Article in Shooting Times

Derry

Active Member
I have read a post today in the shooting times where the SGA are claiming deer have been wipped out in Argyll due to the fact you cant see them from the road. In my view this is a very poor arguement from the SGA that just because you cant see them from the road there all gone. Surely more concrete evidance needs to be carried out, i.e deer counts, dung counts, habitat impact surveys and so on. If SGA are to be taken seriously then there facts need to be correct.

Cheers
Derry
 

Hereford

Well-Known Member
I've been attempting a census on one of my permissions for the last three years (out of interest for the landowner) - initial findings indicate that there are many more deer than you can actually see!
 
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Ray7756

Well-Known Member
I finf that hard to believe, but im sure someone on the forum that lives in that area will let us know
 

10.9

Well-Known Member
In winter seeing deer from the road can be an indication of "having a few deer" as the deer will come down from the open hill in harsh weather. I think these deer might not have been totally wiped out but numbers reduced to a level where a "sporting cull" cannot happen , this will affect livelihoods. These areas will have been counted regular , sometimes useing helicopters and deemed to have to many deer. The red deer of today have no friends with the powers that be . The SGA have some of the countries top deer men , guys who have a lifetime of knowledge and are on the ground all year , they know what they are talking about.
 

Claret_Dabbler

Well-Known Member
I have read a post today in the shooting times where the SGA are claiming deer have been wipped out in Argyll due to the fact you cant see them from the road.....
Maybe this is just an indication that they have become educated to the dangers of presenting themselves within sight or rifle range of a road.

Which in of itself begs a few questions.

I hear people complain there are no deer left in certain areas in Ireland. The truth is there are plenty of deer if you will walk half a mile from the car.
 

gerarddwatts

Well-Known Member
I think the SGA are drawing attention to the fact that according to SNH, and therefore the Scottish Government, together with the RSPB, John Muir Trust, National Trust and FC, deer are little more than vermin and these public bodies have killed so many that sporting stalking, together with the employment of those involved, is severely at risk.

Of course if the muppets in the pretendy parliament go ahead and re-introduce sporting rates, the likelihood is that sporting stalking, leases etc will finish as landowners/farmers/forestry companies will not want to pay them, and will therefore cease sporting/hobby stalking activities, opening the door for control orders and mass culls. This will also have the effect of reducing the market value of such land, meaning that the government can afford to buy more of it to further their loony land reform proposals. T

Sad really.
 

6pointer

Account Suspended
:thumb:

In winter seeing deer from the road can be an indication of "having a few deer" as the deer will come down from the open hill in harsh weather. I think these deer might not have been totally wiped out but numbers reduced to a level where a "sporting cull" cannot happen , this will affect livelihoods. These areas will have been counted regular , sometimes using helicopters and deemed to have to many deer. The red deer of today have no friends with the powers that be . The SGA have some of the countries top deer men , guys who have a lifetime of knowledge and are on the ground all year , they know what they are talking about.

Good post and I am sure the count will be done in a clear and transparent way lol. Two many deer lads lets have our jolly's again.
 
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Derry

Active Member
So if you drive around Scotland and see deer at the side of the road that then means there is a viable sporting cull over the hill???? Dont believe this to be true as these deer at the side of the road i.e. the A9 some of these deer have come from miles away maybe 20-30 and return to a few small areas in the the summer months then break out in the rut and so on so could infact be shot 50miles from the road side. So hpow then benifits from these deer the nearby estatesthat wont them, the conservation ereas that dont who knows. There is for sure experienced guys in the SGA and that is not the point I was simple pointing out there poor method of monitoring deer numbers.


Not sure what you mean about a jolly for the boys?


Stick to your urban deer and the experts will take care of the highlands.


Cheers
 

6pointer

Account Suspended
Derry Yes lets let the experts tell us all how to deal with Deer/
The Jolly,s are the snh/fc and all there pals who went on the rampage in the name of conservation lol.

 

Derry

Active Member
This post was not meant to be another chance for your one man parade against fc and snh 6pointer. Your like a broken record now, jolly? If you think culling large numbers of red deer in remote locations is a jolly you really are showing your lack of experience in deer management. I would be shocked if a pile of highland stalkers are not completely fed up with your sweeping statements.
 

6pointer

Account Suspended
LOL Derry showing his true colours :lol: I am sure I am not the only one as you pointed out the SGA are fed up with SNH / FES Taking the moral high ground then doing what they like. Regards methods at counting deer that will come down to resources and we all know how much SNH/FES send on making there own chosen numbers add up.
SGA are correct the numbers of red deer are down dramatically and most shot by the lamp disgraceful don't you agree Derry.
 

Ranger22

Well-Known Member
There are plenty of deer in Argyll, you have to get out your car's to see them. Winter has only turned harsh this last couple of weeks so the deer are still high up.
 

tumbleweed

Well-Known Member
I have read a post today in the shooting times where the SGA are claiming deer have been wipped out in Argyll due to the fact you cant see them from the road. In my view this is a very poor arguement from the SGA that just because you cant see them from the road there all gone. Surely more concrete evidance needs to be carried out, i.e deer counts, dung counts, habitat impact surveys and so on. If SGA are to be taken seriously then there facts need to be correct.

Cheers
Derry
I believe that if all these counts are made? and position of deer is of grave concern ie. deer being wiped out then The Scottish Government will then be looking to Cull the amount of FAC holders in these areas and if I was in that area I would be trying to state a more accurate count as I would in no way like the powers that be to be looking at my FAC to see if I really needed it?
So You Guys in Those Areas better be watching over your shoulders and letting the people know that the figs they are coming up with are possibly!!! not correct....
 
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Derry

Active Member
Why do you have such an issue with the culling of deer at night. Would it be better if the neighbouring estates went in during the day culling large groups at a time, chasing them around causing more stress to the animals. Why is the fact that some grouse moors that exclude deer with huge fences and then shoot any that break in never mentioned. These huge fences stop deer getting to wintering ground and are surely less humane. I have worked in areas that had populations of several thousand deer and it was lovely to see however we must not forget each estate has it owns objectives and these should be respected.
Stick to the day job.
 

6pointer

Account Suspended
I don't have an issue Derry its SNH that have the problem they are not expert enough to decide if the deer could be shot with in day light and there for issue Authorisations out of Ignorance instead of experience. I don't doubt that you have seen many hundreds of deer and I do envy you that. But I have seen Parks of less than 100 hec lamped because ten deer needed removed. Surly you do not agree with that treatment and hopefully you will understand the legislation states Lamping as a last resort.;)
Deer are my day job.
 

Derry

Active Member
If SNH are not (expert) enough then who is? you? If the park was in a very busy public area and culling during the day had been tried but was unsuccesfull them maybe lamping was the best option, problem is I dont know all the facts which is probably an issue you have. Again if the Park was being adversely affected by deer damage why do the landowners not have a right to remove them in the most effective manner. There are always plenty of deer ready to take there place.
 

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