police contradictions

Mungo

Well-Known Member
I'd appreciate opinions on this.

A colleague of mine is applying for his FAC.

He lives in rented accomodation, so cannot install his own cabinet.

He asked if he could store his rifle in mine.

So I emailed the police to ask if this was acceptable, and exactly how this would need to be recorded on out respective FACs.

The return email said that would be fine - I would just need to apply for a variation to add his rifle (.22LR) to my FAC. Under reason, I was to put 'storage for colleague'.

So we submitted our applications. And then the FEO phoned up and told me that was unnacceptable. I could not get a variation to add an additional .22LR to my ticket because storage for colleague was not good reason. We must get a separate cabinet installed in my house for his rifle.

Foolishly, perhaps, I agreed, and that;s how it will be.

But the more I think about it, the more angry I get. What would have been the best reaction here?
 
I'd appreciate opinions on this.

A colleague of mine is applying for his FAC.

He lives in rented accomodation, so cannot install his own cabinet.

He asked if he could store his rifle in mine.

So I emailed the police to ask if this was acceptable, and exactly how this would need to be recorded on out respective FACs.

The return email said that would be fine - I would just need to apply for a variation to add his rifle (.22LR) to my FAC. Under reason, I was to put 'storage for colleague'.

So we submitted our applications. And then the FEO phoned up and told me that was unnacceptable. I could not get a variation to add an additional .22LR to my ticket because storage for colleague was not good reason. We must get a separate cabinet installed in my house for his rifle.

Foolishly, perhaps, I agreed, and that;s how it will be.

But the more I think about it, the more angry I get. What would have been the best reaction here?


You have already done the right thing (by agreeing to the installation of an additional cabinet to be used exclusively by your friend) since you clearly failed to provide "good reason" for possession of an additional .22

What's not to understand?
 
You have already done the right thing (by agreeing to the installation of an additional cabinet to be used exclusively by your friend) since you clearly failed to provide "good reason" for possession of an additional .22

What's not to understand?
How about the verbal garbage of the original advice from those who should know better?
 
While a friend of mine was working abroad i had a variation on mine to store his 22 243 and 270. TVP had no problem issuing it
 
Um... did you miss something? I have in writing from them advice that storage for a colleague was good reason.

So why are you canvassing for opinions? ... Incidentally, why is keeping them for your "colleague" a good reason? Why can't he keep his own property at his own, rented, address?

I am also intrigued by your description of this third party... not a friend but "colleague". I tend to wonder what has been made of that distinction by others.
 
Um... did you miss something? I have in writing from them advice that storage for a colleague was good reason.
You have it in black and white, I'd fire the email back at them, asking if there has been a change of policy since you were reliably informed by that email that it was fine, and then ask to have, in writing, the exact reason why they have refused the variation based on the advice you were given.
Though, personally, I think a seperate safe is the better option, then only your friend has access to it, relieving you of any responsibility, also, as long as you are happy for him to have a key for your house too, then he doesn't need to rely on you being there everytime he needs to access it.


Regards
​Pete
 
So why are you canvassing for opinions?

To vent my spleen, and because I'm genuinely curious about whether there was a better way for this to have been handled

[/QUOTE]... Incidentally, why is keeping them for your "colleague" a good reason? [/QUOTE]

You are a deliberately obtuse man, aren't you? I never set out to prove that it was a good reason: I wrote to the police asking them for advice on the sitiation, and they wrote back telling me that storage for a colleague was what I needed to put on my application as reason to posess. At the pont, it seemed like a perfectly sensible reason: 2 people sharing one cabinet, therefore the one with the keys needs to have the relevant firearms on his FAC.

[/QUOTE] Why can't he keep his own property at his own, rented, address? [/QUOTE]

Landlord won't let him keep firearms on the property.

[/QUOTE] I am also intrigued by your description of this third party... not a friend but "colleague". I tend to wonder what has been made of that distinction by others.[/QUOTE]

It was the word I used in the application. He is a work colleague who has become a close friend.

You're a very annoying man, you know that?
 
So I emailed the police to ask if this was acceptable, and exactly how this would need to be recorded on out respective FACs.

The return email said that would be fine - I would just need to apply for a variation to add his rifle (.22LR) to my FAC. Under reason, I was to put 'storage for colleague'.

And then the FEO phoned up and told me that was unnacceptable.

Who was that from? the FLD or station sgt??

I ask because 5 years ago the station sgt at a rural nick told my boss that there was no need for him to speak to the police re me shooting deer on his land.

The reason given was that as the landowner he could give permission to anyone he wanted and the police didn't need to be involved :eek::doh:

Oh how my FEO laughed at that:lol:
 
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To vent my spleen, and because I'm genuinely curious about whether there was a better way for this to have been handled
Incidentally, why is keeping them for your "colleague" a good reason? [/QUOTE]

You are a deliberately obtuse man, aren't you? I never set out to prove that it was a good reason: I wrote to the police asking them for advice on the sitiation, and they wrote back telling me that storage for a colleague was what I needed to put on my application as reason to posess. At the pont, it seemed like a perfectly sensible reason: 2 people sharing one cabinet, therefore the one with the keys needs to have the relevant firearms on his FAC.

[/QUOTE] Why can't he keep his own property at his own, rented, address? [/QUOTE]

Landlord won't let him keep firearms on the property.

[/QUOTE] I am also intrigued by your description of this third party... not a friend but "colleague". I tend to wonder what has been made of that distinction by others.[/QUOTE]

It was the word I used in the application. He is a work colleague who has become a close friend.

You're a very annoying man, you know that?[/QUOTE]


Careful! ... deep breaths... count to ten... :D

Then ask your questions where they should be asked... Down at Fettes Ave.

Personally, I don't see what business it is of the landlord's... I'd love to read the lease that discriminates against a tenant's human rights, to pursue lawful interest and take reasonable steps (neigh meet statutory requirement, in this instance) to safeguard his own possessions within his own home in the same manner anyone else might, who was not a tenant of his.

By the way, I still think (as annoying as this may sound, for which I apologise, reservedly :D) possession "because it's your colleagues stuff" is very flimsy "good reason" and I even no other's who do this... :rolleyes: How annoyiing is that?
 
Who was that from? the FLD or station sgt??

I ask because 5 years ago the station sgt at a rural nick told my boss that there was no need for him to speak to the police re me shooting deer on his land.

The reason given was that as the landowner he could give permission to anyone he wanted and the police didn't need to be involved :eek::doh:

Oh how my FEO laughed at that:lol:

The joke being that... it's true.

The problem being... it's not the farmer who may have "conditions" on his FAC.
 
By the way, I still think (as annoying as this may sound, for which I apologise, reservedly :D) possession "because it's your colleagues stuff" is very flimsy "good reason" and I even no other's who do this... :rolleyes: How annoyiing is that?

Much as it irks me to agree, I think you're right, at least in certain contexts.

For instance, I don't think it would be good reason to get an FAC in the first place.

However, once it has been deemed appropriate for me to own a firearm, it seems odd to say it's unacceptable for someone else to store a gun in my safe. At least one in a calibre for which I already have permission.
 
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Much as it irks me to agree, I think you're right, at least in certain contexts.

For instance, I don't think it would be good reason to get an FAC in the first place.

However, once it has been deemed appropriate for me to own a firearm, it seems odd to say it's unacceptable for someone else to store a gun in my safe. At least one in a calibre for which I already have permission.

You're not really very "irked" or you'd have had a go at me for the stack of typos... :D

Honestly, I think you have a bundle of issues to sort out.

If it was me I'd arrange a visit to Fettes, accompanied by your colleague and with your email in hand, but I'd speak to your colleague as a first step.
 
Who was that from? the FLD or station sgt??

I ask because 5 years ago the station sgt at a rural nick told my boss that there was no need for him to speak to the police re me shooting deer on his land.

The reason given was that as the landowner he could give permission to anyone he wanted and the police didn't need to be involved :eek::doh:

Oh how my FEO laughed at that:lol:

You laughed... why?

The station Sgt was perfectly correct...

If a local landowner says I can shoot Deer on his land, neither the landowner or I need to inform the police... I can just go and shoot deer on his land!
 
You're not really very "irked" or you'd have had a go at me for the stack of typos... :D.

I make so many of them that I barely notice them - usually just assume that when it gets bad, someone's in a hurry or using a touch screen.

Now if this were a formal exchange of emails, I'd assume you were a chin dribbling illiterate... ;)
 
in essex you both would need the same rifles on their cert's ie : yours on his fac aswell as his on your fac ( hope you get the drift ) as access to safe would put the other chap and you in the crap as he is not allowed access to your firearms or keys ?? with out the above, this also would mean he would have access to your home, not likely i hear you cry ?? i have done this in the past for mates serving overseas but no access to other fac holder was given to my safes , i would transport his/our rifle to and from the range this was no problem for all concerned . :tiphat:
 
in essex you both would need the same rifles on their cert's ie : yours on his fac aswell as his on your fac ( hope you get the drift ) as access to safe would put the other chap and you in the crap as he is not allowed access to your firearms or keys ?? with out the above, this also would mean he would have access to your home, not likely i hear you cry ?? i have done this in the past for mates serving overseas but no access to other fac holder was given to my safes , i would transport his/our rifle to and from the range this was no problem for all concerned . :tiphat:

My son and I do exactly this.

I'm sure we could come up with a good reason for a second .22lr (if the need arose) but currently we're happy with sharing "my" guns as they are. My son lives in Edinburgh too Mungo... :D... but I don't.
 
My son and I do exactly this.

I'm sure we could come up with a good reason for a second .22lr (if the need arose) but currently we're happy with sharing "my" guns as they are. My son lives in Edinburgh too Mungo... :D... but I don't.

If I understand correctly, you each have an FAC that lists the same guns? Are there two of each (yours and his), or just one set, each listed on both FACs?

If the former, that (as you might expect) seriously vexes me...
 
You laughed... why?

The station Sgt was perfectly correct...

If a local landowner says I can shoot Deer on his land, neither the landowner or I need to inform the police... I can just go and shoot deer on his land!

Where does it say I laughed? it was the FEO who laughed - and incidently refused to clear the land when he inspected it

The sgt was correct to a point but my boss , the landowner, stood infront of him with my proposed management plan and asked if the land was cleared for deer to be shot, therefore the sgt gave an incorrect/ incomplete response.
 
i am with Tamus, but i am the son.

the fac have all the guns on them and we both have a key to the safes. ours was the idea of the FEO. we have not had many issues, only when applying for new firearms.

we also have a rifle shared with another person who has it on there cert to ( they are in other police district).

If i was you mungo. i would wait till the 1st then go in and tell them. one police force one set of rules.

Andy7mm
 
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