming from re hunting rather than "culling"

    I had a bit of an epiphany re shooting a few years ago regarding the shooting I did in my spare time.

    Bipod/good scope etc are excellent and nessessary when killing deer [oops culling] but in my mind quite removed from the "hunting" experience.

    I took the scope of my h&h 270 this year and shot 2 stags[2 diferent stalks] with it both at about 60 - 70 yrds on the open hill and dragged them down to the pony, I only took my glass , no bino's. I must admit it was brilliant, the rifle handles so much better without a scope and is a delight to carry and look at.

    I'm not advocating this as the norm , but open sights are accurate especially when used at moderat ranges where the stalking is the key.

    I'd rather shoot woodcock over pointers than shoot driven pheasants and go wildfowling than spotlight now, I'm lucky to have the oportunity to have nearly sickened my self with shooting.

    Next year I'm hoping to have a go with black powder, any one else here partake? I

Similar Threads

  1. Red Deer Observe Iron Curtain!
    By paul k in forum Deer Stalking General
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: 23-04-2014, 19:51
  2. Introducint the next generation - open sights or scopes
    By Heym SR20 in forum Deer Stalking General
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 12-03-2010, 19:02

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •