Fieldsports Britain driven muntjac

Uncle f

Well-Known Member
#1
Saw this last night not for me I’m afraid as I feel all deer deserve more respect than this. Even non indigenous muntjac. I have emailed and voiced my opinion
I do shoot driven boar in Europe but I do refrain from driven deer unless viably injured etc.
I’m sure some will agree with me and some not but I just don’t think this should
Have been aired on a public forum such as you tube
 

Woodsmoke

Well-Known Member
#2
Just to play devils advocate, why would you be OK with driven boar, but not muntjac? Surely muntjac aren't as tough as boar, so even a less-than-optimal shot will most likely result in a dead deer? (not having a go at you, I'm genuinely curious)
 

Uncle f

Well-Known Member
#3
Well boar are (this is just my opinion) more numerous in places and need managing in a more (aggressive) way. Not sure that’s the right word but they need a more constant type of management and the continent is set up for that well. The Uk not so much. It has always been about the stalk for me than the end result and if lucky getting some venison for the freezer with a good humane kill which preserves meat I e engine room shots etc. You cannot guarantee this with driven animals as they are taken far back, guts, in front indeed everywhere

For boar its a management thing deer are different but just my opinion I appreciate people have there own that’s what’s great about this forum. However from an antis point of view this episode played right into there hands
Regards Steve
 
#6
I think it's a cultural thing. I have to admit as a share holder in the channel it doesn't sit particularly well with me either but driven mammal hunting is just not really in our culture.
They make the point that it's popular on the continent and a lot of brits travel to the continent to do it but I don't see anything wrong with us going there to experience their culture and they come here to experience our driven bird culture which they don't have.
I'm not sure there would be a big uptake in driven dear management in the UK but just my opinion
 
#7
I don't agree with any driven shooting of boar or deer. Far too much chance of badly injuring and causing unnecessary suffering. Yes, there is no guarantee we will never mess a shot up on a standing target but there is far less chance to do so. I know the trackers do an amazing job but it could be hours and hours before finding an injured animal. No need of it in my opinion and there is certainly no need to drive any deer in Britain, granted we do have high numbers but not anywhere near the need to drive deer. I haven't watched film yet.
 

Heym SR20

Well-Known Member
#8
I can't see any issue. It can be a valuable management tool, and especially for woodland areas, one or two days of driven deer gets the cull done for the year. And probably much less impact than lots of stalking outings. Can see this being very useful on the sorts of areas where there are lots of other things going on - not too much of an issue to close it off a couple of times a year. But for it to be effective you do need quite a number of guns as deer and boar don't run in straight lines - they tend to circle so can come out anywhere.

Provided the riflemen are well versed in shooting moving animals and well practised and disciplined, from an ethical and safety point of view it is not an issue either.

But I can absolutely see how the very traditional UK mindset won't agree to it. There are still plenty of mutterings if you turn up with an Over and Unders and don't have on your plus fours, and as for casting upstream to Salmon - you should be thwashed.

I believe in the old days Roe deer were mostly managed by Roe drives when shotguns with heavy shot were used.
 

old keeper

Well-Known Member
#9
I can't see any issue. It can be a valuable management tool, and especially for woodland areas, one or two days of driven deer gets the cull done for the year. And probably much less impact than lots of stalking outings. Can see this being very useful on the sorts of areas where there are lots of other things going on - not too much of an issue to close it off a couple of times a year. But for it to be effective you do need quite a number of guns as deer and boar don't run in straight lines - they tend to circle so can come out anywhere.

Provided the riflemen are well versed in shooting moving animals and well practised and disciplined, from an ethical and safety point of view it is not an issue either.

But I can absolutely see how the very traditional UK mindset won't agree to it. There are still plenty of mutterings if you turn up with an Over and Unders and don't have on your plus fours, and as for casting upstream to Salmon - you should be thwashed.

I believe in the old days Roe deer were mostly managed by Roe drives when shotguns with heavy shot were used.[/
Yes, indeed they were. I was involved in quite a few roe drives sixty years ago. They were very effective and it was rare to have a runner. For roe, we used either triple A or SSG. Shooting was at quite close range, maximum around forty yards. It was a very effective way of controlling roe numbers.
 
Last edited:

kenbro

Well-Known Member
#11
I can't see any issue. It can be a valuable management tool, and especially for woodland areas, one or two days of driven deer gets the cull done for the year. And probably much less impact than lots of stalking outings. Can see this being very useful on the sorts of areas where there are lots of other things going on - not too much of an issue to close it off a couple of times a year. But for it to be effective you do need quite a number of guns as deer and boar don't run in straight lines - they tend to circle so can come out anywhere.

Provided the riflemen are well versed in shooting moving animals and well practised and disciplined, from an ethical and safety point of view it is not an issue either.

But I can absolutely see how the very traditional UK mindset won't agree to it. There are still plenty of mutterings if you turn up with an Over and Unders and don't have on your plus fours, and as for casting upstream to Salmon - you should be thwashed.

I believe in the old days Roe deer were mostly managed by Roe drives when shotguns with heavy shot were used.
I used to go to driven Roe shooting in England. Land owner didn’t want ANY deer on his estate. (1970s).
You had a choice though...you could either work to the gamekeepers instructions, or, not go there at all.
Ken.
 
#12
I used to go to driven Roe shooting in England. Land owner didn’t want ANY deer on his estate.
Yes, as said, there's some old enough here to remember (if even from what was told to us and not what we were old enough to do) when roe deer were considered vermin and deer drives were something that was done. For my own part I've walked up grouse in Scotland where the four guns walked such as to push any roe towards two rfifle equipped colleagues waiting on further distant outcrop of rock. More "pushing" than driving but the same intent. Walter Winans the famous shooter, Olympian and author used to shoot roe, at the gallop, from horseback with a revolver. Times change. In the case of shooting roe on driven days with birdshot (as most were) for the better as many of the shots were taken at too long a range to kill and kill cleanly.
 

Orion

Well-Known Member
#14
Only thing wrong about it that I can see is that they weren’t using a ‘traditional’ driven calibre. Should have insisted on one of the 9.3s or at the very least an 8x57 JS.
 

mchughcb

Well-Known Member
#15
I thought it was great. Love to have a go myself. The fact they missed the fox would be cause for a years worth of bollocking in my club. Roy shot extremely well. In fact he shows far more skill than a person who spends their evening running around with thermal shooting deer of sticks at night over crops and claiming the high moral ground.
 

mchughcb

Well-Known Member
#16
So over two days with about half a dozen people involved including a specialist from Aimpoint they got three muntjac and they claimed that it was 'incredibly efficient'? Some of these youtubers are really scrapeing the bottom of the barrel for content these days

It depends entirely on the terrain. Do have any youtube videos of your effort stalking multiple muntjac in thick woodland area? Just want to make sure what baseline you are coming from.
 

mchughcb

Well-Known Member
#17
Only thing wrong about it that I can see is that they weren’t using a ‘traditional’ driven calibre. Should have insisted on one of the 9.3s or at the very least an 8x57 JS.
I have used 8x57 for moose and 9.3 for sambar driven hunts. Plenty of stopping power for sure.
 

Cootmeurer

Well-Known Member
#18
Very much a cultural thing, and I can't say I would find it disagreeable if that was the norm for that area/culture.

Here in the SouthEastern US deer drives with hounds are considered very normal. Shooting usually takes place at close range (30 yards or less) and the preferred weapon is a shotgun loaded with buckshot. In some parts of this state, it is the only way to consistently harvest deer from land that is a mixture of swamp and thick pine plantation. Shot deer are almost never lost, because the dogs will follow up/trail any shot.

All you have to do is go 250 miles west, and deer drives with dogs are considered unsportsmanlike and illegal. Further west, in the croplands, deer drives with human drivers are common, and are conducted in areas of cropland after the crops are out and cover is reduced to small woodlots.

And then much further west - driving of deer in any many is considered unsportsmanlike but long range shooting (500+ yards) is considered worthy of emulation.

So - I guess I would say - "when in Rome"
 

jimbo1984

Well-Known Member
#19
I don't see an issue as long as the guns have had plenty of practice on running targets , however as the video shows it's probably not all that effective on muntjac ......
 

Glyn 1

Well-Known Member
#20
It depends entirely on the terrain. Do have any youtube videos of your effort stalking multiple muntjac in thick woodland area? Just want to make sure what baseline you are coming from.
Not one for 'you tubing' myself I'm afraid but I can assure you that, even with my limited experience, if I couldn't get more than three deer, of any species, in twelve man/days on any ground that i've ever stalked i'd be looking for a new job/hobby. Sorry but to dress this up as 'Management' when it is clearly just a sensationalist jolly is frankly ridiculous.
 

Top