Anyone for a new Defender ?

Heym SR20

Well-Known Member
Land Cruisers are really good tough vehicles with big strong engines, suspensions etc but:

They are heavy so when they do get stuck they get properly stuck

They drink fuel

Their suspension is hard. Okish when fully laden, but the old coil sprung defender had a much better and more comfortable chassis - it was just let down by driving position and general cabin layout thats ok if you are all 5ft tall.
 

Hornet 6

Well-Known Member
Try this for £10-13K plus postage from India, or drive it back to UK yourself (RHD).
As sold in India. Looks to be based on the old G MB platform I was a body designer on the G so looks good to me 4x coils 2x locking diffs Mercedes engine. How cam merc justify £100K using similar amount of material?
Wow, drive it back from India, would it make it ?
If the newer Indian built Enfield 500's are anything to go by, no it wouldn't make it, the build quality is rubbish, as is quality control.
Indian built mechanical stuff in general is crap, I mean who the hell builds bearings from unhardened steel, even worse after failure
we actually couldn't harden the steel to an executable level.

Neil.
 

Bavarianbrit

Well-Known Member
hardly worth the effort of a body designer for what amounts to a box on wheels much the same as all the other boxes on wheels, still kept you off the streets eh. :rofl:
looks like a 4 year olds drawing of a vehicle.
I did the engineering solutions. Stylist (who stole the name designer from our branch) are responsible for the shapes. BTW they all attend only two design schools worldwide either the London college of art or the California school in LA which was featured in the Clint Eastwood film In the Line of Fire.
That"s why all the cars look the same today. Lord Austin/William Lyons types are long gone.
 

Bavarianbrit

Well-Known Member
Wow, drive it back from India, would it make it ?
If the newer Indian built Enfield 500's are anything to go by, no it wouldn't make it, the build quality is rubbish, as is quality control.
Indian built mechanical stuff in general is crap, I mean who the hell builds bearings from unhardened steel, even worse after failure
we actually couldn't harden the steel to an executable level.

Neil.
Still happy with my Tata Xenon pickup.
 

riddick

Well-Known Member
I did the engineering solutions. Stylist (who stole the name designer from our branch) are responsible for the shapes. BTW they all attend only two design schools worldwide either the London college of art or the California school in LA which was featured in the Clint Eastwood film In the Line of Fire.
That"s why all the cars look the same today. Lord Austin/William Lyons types are long gone.
Quote; " I was a body designer on the G so looks good to me";quote..
and then,
quote; "I did the engineering solutions. Stylist (who stole the name designer from our branch) are responsible for the shapes." ;quote

which was it?

fascinating, who chose the cheese they made the mechanical parts from?
I was under the impression that cars all look the same today because having discovered which shape works best in the wind tunnel the best most manufacturers chose to follow suit, well, that and the complete lack of taste and talent of the vast majority of them. very little in cars grabs the attention these days, they all look the same, perform about the same, fall apart the same, and cost way more than they are worth.
I fail to see the point in striving to save fuel to lesson carbon emissions and then having to replace the entire car in a few short years, resulting in another pile of plastic laden fault enhanced sh1t to roll out the door. while the world fills with waste. still I guess it keeps the kids happy,,, oh no wait,,, ;) :rofl:
 
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Pedro

Well-Known Member
The teens and 20-somethings of today blame us for the state of the world. But my generation simply didn't use one-use plastics. We maybe had a Bic biro and a ruler made of plastic and a few toys in our youth. Bags for groceries were always re-usable or paper. Or we used the cardboard boxes they came to the shop in. Remember the piles of boxes just past the tills? Our milk came in reusable containers (milk bottles) and a pair of jeans might did for 5 years and various siblings. Butchers were all local, as were vegetable supplies. Ready-made meals were a novelty (usually dried up Indians or Chinese food that tasted like cardboard), there was one car tops for each family and public transport was actually used.

The consumer society of today is fuelled by TODAYS youth and young adults, all of whom need a smart phone, tablet, car, latest fashion and food that goes "ping" to tell you it's ready. Instant everything. So don't blame the oldies for today. I'm not even going to go down the route of their grandfathers and what they did!! but, it seems, it's the oldies that'll have to remedy things.

Anyway - sorry that's veered pretty well of thread. So I'll stop. As for the new Defender, yes it has veered away from the old one in a lot of ways, but hang on. The old one cost an arm and a leg too and kept it's price. The new one promises to be able to do what the old one did off-road (more or less) but the new one promises to be a bit more comfortable (not too hard to achieve that). Yes, it's full of electronic gizmos rather than levers and sticks, but that's the way things have gone everywhere. Frankly, most farmers' Defenders are vehicles of a certain age anyway. I bet that if we were to fast forward 20 years or so, a fair proportion of the new ones will be earning their keep in farm yards.
 

potshotpat

Well-Known Member
The teens and 20-somethings of today blame us for the state of the world. But my generation simply didn't use one-use plastics. We maybe had a Bic biro and a ruler made of plastic and a few toys in our youth. Bags for groceries were always re-usable or paper. Or we used the cardboard boxes they came to the shop in. Remember the piles of boxes just past the tills? Our milk came in reusable containers (milk bottles) and a pair of jeans might did for 5 years and various siblings. Butchers were all local, as were vegetable supplies. Ready-made meals were a novelty (usually dried up Indians or Chinese food that tasted like cardboard), there was one car tops for each family and public transport was actually used.

The consumer society of today is fuelled by TODAYS youth and young adults, all of whom need a smart phone, tablet, car, latest fashion and food that goes "ping" to tell you it's ready. Instant everything. So don't blame the oldies for today. I'm not even going to go down the route of their grandfathers and what they did!! but, it seems, it's the oldies that'll have to remedy things.

Anyway - sorry that's veered pretty well of thread. So I'll stop. As for the new Defender, yes it has veered away from the old one in a lot of ways, but hang on. The old one cost an arm and a leg too and kept it's price. The new one promises to be able to do what the old one did off-road (more or less) but the new one promises to be a bit more comfortable (not too hard to achieve that). Yes, it's full of electronic gizmos rather than levers and sticks, but that's the way things have gone everywhere. Frankly, most farmers' Defenders are vehicles of a certain age anyway. I bet that if we were to fast forward 20 years or so, a fair proportion of the new ones will be earning their keep in farm yards.
20 years from now, the new model Landrovers still being used on farms. Well maybe their tyres on the silage clamps. :norty:
 

jer

Well-Known Member
The teens and 20-somethings of today blame us for the state of the world. But my generation simply didn't use one-use plastics. We maybe had a Bic biro and a ruler made of plastic and a few toys in our youth. Bags for groceries were always re-usable or paper. Or we used the cardboard boxes they came to the shop in. Remember the piles of boxes just past the tills? Our milk came in reusable containers (milk bottles) and a pair of jeans might last 5 years. Butchers were all local, as were vegetable supplies. Ready-made meals were a novelty (usually dried up Indians or Chinese food that tasted like cardboard), there was one car tops for each family and public transport was actually used.

The consumer society of today is fuelled by TODAYS youth and young adults, all of whom need a smart phone, tablet, car, latest fashion and food that goes "ping" to tell you it's ready. Instant everything. So don't blame the oldies for today. I'm not even going to go down the route of their grandfathers and what they did!! but, it seems, it's the oldies that'll have to remedy things.

Anyway - sorry that's veered pretty well of thread. So I'll stop. As for the new Defender, yes it has veered away from the old one in a lot of ways, but hang on. The old one cost an arm and a leg too and kept it's price. The new one promises to be able to do what the old one did off-road (more or less) but the new one promises to be a bit more comfortable (not too hard to achieve that). Yes, it's full of electronic gizmos rather than levers and sticks, but that's the way things have gone everywhere. Frankly, most farmers' Defenders are vehicles of a certain age anyway. I bet that if we were to fast forward 20 years or so, a fair proportion of the new ones will be earning their keep in farm yards.
Good god Pedro, you had it good, writing if you could write was with a quill in my day and groceries were road kill. Any cardboard box we found was used as an additional room to live in and milk was sucked direct from the cow. Clothes were old hessian sacks sewn together with proper cat gut and a ready meal was a freshly run over hedgehog, Ahhhh those were the days.
 

Miki

Well-Known Member
Good god Pedro, you had it good, writing if you could write was with a quill in my day and groceries were road kill. Any cardboard box we found was used as an additional room to live in and milk was sucked direct from the cow. Clothes were old hessian sacks sewn together with proper cat gut and a ready meal was a freshly run over hedgehog, Ahhhh those were the days.
Luxury !
 

Bavarianbrit

Well-Known Member
Quote; " I was a body designer on the G so looks good to me";quote..
and then,
quote; "I did the engineering solutions. Stylist (who stole the name designer from our branch) are responsible for the shapes." ;quote

which was it?

fascinating, who chose the cheese they made the mechanical parts from?
I was under the impression that cars all look the same today because having discovered which shape works best in the wind tunnel the best most manufacturers chose to follow suit, well, that and the complete lack of taste and talent of the vast majority of them. very little in cars grabs the attention these days, they all look the same, perform about the same, fall apart the same, and cost way more than they are worth.
I fail to see the point in striving to save fuel to lesson carbon emissions and then having to replace the entire car in a few short years, resulting in another pile of plastic laden fault enhanced sh1t to roll out the door. while the world fills with waste. still I guess it keeps the kids happy,,, oh no wait,,, ;) :rofl:
What do you not understand?
Draughtsmen (designers) sort out all the engineering issues like window drops to door opening/closing / cockpit integrity / airbag design / seat design etc.
Stylists on the other hand walk about in their studios all dressed in black ninja outfits telling the clay modellers what they want ref the shape, the wind tunnel adjusting comes later after the original shape is signed off by upper management and designers are usually trying to get promoted to be the chief designer.
I fail to see the point in striving to save fuel to lesson carbon emissions and then having to replace the entire car in a few short years I agree 100% the energy wasted to build news cars is enormous but panel press & injection moulding tools have a life of around 500,000 units and need to be renewed so the car companies just put out a new BETTER? model instead with a hiked price tag.
 

Bavarianbrit

Well-Known Member
No idea what they look like, never seen one, or even a Tata dealer. Only ones I remember are the diabolical piece of crap they tried selling over here about 35 years ago

Neil.
Designed by Tata engineering in Coventry, 2.2 common rail diesel designed in Austria 140 horses, gearbox by borg warner usa, I get 7 litres per 100kms out of mine mine. Most Izuzu/Rangers are running at 9.5 litres per 100 kms.
Capture.JPG
 

riddick

Well-Known Member
What do you not understand?
Draughtsmen (designers) sort out all the engineering issues like window drops to door opening/closing / cockpit integrity / airbag design / seat design etc.
Stylists on the other hand walk about in their studios all dressed in black ninja outfits telling the clay modellers what they want ref the shape, the wind tunnel adjusting comes later after the original shape is signed off by upper management and designers are usually trying to get promoted to be the chief designer.
I fail to see the point in striving to save fuel to lesson carbon emissions and then having to replace the entire car in a few short years I agree 100% the energy wasted to build news cars is enormous but panel press & injection moulding tools have a life of around 500,000 units and need to be renewed so the car companies just put out a new BETTER? model instead with a hiked price tag.
I remember a brand new discovery with a tyre wear problem that the main dealers just could not pin down, various tests and reasons were put forward even suggesting the new owner had or his wife had had a minor altercation with an object such as a kerb or stump, after exhaustive discussions,theories, and solicitors letters it was in desperation brought to an independent specialist, myself and two other people went about checking each and every measurement, and found the problem within an hour, the wheelbase on one side was over two inches difference, confirmed by measuring two other similar vehicles, one was only one inch out the other was the same both sides.
the panel gaps were anything from 1/16" to almost 3/8"
remember these were brand new vehicles, I'v seen benders put together on housing estate lock-ups with more skill.
and I must have rebuilt dozens of gearboxes that had failed due to the use of plastic parts inside them that were simply unfit for purpose.
 

Chasey

Well-Known Member
Try this for £10-13K plus postage from India, or drive it back to UK yourself (RHD).
As sold in India. Looks to be based on the old G MB platform I was a body designer on the G so looks good to me 4x coils 2x locking diffs Mercedes engine. How cam merc justify £100K using similar amount of material?

Got to be honest, id buy one of those as a stalking truck for 13K???

Mind you id probably sell it before the warentee runs out :D

Wonder if i can get sponsership to drive one from India to Turkey???

THAT would be a trip deserving a 4X4 :D
 

Hornet 6

Well-Known Member
Designed by Tata engineering in Coventry, 2.2 common rail diesel designed in Austria 140 horses, gearbox by borg warner usa, I get 7 litres per 100kms out of mine mine. Most Izuzu/Rangers are running at 9.5 litres per 100 kms.
View attachment 137459
Looks so much better than the old ones.
You say the engine is from down under ? It's not the smallest of the Ford Australia
Barra engine is it.

Neil.
 

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