.243 vs .25-06 ??

nico243

Active Member
#1
Well I have just ordered a new HOWA Varmint in .243, but I am now wondering whether or not a .25-06 would really be the better/more versatile option???
I do already have and use a .308 for bigger stuff (and everything else ;) )
I am after the .243 as a flatter shooting foxer (.308 is a tad loopy @ 150grns) and as a stalking round for mainly Munties and Roe.
I did seriously consider varying my old .243 for a .25-06 a few years back but it was just one of those many things I didn't get round to doing and once the rifle was sold I just kept the .243 slot floating, I suppose the short action .243 will allow a .243Ackley Improved tube to be added at a later date.... what do you chaps reckon, bearing in mind I already have a .308, would you change the .243 slot to a .25-06 or just stick with .243..............??? :???: :???:
 

nuttyspaniel

Well-Known Member
#2
In short no mate I would keep the 243 amd 308. I was told by an old friend why get rid of my 308 and get a 222!! My answer was I wanted a smaller caliber and I loved my 243! His reply was with the 243 and 308 there wasnt anything on the brittish mainland I couldnt shoot and even if the notion was to take me I could take it over to africa if I wanted!!! I didnt listen and rue getting snot of the 308 and buying the 222 it lay in the cupboard and was never used as I got a bit of ground with some reds on it and the 222 was no use over there except for foxey and no way was I going to go over with the 222 and have to wave at a red or shout bang!!! I have now this very week traded my 243 and 222 in for a 25-06 as I am for ever getting more red stalking through good friends. Now if I kept the 308 I would also still have my sako 243 which was a wrench getting rid of but no way could I afford a third rifle even the £400 cash I would need to have found for the 25-06!!

cheers
nutty
 
S

ssgpiv

Guest
#3
nico243. Try some sako 123grain in the .308. It may give you a slightly different perspective.
 

Thar

Well-Known Member
#4
Don't know about a 123gn Sako head but if you load it with a 130gn Hornady head and drive it to the max' that 308 will of dropped a 1/3 more and have a hundred ft lbs of energy less at 300yrds than a 100gn 25-06 will. :eek:

Best rgds

Thar
 
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ssgpiv

Guest
#5
Excellent. So the 25-06 is flatter at a distance that you wont be shooting anything at, which would also make the energy uplift pointless. As a consequence of ordering these rounds for me, two local RFD's now sell more of these than any other .308 ammunition. Just thought that £20 of ammo might be worth trying.
 

Thar

Well-Known Member
#6
ssgpiv said:
Excellent. So the 25-06 is flatter at a distance that you wont be shooting anything at,
And flatter at distance you will be shooting at,(300yrds too far?) most serious stalkers hand load. ;)

PS I don’t own a 308 or a 25-06, just pointing out the facts, do the facts upset you :???:

Best rgds

Thar
 
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ssgpiv

Guest
#8
Hi Thar. Why is it that most serious stalkers handload. No not upset at all. I like the look of the balistics of the 25-06 just not sure that the flatter shooting harder hitting round, would require the effort and cost of a change of rifle. Seems quite alot of expense for little benefit.
 

Thar

Well-Known Member
#10
ssgpiv said:
Hi Thar. would require the effort and cost of a change of rifle. Seems quite alot of expense for little benefit.
I posted not to try and convince you to change the rifle that you own.

The point I was trying to emphasize was if you asked most stalkers which round hits harder at 100yrds a 130gn 308 bullet or say a 117gn 25-06 bullet (is 100yrds more like the range you would shoot deer at?) then most would say the 308 would produce more energy, but they would be wrong, .308:-2076 ft-lbs, 25-06:- 2113 ft-lbs. and as you increase the range the better ballistics of the 25-06 just open the advantage up. Even though at the muzzle the 308 produces more energy.

I have used 130gn in my old 308 and the theory I found was backed up by results on the range.

In reality in the woods there is a lot more to putting a deer in the larder than the theoretical advantage of one caliber over another, but if you are looking for a new rifle then sometimes a bit of home work can be enlightening.

Remember if events had taken a different course the British military would of dropped the .30cal back in 1914, then they tried to drop it in 1955 but the Yanks wanted a .30 cal so that is what NATO got. If they had got there wish and the British army had used a 270/7mm rifle for the past 85 years were do you think the 308 would be today? ;)

Best rgds

Thar
 
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ssgpiv

Guest
#11
Hi thar, you certainly have an interesting point there. I always fancied a 25-06 but just never got around to it. Would'nt mind knowing why you think most serious stalkers handload. Is that down to cost do you think or your uncertainty that manufactured ammunition will group at the distance that you need them to.
 

Duncs

Well-Known Member
#12
Well I think a little poll for hand loading or not would be very interesting. I for one would say serious rifle persons hand load, stalkers can live with an inch and a half group at 150 yards. I have always said the increased accuracy might be good for hitting foxes at 300+ but as a stalker I prefere to get close and aim for a larger target.
 

Thar

Well-Known Member
#13
ssgpiv said:
Hi thar, Would'nt mind knowing why you think most serious stalkers handload. Is that down to cost do you think or your uncertainty that manufactured ammunition will group at the distance that you need them to.
I made that comment because out of my group of friends and fellow stalkers I can only think of a couple that don’t home load. A poll might be interesting to see if my experience is representative.

Why people reload:- I guess is down to a lot of things, I am sure some do it as a hobby in it’s self, and others because there mates do and it is the done thing to do. ;) Whether most stalkers can replicate the accuracy there home loads are capable of on the range in the field is a another thing, but you never hear anybody complain “this bloody rifle is just too accurate”. :D :D

If you are going to shoot a non-mainstream calibre or run your common the garden calibre on unusual bullet weights like 123gn 308s (how many other gun shops stock them? ;) ) then you will have little choice but to home load.

Best rgds

Thar
 
S

ssgpiv

Guest
#15
I do entirely agree with doing some research though, so I thought you might be interested to read the info I picked off a website when I first bought my .308. It struck me that I could spend cold wet nights handloading or I could read what others had done and see if that satisfied my needs. I figured that 5 shots into .71 of an inch would probably suffice. I ought to say I have not replicated it but it is very accurate, even with me shooting it.

'Here is another super 5-shot group. It was fired by Niko Visuri of Finland at 100 m with Steyr Scout .308 Jeff Cooper package and measured (18 mm). Ammunition was Sako "Range" .308 Win Ammo, #120A (123 grs bullet with a listed muzzle velocity of 900 m/s (2950 f/s)'.
 

Duncs

Well-Known Member
#16
Thar.....And flatter at distance you will be shooting at,(300yrds too far?) most serious stalkers hand load.

What is the definition of a serious stalker? I am intrigued.
 

stone

Well-Known Member
#17
Duncs said:
What is the definition of a serious stalker? I am intrigued.
this was debated in ' .270 love it or hate it' page 3 (rifle and calibres)
Macnab has the answer :evil:
sorry Macnab could not resist :lol: :lol:
 

swampy

Account Suspended
#18
Sorry to sound like an old stick in the mud, but to put a different slant on it. a 150 gr soft point spitzer at 2950 fps from a .308 win is a great deer round, Flat enough shooting not massively damaging, has great knock over ability and available in lots of places without reloading. Of course if you just want a new rifle then that is more than reasonable. I would go for the 2506 becuase it will fire a 120gr bullet at 3000 + loads of sectional density flat shooting. The 243 is ,in my opinion, a great foxing round but not a great deer round. i have been less impressed with my 243's knock over ability. I know there are lots of different variables, i also know we all have strong opinions on this. Hell... i have 3 deer rifles! I reckon that my 7mm08 is great, i reckon my .30-06 is great i am not so happy with my 243.... but sometimes i like to use it.

steve
 

Thar

Well-Known Member
#19
Duncs said:
What is the definition of a serious stalker? I am intrigued.
Difficult one I am not sure who would qualify to make that judgment.

In my mind and others may well disagree and there may be exceptions but I would class anybody that has access to there own land including syndicate members or most of us who come on to these sites.

Pro’s are another class I feel.

Just my definition but others might think different. Who do you think is a serious stalker?

Best rgds

Thar
 

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