6.5 x 284, 7 x 284

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Highlander

Well-Known Member
6.5 - a popular f-class, target calibre.
7 - a more recent resurrection of an old calibre due to better barrel life.

Anyone had any experiences as deer calibres?
 

Ronin

Distinguished Member
Er the 284 Win has been around since 1963, it is an excellent deer calibre.

This has been used as a medium sized deer rifle (for medium sized deer) in the states for years and gives similar ballistics to the 270 but with the greater choice of 7mm bullets.

The 6.5x284 has been around for maybe ten years, it started life as a wildcat round used by benchresters and F class shooters in the states and laterly so over here - ive used one for stalking with for 6 maybe 7 years, it is very good and ive shot everything up to and including large reds with it.

Both cartridges require a long action (unless you intend to use lightweight bullets)

My preferance is with the 6.5x284 as I have WSM's in 7mm.

The 6.5x284 is hard on barrels, if you load it to extreme velocity, the 284 Win is not.

Thats my 2p :lol:
 

Muir

Well-Known Member
There was a gunsmith at Charlie's Sporting Goods in Albuquerque, New Mexico (USA) that was necking the 284 to 6.5 and 6mm in the late 60's / early seventies. The 6-284 was his signature cartridge. I don't remember the smith's name but I remember the shop because the owners brother was a US Senator.~Muir
 

Ronin

Distinguished Member
He may well have been the first (or one of the first) to give birth to the 6.5x284 - do you know of any other wildcat cartridges he experimented with?

(find this subject facinating) - don't mean to steal the thread.
 

Muir

Well-Known Member
I don't. (It really bugs me that I don't remember that gunsmiths name! I will make some calls and see if I can dig it up) I'm sure he was hired for some odd wild-catting projects.

Back then, and there, everyone was dabbling in the ridiculous. A gunsmith I was working for had a reamer made for a 300 Winchester Magnum necked to .224 at the behest of a customer. No surprise that the pressures topped 60K to barely achieve 22-250 speeds.

Obviously, he, like others, skipped the bits P.O. Ackley wrote about efficiency, bore capacity, and pressures. All they every got was, "Ooo! 40-degree shoulder=more case capacity! More speed! Right??!"

It cost a lot of folks a lot of money to find out that when you increase case capacity with a given charge, you reduce velocity and pressure. You then need to add more powder to get what you had originally, at the same pressures. Add more powder yet and you get more pressure with questionable velocity gains. I used to refuse requests to chamber rifles in over-bore wild cat cartridges.

But back then, there were new powders just starting to supplant the traditional 3031, 4198, 4320, 4350, 4064, and 4831 powders that were the mainstray of American shooters for so long so everyone wanted to get in on the wildcatting act. I doubt if there is a wildcat that you can think of that hasn't been tried.

Getting back to wildcatting the .284 (sorry about the hijack/rant) there was once a request I had to build a 30/284. The customer was certain that it would be a beefy replacement for the .308 and elk capable. I told him it had been done already and tossed him a primed case from my reloading bench to prove it. He immediately asked to see the rifle it was chambered for so, with as much of a poker-face as I could muster, I handed him a Model 1911 Schmidt-Ruben straight pull military rifle in the original 7.5x55 Swiss chambering. A great idea but 90 years too late.~Muir
 

Highlander

Well-Known Member
Thanks for the input, have put in for a 6.5 x 284. We will await the result, then it will be a case of getting one put together. Any suggestions on who to use, will be gratefully received.

Riflemaker must be in the UK.

Thanks all.
 

Jager SA

Well-Known Member
7mmx284 will get my vote having had/got the 6.5x284 which is being changed to 6.5x47.

The 7mm guise 284 will be a lot less harsh on barrel life and still be a very good Deer calibre, the 7mm-08 is also worth a look, which the most popular cal in New Zealand. :D
 

Jager SA

Well-Known Member
Muir said:
This has gone full circle! 7x284?? You're saying he should just barrel a rifle for .284 Winchester, then??~Muir

7mmx284 is stepped up 6.5x284 with longer barrel life and hard hitting ability. :)
 

Muir

Well-Known Member
silent stalker said:
Muir said:
This has gone full circle! 7x284?? You're saying he should just barrel a rifle for .284 Winchester, then??~Muir

7mmx284 is stepped up 6.5x284 with longer barrel life and hard hitting ability. :)

As Ejg was getting at, "stepped up" to what?? ;) ~Muir
 

Claret_Dabbler

Well-Known Member
I think the problem with the standard 284 is that is was designed for a winchester lever action or Auto loader, and consequently factory ammo was loaded to lower pressures. When compared to 270win and 7rem mag, it was found seriously wanting in velocity.

A similar problem scuppered the 280rem.

However, if you hand load the 284win to its potential, it is a very different beast.
 

Muir

Well-Known Member
Having built rifles for and owned all of the afore mentioned calibers, I was prompted to sit down last night and write a lengthy response. When it was done, I deleted it. Today, I offer a much abridged version.

SAAMI sets the Maximum Allowable Average Pressure for 270 Winchester factory ammo at 52K. The 284 Winchester ammo has a SAAMI/MAAP of 56K. It is actually standardized as a higher pressure load than the 270. The rifles Winchester chambered it in were exceptionally strong and well built: The Model 88 Lever action and the Model 100 Autoloading rifle. I still own a Model 100 and it is a strong gun that is sweet to shoot. So, pressure was never a problem for the Winchesters, nor was the 284 a "low pressure" cartridge.

In bullet weights greater than 130 grains the 284 will meet 270 speeds with many loadings, and when it can't, it comes very close; usually doing so with far less powder and pressure. As always, a greatly ignored facet of shooting and reloading is efficiency. A smaller cartridge that can get within 5% of the maximum speeds of a larger cartridge is dismissed as a "weak sister" when in reality, it will kill the same game, just as handily as the less efficient yet larger round.

The truth of the matter is that any of the cartridges formerly mentioned, in the hands of a good rifleman, will not exhibit a dry spit's worth of difference in the field. My 2-cents worth.~Muir

PS: The 280 is far from "scuppered" and is in the views of those who have shot them, a far superior round to the 270 and far more efficient (there's that word again) than the 7mm Remington Magnum while performing in the same class. Many an elk has fallen to the 7mm Express. ;)
 

irishgun

Well-Known Member
i love reading this kinda stuff ,its all total crap every animal will die not the same as the last one .i had some guys out this week with 300 win mags on sika stags we shot 30 odd stags stags. with shots well placed some ran 100 yards others buckeled .we picked bullets from the skin from the off side ,using B tips 150 or 180 gr im not sure ,but i know my 270 /25.06 would have done the same job .does it matter the animal is killed quick and thats all that matters .....also the 6.5x55 is a sh[t cal for sika it has not the knock down power .i think norma do a 120 B tip for them thank god .most of the fu-k ups iv seen over the years have been with this cal ..if your coming to ireland to shoot sika stags in the rut bring enough gun .im thinking of calling my next dog 6.5
 

irishgun

Well-Known Member
i love reading this kinda stuff ,its all total crap every animal will die not the same as the last one .i had some guys out this week with 300 win mags on sika stags we shot 30 odd stags stags. with shots well placed some ran 100 yards others buckeled .we picked bullets from the skin from the off side ,using B tips 150 or 180 gr im not sure ,but i know my 270 /25.06 would have done the same job .does it matter the animal is killed quick and thats all that matters .....also the 6.5x55 is a sh[t cal for sika it has not the knock down power .i think norma do a 120 B tip for them thank god .most of the fu-k ups iv seen over the years have been with this cal ..if your coming to ireland to shoot sika stags in the rut bring enough gun .im thinking of calling my next dog 6.5
 

ejg

Well-Known Member
Muir, how would you rate the 7-08 compared to the 284 win or 280 rem,
efficiency seems very good. Maybe that is one of those examples of the smaller cartridge.
(Did my letter reach you?)
edi
 
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