Esophagus ties are so last year...

[Psyxologos]

OK, this is a tongue in cheek title. What I wanted to suggest is that, while I was at Homebase today I came across what I think is a much better and easy way to deal with the issue of stopping the contents of the esophagus (and the anal track maybe) of a shot deer contaminating the carcass during the process of gralloching.



What do you guys think? I mean, I am only stalking for the last three years and I am not trying to teach you how to suck an egg, but don't you think this is a much more neater and quick way to secure the esophagus than these plastic ties bought from the hardware store?

 

[Apache]

oesophagus

On the whole there should be no need to tie either end. Have you ever been in a slaughterhouse? Think they set on with cable ties?

 

[Eric the Red]

Nice idea.

However.....(!)
How hygienic will these be after dragging round in your bag/after second or third use - but more importantly, the point of the cable tie (Apache's erudite statement notwithstanding) is so it slips easily through the membranes to release said tube - this may catch etc - and then release....

 

[Paul at Fechan]

I used small surgical forceps (off ebay for fishing) for a while and they were faster and more efficient that any other method..... but you put them down and lose them too easy and I lost a couple so went back to putting a knot in it.

 

[Monkey Spanker]

I have no idea why people see the need to even cut the oesophagus? If you do a suspended gralloch (which is undoubtedly the cleanest method), leave it attached and strip it out all the way forward of the atlas joint. Then remove the head with the gralloch and oesophagus still intact. You can then stick an 'S' hook through the lower jaw and suspend the head and entire gralloch in a similar manner for inspection.
In answer to your question though, I very much doubt those clips would seal it properly anyway if pressure built up behind them? They would also rust and be a nightmare to keep clean. You can get proper clips for this purpose though. A friend of mine that worked in an abattoir gave me some once. I still have them somewhere - unused!
MS

 

[User00003]

I have no idea why people see the need to even cut the oesophagus? If you do a suspended gralloch (which is undoubtedly the cleanest method), leave it attached and strip it out all the way forward of the atlas joint. Then remove the head with the gralloch and oesophagus still intact. You can then stick an 'S' hook through the lower jaw and suspend the head and entire gralloch in a similar manner for inspection.
In answer to your question though, I very much doubt those clips would seal it properly anyway if pressure built up behind them? They would also rust and be a nightmare to keep clean. You can get proper clips for this purpose though. A friend of mine that worked in an abattoir gave me some once. I still have them somewhere - unused!
MS

suspended works great if you can lift the deer, for larger deer or larger species, it's tricky..I did cable ties and latex gloves for a while, now I'm back to tying a knot and washing the hands in a stream...no one's ever been sick after eating any venison I've shot...more the wine that goes with it!

 

[Monkey Spanker]

Here, if you are going to do it, then stop ****ing about and get the right tool for the job!
Weasand clips!
http://www.ces-ltd.co/products/lamb-clips-loose/
There isn't a deer in the land that can't be lifted either. Man-up, or get a hoist!
MS

 

[jamross65]

Never done a suspended gralloch in my life and don't ever intend to either. Why is it cleaner? The deer are lying dead on the very ground they were feeding on a few seconds before the shot so I guess they cannot get any more contaminated from lying dead on their food. Open neck, pair off meat around oesophagus with knife, cut through and tie a knot. Removing the meat around it allows for the knot to be tied tighter and wont slip. Same at other end (arse) and remove pluck still attached to guts, both sealed at either end. Simpler, less fiddly, less kit to carry...

 

[Monkey Spanker]

Never done a suspended gralloch in my life and don't ever intend to either. Why is it cleaner? The deer are lying dead on the very ground they were feeding on a few seconds before the shot so I guess they cannot get any more contaminated from lying dead on their food. Open neck, pair off meat around oesophagus with knife, cut through and tie a knot. Removing the meat around it allows for the knot to be tied tighter and wont slip. Same at other end (arse) and remove pluck still attached to guts, both sealed at either end. Simpler, less fiddly, less kit to carry...

It's cleaner because the deer wasn't opened up when it was still alive! It also prevents any blood or contamination from a chest shot deer spreading back to toward the valuable part of the animal. How can it not be cleaner? If you'd done one in this manner, You'd know why it is so much better!
MS

 

[Apache]

You need to look at this all from the outside and see what is 'best practice' and then what is acceptable practice in the field.

In a slaughterhouse dealing with carcases on the floor would never be allowed. Equally on the top of a Scottish moor there many not be a tree for a couple of miles to try and drag staggie up.

 

[Paul 600]

I have no idea why people see the need to even cut the oesophagus? If you do a suspended gralloch (which is undoubtedly the cleanest method), leave it attached and strip it out all the way forward of the atlas joint. Then remove the head with the gralloch and oesophagus still intact. You can then stick an 'S' hook through the lower jaw and suspend the head and entire gralloch in a similar manner for inspection.
In answer to your question though, I very much doubt those clips would seal it properly anyway if pressure built up behind them? They would also rust and be a nightmare to keep clean. You can get proper clips for this purpose though. A friend of mine that worked in an abattoir gave me some once. I still have them somewhere - unused!
MS

Mick, beat me to it! Have to agree, suspended every time!

Even on the hill a single Grollach, or extract and do a at the larder.

 

[jamross65]

It's cleaner because the deer wasn't opened up when it was still alive! It also prevents any blood or contamination from a chest shot deer spreading back to toward the valuable part of the animal. How can it not be cleaner? If you'd done one in this manner, You'd know why it is so much better!
MS

Nope, still don't see what you are getting at. Any contamination is allready present within the cavity the second the bullet passes through the animal and the damage is done, and if it runs that spread of matter has already taken place. I tend to look for a slope on the ground with its head downhill. If it's shot through the chest and the diaphragm is intact that in itself acts as a reasonable barrier if that's a concern to prevent too much matter spreading backwards and the pluck can be removed after it has been dragged to a larder, but there is still no need to suspend to remove the pluck cleanly either! If the small cut in the neck is made giving access to the food tube and windpipe, both of which are now cut and tied off, by reaching into the chest cavity through the cut made to remove the stomach, if you are strong enough they can be pulled into the animals cavity and the whole lot removed as one, even in the field exposing very little flesh and the majority of the neck still closed for dragging. The problem I have is that BP does not always take cognisance of the practicalities in field, a bit like carrying a spade to always bury your gralloch.

Ah, maybe I do now see. You mean you shoot the deer, throw it in a vehicle and drive it back to a larder with hot running water and steralised equipment? Nope, in the real world that is not an option for me as all my deer need dragged. So I concede that if that can be done within 20mins of the beast being shot fair enough.

 

[devon deer stalker]

Like Jamross i have never done or felt the need to do a suspended gralloch, but i can accept if the diaphragm hasn't been damaged then a suspended gralloch could be neater, but most of the deer i shoot are reds or fallow so its always done on the ground head facing down and never had a problem.
I might try the next roe i shoot with the suspended method.
Cheers
​Richard

 

[bogtrotter]

Mick, beat me to it! Have to agree, suspended every time!

Even on the hill a single Grollach, or extract and do a at the larder.

Sorry but its not always possible, on my ground at the furthest point you were close on eighteen miles from the larder or two and a bit hours with argo , mind you it was only seventeen and a half to the nearest tree.

Thats why we always only do a green gralloch on the hill, back at the larder some will suspend for the rest of the job, personally I prefer to use a larder stool.

 

[Monkey Spanker]

The suspended method only gives real benefit when you open up the sternum at the same time. The green gralloch then sweeps down through the ribcage and effectively cleans out most of the blood from a chest shot. If you are only removing the green gralloch before extraction, then you gain nothing other than prevention of possible contamination, which is pointless if you are the going to drag the beast through the dirt anyway!. The clip that I've given the link to would be ideal for this though as it is basically what it is designed for! 'Best practice' would suggest that if you can't do the entire job in a clean environment, then you should extract the carcass intact to somewhere that is suitable. I also appreciate that this is not always possible due to time constraints and remote locations. We just have to do the best we can in the circumstances we create.
MS

 

[jamross65]

The suspended method only gives real benefit when you open up the sternum at the same time. The green gralloch then sweeps down through the ribcage and effectively cleans out most of the blood from a chest shot. If you are only removing the green gralloch before extraction, then you gain nothing other than prevention of possible contamination, which is pointless if you are the going to drag the beast through the dirt anyway!. The clip that I've given the link to would be ideal for this though as it is basically what it is designed for! 'Best practice' would suggest that if you can't do the entire job in a clean environment, then you should extract the carcass intact to somewhere that is suitable. I also appreciate that this is not always possible due to time constraints and remote locations. We just have to do the best we can in the circumstances we create.
MS

Just out of interest MS, when you split the sternum to allow the guts to fall out, is there ever a risk that the cut bone could rupture the stomach as it falls forward? I know you will support it but what if you are alone and it's from a 20st stag say, and the guts alone weigh about 40lbs? I suppose it's what you are used to and how you develop your own way of doing wee things when in the field. For example I won't touch deer to gralloch now without wearing gloves. Two reasons, my hands are invariably dirty and a few years ago I learnt that transference of bacteria from deer into your blood stream through cuts or hacks is quite common. I am always surprised at how many come stalking though who don't and no doubt some will be reading this thinking, 'ya big saftie...' I remember the days of sticking un-gloved hands in dirty places then eating food and never giving it a second thought at the time...

I think as said already, you make the best of what you have.

 

[Ranger22]

I shot a Red stag the other week, 128kg dressed out guessing that ungralloched it must of been in the region of 150kg. How would you propose hanging that in a tree and gralloching it? I'll stick to doing it on the ground and save my back

​Al

 

[Psyxologos]

Thanks for the feedback guys. Some very valid points made. Well, my idea behind these spring clamps (6 for £1 by the way) is that I will not have to use them more than a handful of times each, as they are cheap enough to replace. Slip a couple in my pocket and off I go. As I said, it was an idea I had when I saw them, maybe I was mistaken. Thanks for the ideas. Much appreciated.

 

[Monkey Spanker]

I shot a Red stag the other week, 128kg dressed out guessing that ungralloched it must of been in the region of 150kg. How would you propose hanging that in a tree and gralloching it? I'll stick to doing it on the ground and save my back

​Al

Just pull it up a tree man!
This little fella only weighed 45 stone ungralloched (about 285kg).

View attachment 32811
You Northerners don't know Yer born with yer wee red stags! We got Muntjac that big!
MS

 

[User00003]

Just pull it up a tree man!
This little fella only weighed 45 stone ungralloched (about 285kg).

View attachment 32811
You Northerners don't know Yer born with yer wee red stags! We got Muntjac that big!
MS

what's up with the balaclava!!! kinda ruins the point of the picture no! LOL