Fieldsports Britain driven muntjac

#63
ive shot muntjac running with a 12 gauge, using the right shot and limit the range works well, pandering to antis wont make them happy, if people dont like it dont do it why try to stop others? no method is perfect all can cause suffering and do, we need to stick together
shakey
 
#65
neither me or mchugb mentioned number but monkey said it was illegal, my point was its not
shakey
The question was have I hunted with dogs. Hunting in this country assumes that the dogs are used to kill the animals. The Hunting Act 2004 (c 37) is an Act of the Parliament of the United Kingdom which bans the hunting of wild mammals (notably foxes, deer, hares and mink) with dogs in England and Wales; the Act does not cover the use of dogs in the process of flushing out an unidentified wild mammal, nor does it affect drag hunting. Yes you can flush animals with up to 2 dogs, but that is not hunting as such.
 
#66
The question was have I hunted with dogs. Hunting in this country assumes that the dogs are used to kill the animals. The Hunting Act 2004 (c 37) is an Act of the Parliament of the United Kingdom which bans the hunting of wild mammals (notably foxes, deer, hares and mink) with dogs in England and Wales; the Act does not cover the use of dogs in the process of flushing out an unidentified wild mammal, nor does it affect drag hunting. Yes you can flush animals with up to 2 dogs, but that is not hunting as such.
ok by the letter of the law yes your correct
shakey
 

mchughcb

Well-Known Member
#67
neither me or mchugb mentioned number but monkey said it was illegal, my point was its not
shakey
One good dog is all you need to get them moving. I never mentioned how many and we have strict codes over here, dogs cannot be used for killing or bringing down deer. Hence the breeds are regulated, hounds are registered. Other breeds such as HPR or dachshunds must be pedigrees. Houndsmen worst antis are stalkers. I do both so really cant understand the antagonism other than people are very uneducated and like to project how they think the world should run. For me its live and let live.
 
#69
Not sure if this will go up as last thread on this was closed down but I think its pretty irresponsible of a high profile you tube series to put up a fanciful idea like this. Is it ethical or humane is not really my issue, we shoot birds that are moving and no doubt many die a slow painful death. Its the topic of safety that worries me. Most continental driven boar/deer shooting is done on huge tracts of uninhabited ground and the carnage is backed up by a strong team of very experienced dog handlers to find and dispatch injured animals. We live on a crowded little island and don't have this luxury of space, is it feasible to organise a deer drive on a few hundred acres. Now Lupton is obviously an experienced shot and has had a lot of practice on driven shooting, he is certainly very smug on how good he is but was his shooting safe , it didn't look like it to me. Jacobies summing up was, is it an efficient way of controlling deer ummm not sure, is it legal, yes it is but most of all its really good fun. No doubt shooting squirrels in the tops of trees with a 300 win mag is legal and is probably really good fun but do we refrain from that, why, they do it in Alaska. Lets just hope that newbies will not be ripping the plastic sights off their nurf guns and strapping them to their 243's to strafe the British country side and have the sense to realise that Field sports Britain is mainly satire with as much factual content as the Simpsons.
 

Jagare

Well-Known Member
#71
Not sure if this will go up as last thread on this was closed down but I think its pretty irresponsible of a high profile you tube series to put up a fanciful idea like this. Is it ethical or humane is not really my issue, we shoot birds that are moving and no doubt many die a slow painful death. Its the topic of safety that worries me. Most continental driven boar/deer shooting is done on huge tracts of uninhabited ground and the carnage is backed up by a strong team of very experienced dog handlers to find and dispatch injured animals. We live on a crowded little island and don't have this luxury of space, is it feasible to organise a deer drive on a few hundred acres. Now Lupton is obviously an experienced shot and has had a lot of practice on driven shooting, he is certainly very smug on how good he is but was his shooting safe , it didn't look like it to me. Jacobies summing up was, is it an efficient way of controlling deer ummm not sure, is it legal, yes it is but most of all its really good fun. No doubt shooting squirrels in the tops of trees with a 300 win mag is legal and is probably really good fun but do we refrain from that, why, they do it in Alaska. Lets just hope that newbies will not be ripping the plastic sights off their nurf guns and strapping them to their 243's to strafe the British country side and have the sense to realise that Field sports Britain is mainly satire with as much factual content as the Simpsons.
Our driven days are not done on huge tracts of land. Of course its feasible to have a safe deer drive on a few hundred acres. Every weekend during the hunting season in Sweden Roe, boar and moose are hunted using dogs to teams of hunters. Germany is a crowded country but still manage to have driven hunts safely. Its about knowing your ground and common sense.
How do you know Mr Luptons shooting was unsafe? Were you there? Do you know the ground? Or are you giving an uninformed opinion like we are so very quick to accuse the anti's of . I've never been on a driven hunt that can be in any way described as, carnage.
 

baguio

Well-Known Member
#72
So you acknowledge that Mr Luton is an experienced shot and they you suspect that his shooting was unsafe? An experienced shot wouldn't be taking unsafe shots would he? They may well have had dogs on hand too but simply didn't need them.
With posts like that I question who's side you're on Teazel?
If you don't agree with it then don't partake in it. However, with the extremely limited knowledge that you clearly have of that program I don't feel that your opinions are valid I'm afraid.
 
#73
To be an experience shot to hit a running target in an area were safety is not so important ie vast areas of woodland in Europe is a bit different to the situation he put himself in. But that's the nature of the show and obviously it appeals to an audience like yourself
 
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mchughcb

Well-Known Member
#75
The first deer was shot on an open paddock on a driven hunt. The last deer was shot stalking up to the edge of a open paddock. Similar outcomes really cant see the issue.
 

Jagare

Well-Known Member
#76
To be an experience shot to hit a running target in an area were safety is not so important ie vast areas of woodland in Europe is a bit different to the situation he put himself in. But that's the nature of the show and obviously it appeals to an audience like yourself
So you think that safety is less important just because they shoot on larger bits of ground in Europe. Strange. Where did Mr Lupton put himself in an unsafe situation in the video? please tell. Anybody who shoots a rifle in any hunting situation should try and be a experienced and competent shot.
 
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#77
If anybody is following this thread who is actively considering taking up STALKING, I think they would be given a totally wrong impression. This video was indicative of deer shooting not the skill and art of deer stalking.

There is a fundamental difference between culling and stalking IMHO.

RS
 
#78
About twenty years ago I was present at a wood where there was severe Muntjac damage. We decided to try 'moving' them to rifles in high seats or standing on rides. One of the rifles was a Dane, who sat on his low swivel chair, no support or sticks, shooting freehand.
When we 'movers' got to him, he had six Muntjac lying in the ride, whilst only one or two had been shot by the other rifles, despite them seeing lots nipping across the rides.
Our Danish guest simply couldn't understand our amazement at his shooting. He clearly thought nothing of it and obviously puzzled by our 'standing still only' style, but too polite to comment.
I have never tried it, as I don't have the skill required, however I have no objection, if the shooter has the skill and right equipment to ensure a clean kill.
 

Dave881

Well-Known Member
#79
I don't understand how safety is any less important or an accident any less possible in a large European forest than a smaller British woodland. At the end of the day safety is the most critical aspect of shooting and it doesn't matter whether you are shooting rats with a .177 sub 12ftlb air rifle or shooting buffalo with a .500 nitro express, if it's not safe, don't shoot it, simple. And as for accident possibility being less on driven hunts in Europe, every video I have seen of driven hunting there are huge teams of beaters, dogs, guns and trackers so in my view the chance of something going horribly wrong is even higher, this takes us again to if you are unsure don't shoot. I have never shot driven game but would assume that the organisers of such hunts have placed the guns in such a way that backstop and arcs of fire have been carefully planned to minimise the risk and this information is given to the guns, it's then down to the person taking any shot to stay within the set rules of each stand and to assess each individual shot as it presents itself as to whether a safe shot can be taken and if the animal is within the limits of their shooting ability. Yes I am sure there are plenty of wounded animals and not all guns stay within their personal limits but things can go wrong with any shooting discipline and when it does it's down to anyone involved to put that animal down as quickly as possible. As for the video in question I didn't see any shot that was unsafe and clearly Roy and the other gun are very well trained in shooting running animals. Training and practice is imperative no matter how you are shooting. As I said I haven't shot driven game with a rifle but would love to learn how to using inanimate objects to learn, if I get the chance and I like it and if I can do it proficiently I will then make my mind up as to whether or not I would make a running shot on live quarry. As for shooting muntjac in this way, I don't feel it's the best option due to their breeding cycle, I would be very interested to see how people felt if it was fallow for example as their breeding cycles are known and it could be done in February or march when the young are able to fend for themselves and both bucks and does are in season. I understand that this is a very controversial subject, but it is a very interesting one and for me I am personally undecided as where I sit as I haven't got any experience in doing it. I would love to get a better understanding by speaking to people who have done it and organise hunts before deciding where I sit on the issue. I think the most important things to consider with this style of shooting are safety, training and practice, practice practice.
Regards Dave
 

Orion

Well-Known Member
#80
To be an experience shot to hit a running target in an area were safety is not so important ie vast areas of woodland in Europe is a bit different to the situation he put himself in.
???? I've not experienced shooting anywhere on a driven style hunt where safety isn't of the utmost importance. Arcs of fire, safe backstop and dead ground are all clearly explained and, where appropriate, LOS to other pegs, clearly marked. I wouldn't expect anything else and apply the same principles to shooting here in the UK be it at static or moving quarry.
 

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