a dangerous pastime that will kill femoral artery

widows son

Well-Known Member
Ive posted this topic up that Mudman has posted in top tips .you can read his story below as ive cut and pasted it .

Within your upper leg you have the femoral artery which is about 3/8" 10mm across ,if like mudman you have an accident with a knife.

Accidentally cut this artery by the time you've dialled the number into your phone and got an answer you'll be unconscious or dead .

Ive posted this as there are a great % of us that don't know of these things the bleed out time is about 70 seconds there are very few choices if you cut into this direct pressure is one a tourniquet is another .

Caution at all times


MUDMANS posting
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You know how you are always told to cut away from yourself when using a knife to butcher a deer?

Well its damn good advice, otherwise you may well run the risk of plunging a boning knife into your thigh with a fair degree of force, swearing a great deal, hopping around with your trousers around your ankles for a couple of minutes while you find some form of dressing to stem the quite copious flow of blood. Then driving to the local A&E department, still with trousers around ankles, whilst putting pressure on the wound with the aforementioned dressing. Then having the pleasure of half a dozen stitches to the quite neat cut to the front of your leg. All patched up now but a rather painful lesson learnt.

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jingzy

Well-Known Member
Just to add fuel to the panic, I have been taught in the past that if that artery is severed, unless you can get a hold of it and crimp it, then it is good night vienna. The forces used to be taught to use the weight of a man using his boot above the cut to stem the flow, that means there has to be 2 of you around :eek: , to put on a tourniquet I think is almost impossible due to the amount of flesh around it.

Still, I am no expert and no doctor, and if at the end of the day it was to happen, you will try anything to stop the flow. Always keep a cork in your pocket. :lol:

J
 

Pete E

Well-Known Member
I was about to post something along the lines of Jinzy...The problem is that direct pressure is often ineffective because the bleeding artery can be deep within the thigh.

After applying direct pressure, at first glance the flow of blood appears to be stopped, but infact what is happening is continued internal bleeding.

From a first aid perspective, direct presseure is the obvious first thing to do, followed by indirect pressure in the groin area. But these are really only holding measures until a touriquet can be applied and even that sometimes only slows blood loss rather than stopping it......
 

devon deer stalker

Well-Known Member
From what i understand if you cut that artery its the end,period.
Just be careful out there, take a look at this picture, http://i307.photobucket.com/albums/nn305/teignghost/IMG_2565.jpg god knows how i managed it but the lights had fused in the outhouse and i was rushing.
Cut straight through 2 tendons,damaged the nerve and missed the radial artery by 5mm,result was 3 months off work and it will never be the same again.
The farmer has just bought me a chain link glove for xmas!
Richard
 

JAYB

Administrator
Site Staff
That's the artery that matadors die from when they get gored.

That's why I packed up bull fighting :eek: :eek:

and before anyone else says it, it was not in order to take up Bulls#**ing :D :D

John
 

nell

Well-Known Member
Having spent most of my working life in slaughterhouses you can imagine i have seen all manner of injuries, mostly cuts,the original post is a fine piece of advice ALWAYS CUT AWAY from yourself

NELL
 

Monkey Spanker

Well-Known Member
Before we all get too scared and pack up stalking I think we need to get a bit of reality here. Firstly, you have to be doing a pretty violent and wild gralloch to manage to sever a main artery in you inner thigh! :eek:
What we do is by its nature dangerous just by the fact that we are out in all weathers, miles from anywhere and usually alone. We climb shabby old highseats, annoy large animals with sharp head-gear, and lets not forget crawling around with large calibre rifles.
A risk assessment puts it in the realms of 'pretty high risk'.
However, we can help matters by being prepared for the worst and I'm not talking wearing chain mail trousers here.
Just a mobile phone is essential. However it is useless if you don't know exactly where you are! I carry a small GPS which gives me a 10 figure grid reference and cost me £20. If you are out on the hill carry a goretex bivvy bag, First aid kit and basic survival equipment. Just these few simple things weigh a couple of pounds but will potentially save your life one day (or someone elses!). They might not be of use if you insist on severing major arteries or shooting yourself though but it might just be enough to give the authorities a clue as to the position of the deceased!! :lol:
Take Care!
 

widows son

Well-Known Member
Guys heres a better one changing avatar to doom and gloom,

I seen one a few years ago which I had to act very prompt on whilst cross a clear fell with another stalker he lost his footing while standing on a cut stump end slipped in it the splinter went right through his leg coming out at his buttock .

It was a tree that had been partly felled leaving a row of up standing splinters , it was a chopper job to the hospital no major arteries were cut ,he had a right sore arse for a while .not the type of splinter you pull out with your teeth .

As Monkey spanker said thats what risk assessments are all about
 

devilishdave

Well-Known Member
Tourniquet

I carry a tourniquet and a hydrostatic bandage when out and about stalking just in case I or some one else suffers what could become a catastrophic bleed. When using knives and guns properly it should never happen but it might!!
 

devilishdave

Well-Known Member
Tourniquet

I carry a tourniquet and a hydrostatic bandage when out and about stalking just in case I or some one else suffers what could become a catastrophic bleed. When using knives and guns properly it should never happen but it might!!
 

mudman

Well-Known Member
Luckily for me I managed to stab myself more to the outside of my thigh than the inside and it was really nothing more than a flesh wound. I was rushing to get away and had just dropped off a gralloched doe into the estate larder. As an after thought I thought I should really complete the larder work as it should only take ten minutes. I had sawed through the breast bone but still had the last few inches at the front of the chest to split so I tried to cut down through the area with the boning knife. It took a good bit of force then gave in a split second and the rest is history. Normally there are a few people around but it was luch time and yard was deserted, also even though in a village there was no mobile reception so if the wound had been particularily serious then the whole situation could have been nasty. I think what helped slightly was I was wearing a thick pair of lined stalking trousers with a pair of moleskins underneath (cold morning!) so there was a thicker than normal layer of clothing to cut through.

The worse consequence was that I had to cancel a two day stalking trip for the beginning of this week.
 

IanF

Well-Known Member
Muddy

A worthwhile reminder. I used to do a bit of butchery and when scoring a pork joint with a boning knife - the wallet always went into the front pocket as anti stab protection.

Rgds Ian
 

docholiday

Well-Known Member
Posted: Wed Feb 11, 2009 6:04 pm Post subject:

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Before we all get too scared and pack up stalking I think we need to get a bit of reality here. Firstly, you have to be doing a pretty violent and wild gralloch to manage to sever a main artery in you inner thigh!
What we do is by its nature dangerous just by the fact that we are out in all weathers, miles from anywhere and usually alone. We climb shabby old highseats, annoy large animals with sharp head-gear, and lets not forget crawling around with large calibre rifles.

Monkey spanner says above, but I am afraid he is incorrect, as a Doc I can assure you it is a commen injury among butchers, if there are any on here I am sure they will confirm, only way to avoid is always cut away, dont think it cant happen. it can and does, ok for me though they are always dead before they get to A and E
Doc
 

Monkey Spanker

Well-Known Member
I'm not convinced that you are really a Doctor from that last post Doc? :rolleyes:
Or have you had a couple of "medicinal" beers tonight? :lol:
 

Tom270

Well-Known Member
arterial bleeds

Fortunately arterial bleeds are relatively rare. Having said that butchery is probably amongst one of the commonest causes (carpet fitters can also do a reasonably good job) due to a long sharp blade that will reach the depth required especially when cutting a tough joint or sinew that gives unexpectedly.
The best advice as already said cut away from yourself and don,t be tempted to make that little odd cut that so often goes wrong.
Once cut apply very firm unrelenting direct pressure to the site of bleeding, dont move around.
There is a military style tornequet available from SP Services for a few pounds. I am not a fan of tornequets and they generally have no use in first aid. However if the wound is sufficiently down the leg to get one on and blood is spurting out good style, then I guess these are the circumstances to use one.
The general rules for the treatment of bleeding is lower,raise, look and press. Lay patient down, head down hill, lift limb above level of heart, if possible, it may not be possible to elevate and get enough pressure on to stem the flow ,check nothing stuck in wound, NEVER pull the knife out. Apply direct pressure.
To find the pressure point to compress, you can feel deep in your own groin for the femoral pulse. Right in the crack where the leg joins the trunk. Do it now, well before you need it its harder than you think, there is one one each side, one to each leg. This again can be where the foot or buched up knuckles come into play. If you are alone your chances are minimal, even a small artery leaks a lot of blood fast.
Your location is vital, state clearly you have cut an artery,with uncontrolled bleeding.
Your mate can apply pressure to site of bleeding and apply pressure to femoral artery, Use a shirt etc as a dressing pad, even rope from your stalking bag can make a bandage or tornequet.
Once you have made 999 call do not make other calls unless directly related to your immediate rescue. Keep the phone free.we may need to call you back for directions or to ask you callout etc.
Cheers Tom paramedic
 

widows son

Well-Known Member
Good stuff Tom ,Just one thing the tourniquet if you must use one
(last resort ),
must be released every 15 minutes ,in the event there are two of you and the person must leave the causality write where possible on there fore head when the tourniquet was applied ,
(the time)
this could just save there limb if found unconscious as this is not a lesson in emergency medicine , I'll leave it there a little knowledge can be dangerous as no knowledge at all .

The word KISS comes to mind in situations like these.

Keep It Simple Stupid .
 

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