BASC, Lobbying for overhaul of entire licensing system

jimmy milnes

Well-Known Member
If a significant "win" was made in some quarter I'm positive that it would bee a double whammy for whoever.

A. Recognition for the win.
B. A large boost in membership numbers by people feel that the messiah had arrived
 

308tikka

Well-Known Member
I really am starting to think that they might be better off without members like you ‘
A members’ organisation with fewer members = being better off in the minds of those with an agenda (or too dim to understand).

Like many groups in many arenas of life BASC have morphed into an organisation run by and for the interests of a few people, often scurrying between organisations with similar objectives. Using a mass membership to protect the interests of a few ie pheasant/grouse shoots.

BASC are an absolute disgrace.
 

308tikka

Well-Known Member
BASC NI successfully lobbied for this banded system in NI and this took effect in 2016.

Of course it was ONLY BASC NI lobbying.... nope!

Target Shooting in NI (with multiple Commonwealth Gold medals for NI) also made representations, to get away from the WORST system in the UK, entirely antiquated and where the Chief Con (but in reality his Superintendent Firearms Licensing) could refuse any application without any justification, and SG were on S1 FACs and when fullbore rifles were stored in central armouries.

The target shooting community in NI were the main driver in lobbying individual MPs to avoid a pistol ban when GB had fullbore pistols banned.

I know, because I personally lobbied, spoke with my MP and gained a guarantee he would not support any ban extension to NI.

Similarly it was British Shooting not BASC which lobbied successfully for S5 pistols around the CWG and Olympics.

Beware of what BASC say they lobby for. Often it is a minor element when others do the heavy lifting. They have a couple of shire Tory MPs who are so dim they have never been offered any role in the executive.

With the exception of Bill Harriman, I wouldnt give them the time of day.
 

jimmy milnes

Well-Known Member
So
Why are you still supporting BASC they are not representing you or the rest of there members.
Sorry T1 my last reply was rather hurried as had stuff to do..

I'll answer your question with a question if you don't mind,
If BASC are fookin things up "not saying they aren't not saying they are so please humour me" then why aren't the other organisations, the likes that you an many many others pay good money to stamping up and down to stop them and rectify the wrongs ?. All in they must out gun "no pun intended" BASC several times over I'd imagine.
If I was a member of another organisation and felt as strong as many on here clearly do I'd be spending time writing to MY organisation to ask what's going on and why aren't they opposing these injustices instead of spending my time harping on about it on here.
 

308tikka

Well-Known Member
If I was a member of another organisation and felt as strong as many on here clearly do I'd be spending time writing to MY organisation to ask what's going on and why aren't they opposing these injustices instead of spending my time harping on about it on here.
I do.

For all my shooting I require a 12g SG, a rimfire and several bolt action CF, some with magazines, moderators and spare barrels.

Thats all-nothing egregious, easy to manage and it would be easy to say ‘Im ok-I dont care if they ban semi auto rimfires or SG, or lever action, or High Muzzle Energy large bore rifles’. It doesnt affect me. Until the time that it does- fewer shooters fewer imports, higher prices and of course easy to further restrict the smaller the pool of active participants there is.

Its why I would in theory like to see a national MEMBERS organisation pulling in all shooters, target, game, and which looks out for its trade members who rely on shooting for income incl pest control and deer managers. Its not BASC before their social media correspondent pops up here spouting drivel. Again.

It just wont happen. Too many snouts in the trough, too many vested interests (‘no we dont want to be seen with them- they wear camo!’ / ‘as long as pheasant shooting is ok why should we care?’ attitude).
 

jimmy milnes

Well-Known Member
I do.

For all my shooting I require a 12g SG, a rimfire and several bolt action CF, some with magazines, moderators and spare barrels.

Thats all-nothing egregious, easy to manage and it would be easy to say ‘Im ok-I dont care if they ban semi auto rimfires or SG, or lever action, or High Muzzle Energy large bore rifles’. It doesnt affect me. Until the time that it does- fewer shooters fewer imports, higher prices and of course easy to further restrict the smaller the pool of active participants there is.

Its why I would in theory like to see a national MEMBERS organisation pulling in all shooters, target, game, and which looks out for its trade members who rely on shooting for income incl pest control and deer managers. Its not BASC before their social media correspondent pops up here spouting drivel. Again.

It just wont happen. Too many snouts in the trough, too many vested interests (‘no we dont want to be seen with them- they wear camo!’ / ‘as long as pheasant shooting is ok why should we care?’ attitude).
All hard to argue points, you say you have written to your organisation, who are they, on what topic and what was the response please?
You're probably in a very small minority so good on ya 👍🏻
 

308tikka

Well-Known Member
All hard to argue points, you say you have written to your organisation, who are they, on what topic and what was the response please?
You're probably in a very small minority so good on ya 👍🏻
NRA for one. Other governing bodies eg NSRA. I also speak personally with individuals. They unite under British Shooting to make representations that count.
 

terrier1

Well-Known Member
All hard to argue points, you say you have written to your organisation, who are they, on what topic and what was the response please?
You're probably in a very small minority so good on ya 👍🏻
I am sorry to say but you constantly believe no one has been writing to they organization. As I have said before I up ship from the NGO and in the email I told them the issue was there stance on LEAD. Can I ask have you written to yours. And I can save you the trouble if it is BASC I don't want to know.
 

Rewulf

Active Member
Yes they are probably the most wealthy i'll grant you.
How did they become the most wealthy ?
Because they run it as a profit making business first , and a members based shooting org second.
They take much , and give little back.
And first and foremost , they spend time and money on the PROFIT making areas of shooting, whilst more or less abandoning the 'ordinary' non profit making member areas to their own devices.

Thats why theyre not bothered about a lead ban, or doctors letters, or any other thing that impacts ordinary private shooters, because it wont affect theyre larger money making interests.
Its plain to see.
Its interesting to see Conor asking for people to come to the non toxic ammunition day in Wales, is he paying for you to go ?
Or are they struggling to make the numbers up for what they thought would be a nice profitable day ?
 

jimmy milnes

Well-Known Member
I am sorry to say but you constantly believe no one has been writing to they organization. As I have said before I up ship from the NGO and in the email I told them the issue was there stance on LEAD. Can I ask have you written to yours. And I can save you the trouble if it is BASC I don't want to know.
That right you did mention that you'd left the NGO in another thread only a week or so after saying in that poll that that's who ya were in, never mind it's irrelevant anyway cause I hold them all in the same mind myself.

Who you with now by the way.... Oh that's right ya wouldn't say before would you, perhaps its box or smash or one of the other organisations 007 🤣🤣 don't understand the need for secrecy...

I've never made it a secret I'm in basc an GWCT "was with NGO too but ditched them"

I dare say some do write to THEIR organisation to ask why they're allowing basc to play pole position in everything but that's the problem cause the others as I've said aren't doing bugger all that's up to much in my opinion.
Please feel free to provide me with evidence to make me wrong, I'm fed up of asking people on here who are in all these other so fantastic organisations for proof of quality work to safeguard field sports, can you give it? If not do as I intend when the times right for me, and just go to an independent insurance company..
 

jimmy milnes

Well-Known Member
NRA for one. Other governing bodies eg NSRA. I also speak personally with individuals. They unite under British Shooting to make representations that count.
What subjects did you tackle with them and what was the answer, an why are they allowing basc to speak for all field sports without challenge from them ? And what did they say on that subject please.
 

terrier1

Well-Known Member
That right you did mention that you'd left the NGO in another thread only a week or so after saying in that poll that that's who ya were in, never mind it's irrelevant anyway cause I hold them all in the same mind myself.

Who you with now by the way.... Oh that's right ya wouldn't say before would you, perhaps its box or smash or one of the other organisations 007 🤣🤣 don't understand the need for secrecy...

I've never made it a secret I'm in basc an GWCT "was with NGO too but ditched them"

I dare say some do write to THEIR organisation to ask why they're allowing basc to play pole position in everything but that's the problem cause the others as I've said aren't doing bugger all that's up to much in my opinion.
Please feel free to provide me with evidence to make me wrong, I'm fed up of asking people on here who are in all these other so fantastic organisations for proof of quality work to safeguard field sports, can you give it? If not do as I intend when the times right for me, and just go to an independent insurance company..
Have I said I am with any organization now NO if you read all my posts I have said on one of my other posts that I Only need insurance now. And I have also told you I am not looking to get into a mines bigger than yours. That for children.
 

jimmy milnes

Well-Known Member
Have I said I am with any organization now NO if you read all my posts I have said on one of my other posts that I Only need insurance now. And I have also told you I am not looking to get into a mines bigger than yours. That for children.
I'm not willy waving either, but the poll title stated where you going to "go"and you put ngo not one of the other insurance only options that were given, so forgive me for not keeping up to speed
 
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terrier1

Well-Known Member
I'm not willy waving either, if that's the case why not just say it before instead of all the secrecy?
BASC are doing more damage to our sport than the antis have done. I have been shooting in one form or another for 48 years and I can't hold back when Conor comes on this forum and try telling us all what a good job they are doing. One word bull****.
 

308tikka

Well-Known Member
What subjects did you tackle with them and what was the answer, an why are they allowing basc to speak for all field sports without challenge from them ? And what did they say on that subject please.
Over many many years (20+). Not really their job to protect fieldsports BUT I would prefer an overarching members org for all of shooting. But only one-fieldsports has CA, BASC, GWCT, NGO, arguably the BDS (I know its a charity for deer welfare) and shooting has several.
Suggestions on licensing, the 50cal thing, medical referees and on many other issues. Because they are under British Shooting umbrella it goes to them to agree round a table and they submit. Id also say the NRA legal advice on licensing has been , at least in years past, superb.


Dont forget - they are also affected and are shooters or ex shooters (in the main, current CEO the exception). They are onside and understand govt would ban shooting overnight if it could. The press would swing behind it and there would be little fuss.

I do remember Lord Coe - I believe then chairman of the NPA and an active pistol shooter, seeming to roll over in a heartbeat when his future career as Seb Coe MP was in jeopardy if he didnt toe the line.

The only thing that gives BASC any credibility (and its then ruined when they open mouths) is their numbers. But a large organisation talking sh*t does more damage than a small one.
 

8x57

Distinguished Member
Sebastion Coe don't mention that bloody turncoat, (he was honorary president not chairman of the NPA). Hardly an active pistol shooter having only taken up the sport a relatively short time before he stabbed us all in the back.
I have no time for the man.
 

Greenmist

Well-Known Member
What subjects did you tackle with them and what was the answer, an why are they allowing basc to speak for all field sports without challenge from them ? And what did they say on that subject please.
Jimmy, this thread is starting to go off topic, and the reason I started it was to ask Conor about the lobbying, he stated BASC were lobbying parliament for a complete overhaul of the licensing system. I have asked him three times directly on this thread and he has yet to provide an answer that this is the case. Meeting with a shadow minister and not even suggesting the outcome was positive seems a bit off. BASC have become the career politicians of the shooting world unfortunately and their vague (if at all) answers show this. Politicians and CC's know they are a toothless dog and have little or no influence on government policy, I recall Manchester's (possibly) CC refused to correspond with them further over a matter, not so strong a voice
 

jimmy milnes

Well-Known Member
Jimmy, this thread is starting to go off topic, and the reason I started it was to ask Conor about the lobbying, he stated BASC were lobbying parliament for a complete overhaul of the licensing system. I have asked him three times directly on this thread and he has yet to provide an answer that this is the case. Meeting with a shadow minister and not even suggesting the outcome was positive seems a bit off. BASC have become the career politicians of the shooting world unfortunately and their vague (if at all) answers show this. Politicians and CC's know they are a toothless dog and have little or no influence on government policy, I recall Manchester's (possibly) CC refused to correspond with them further over a matter, not so strong a voice
All these basc threads go the same way unfortunately, they end up similar to a game of Chinese whisper at a party in that the beginning never resembles the end and I do have to take blame for my part I suppose.
I'll end here an apologise 👍🏻
 

Conor O'Gorman

Well-Known Member
Official Member
Jimmy, this thread is starting to go off topic, and the reason I started it was to ask Conor about the lobbying, he stated BASC were lobbying parliament for a complete overhaul of the licensing system. I have asked him three times directly on this thread and he has yet to provide an answer that this is the case. Meeting with a shadow minister and not even suggesting the outcome was positive seems a bit off. BASC have become the career politicians of the shooting world unfortunately and their vague (if at all) answers show this. Politicians and CC's know they are a toothless dog and have little or no influence on government policy, I recall Manchester's (possibly) CC refused to correspond with them further over a matter, not so strong a voice
I have repeatedly answered your questions as best I can and yes we continue our lobbying work for an overhaul of the firearms licensing system.

Last year’s firearms licensing consultation had 11,000 responses. Recent Q&As in Parliament indicate that there are more imminent.

The 1-2% people in the shooting community that get actively involved in policy and campaigns play a key role defending and promoting shooting and the active contributors on this forum including yourself are part of that.

Let’s ensure we encourage everyone we know that shoots to become aware of and get involved in the next campaign. Regardless of who is a member of what.

Negativity and infighting is wasted time and energy we can ill afford to face the challenges ahead.
 

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