getting fac advice please

jimbo1984

Well-Known Member
#1
Hi lads im hopingg one or two of you can maybe give me a little advice , im posting this thread for a friend who isnt on the net.

A few years ago he was going through a bad patch his ex partner fabricated some stories got him arrested no charges but he lost his shotgun certificate at the time and was suffering from bad depression , the officer said he would get his certificate back if he applied again in a couple of years . well this was 5 years ago and hes been on a few stalks with an experianced stalker and would like to get back into the sporrt so will now be wanting to apply for his shotgun and fac what do you think his odds would be i dont want to put him off but i think he may struggle

many thanks

jim
 

Apache

Well-Known Member
#2
If he has no convictions and is no longer depressed then no reason he should have a problem. Expect a lengthy checking process with doctors letters etc.

The 'problem' for people like your mate are a couple of recent nutters who have flipped.
 

Apache

Well-Known Member
#4
thanks for the heads up would letters from the stalker help too?
I'm sure they would, but I expect it is his mental stability they are more concerned about. Stage one is to decide if he is a fit person to be trusted with firearms. The stalker may help reduce daft restrictions on his FAC, and shows willing and experience.

Not 100% clear how the estate rifle rules work if you have had a certificate revoked?
 

jimbo1984

Well-Known Member
#5
as far as i know he never had the fac just shotgun , i know he was very down at one point and it was pretty bleak but that was 5 years ago and hes a different person now so ill tell him to give it a go worst they can say is no i suppose....
 

BunnyDoom

Well-Known Member
#6
If he has no convictions and is no longer depressed then no reason he should have a problem. Expect a lengthy checking process with doctors letters etc.

The 'problem' for people like your mate are a couple of recent nutters who have flipped.
+1

In my own personal experience I needed a doctors letter saying I was no longer depressed, the usual two referees (I asked a friend who is a business owner, and a lady friend of mine who had 2 kids and she said "as a mother of two I have no reservations..."), I then went the extra mile and got another two "character references" from the owner of my rifle club and an old boss of mine - both saying they have known me 10 years+ and they have no concerns.

There is no "history of violence" on my record. I made this point politely in my cover letter.

I was also lucky enough to have a lot of support from my FEO - he also said "nothing wrong with that boy" when he called them to check my application.

Don't let your mate fall into the trap of "fighting" your Firearms dept - get him to write a cover letter and say that if they are still not satisfied with him being suitable then can they please advise what criteria he can work towards in order for them to deem him suitable. It's their necks if he does flip out, so you can't blame them for being cautious!

The main issue I foresee is these "allegations" - though they may have been falsely made, they also may not have been (just no evidence). If there's anything he's not telling you that the police suspect then I doubt they'll be keen on giving him a licence. Can't say I disagree - I've know some notorious thugs who have clean records because no one could ever prove it.
 

jimbo1984

Well-Known Member
#8
Thanks lads I'll pass on the advice, if they knock him back is there any Point of appeal? And I was wondering could he join a gun club with having had a license revoked on the past?
 
#9
+1

In my own personal experience I needed a doctors letter saying I was no longer depressed, the usual two referees (I asked a friend who is a business owner, and a lady friend of mine who had 2 kids and she said "as a mother of two I have no reservations..."), I then went the extra mile and got another two "character references" from the owner of my rifle club and an old boss of mine - both saying they have known me 10 years+ and they have no concerns.

There is no "history of violence" on my record. I made this point politely in my cover letter.

I was also lucky enough to have a lot of support from my FEO - he also said "nothing wrong with that boy" when he called them to check my application.

Don't let your mate fall into the trap of "fighting" your Firearms dept - get him to write a cover letter and say that if they are still not satisfied with him being suitable then can they please advise what criteria he can work towards in order for them to deem him suitable. It's their necks if he does flip out, so you can't blame them for being cautious!

The main issue I foresee is these "allegations" - though they may have been falsely made, they also may not have been (just no evidence). If there's anything he's not telling you that the police suspect then I doubt they'll be keen on giving him a licence. Can't say I disagree - I've know some notorious thugs who have clean records because no one could ever prove it.
This is excellent advice clearly based on personal experience. When considering the application for a shotgun certificate the police must consider two aspects. Firstly whether the applicant has a 'good reason', this is very wide and unlikely to present an issue. The second aspect is whether the applicant can be entrusted to possess a shotgun 'without danger to public safety or the peace'. It is this aspect that will be thoroughly investigated in the circumstances outlined. Full cooperation will be the best policy for your friend to adopt. That should enable a full and objective assessment to be made. These are not at all exceptional circumstances for firearms licencing managers to assess, believe it or not. Best wishes for the right outcome based on objective evidence.
 

jimbo1984

Well-Known Member
#10
This is excellent advice clearly based on personal experience. When considering the application for a shotgun certificate the police must consider two aspects. Firstly whether the applicant has a 'good reason', this is very wide and unlikely to present an issue. The second aspect is whether the applicant can be entrusted to possess a shotgun 'without danger to public safety or the peace'. It is this aspect that will be thoroughly investigated in the circumstances outlined. Full cooperation will be the best policy for your friend to adopt. That should enable a full and objective assessment to be made. These are not at all exceptional circumstances for firearms licencing managers to assess, believe it or not. Best wishes for the right outcome based on objective evidence.
yep great advice for sure :)

I think personally he would get the shotgun CRT back it's just the fac application I doubted he would get but as you say depression and stress are common place so hopefully he will be ok
 
#11
yep great advice for sure :)

I think personally he would get the shotgun CRT back it's just the fac application I doubted he would get but as you say depression and stress are common place so hopefully he will be ok
There are significant differences in the considerations applied to shotgun and firearm applications but in these particular circumstances they may be very similar for all practical purposes where the 'suitability' of the applicant is concerned. My advice would be to apply for the shotgun certificate first then the firearm in due course. This is not a legal requirement but practical advice based on experience.
 

8x57

Distinguished Member
#12
Thanks lads I'll pass on the advice, if they knock him back is there any Point of appeal? And I was wondering could he join a gun club with having had a license revoked on the past?
Probably not (gun club) though I have in the back of my mind an appeal that was supported by BASC some years ago, I just wish that I could remember the details.
 

Buckaroo8

Well-Known Member
#13
This all makes me wonder how many people there are who currently hold a full shotgun licence/fac and are suffering with depression but are afraid to seek help for fear of losing their guns?
 

jimbo1984

Well-Known Member
#14
This all makes me wonder how many people there are who currently hold a full shotgun licence/fac and are suffering with depression but are afraid to seek help for fear of losing their guns?
I would imagine quite a few none of us are immune to depression or stress and just because you have suffered with them doesn't make you unfit to posess a firearm
 

BunnyDoom

Well-Known Member
#15
Thanks lads I'll pass on the advice, if they knock him back is there any Point of appeal? And I was wondering could he join a gun club with having had a license revoked on the past?
Appeal... I personally think it's more likely to antagonise than have a positive result. Your mate should accept any decision they make but write a letter asking what he can do to make himself suitable and when he can re-apply.
 

jimbo1984

Well-Known Member
#16
Appeal... I personally think it's more likely to antagonise than have a positive result. Your mate should accept any decision they make but write a letter asking what he can do to make himself suitable and when he can re-apply.
yeah thats what I thought too , the officer said wen they rev oked his licewnce if he was out of trouble etc then he would get it back in two years and that was 5 years ago, so hopefully he will be ok
 

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