Help please with scope choice.

Howa

Well-Known Member
I'm hopefully about to purchase a CZ in 6.5 Grendel (MTR - 26" model) and I'm looking at scopes for it.
The rifle will be used for ranges of 200 to 600 yards mainly.
The shop where I hope to purchase the rifle is offering and promoting Element Optics scopes, specifically the Titan at about £675 and the Helix model at about the £425- mark.
I'm thinking of the Titan but would welcome views on this scope and any alternative scopes similar in price to the Titan and with comparable features.
Thanks for any/all replies.
 

cjm1066

Well-Known Member
Do they make their own scopes, or are they getting them made in Asia About - Element Optics | Premium Quality Riflescopes & Optics, were some good scopes are made but an awful lot of rubbish is also made, you pays your money and take your choice.

Over the years a lot of outfits have come onto the market selling scopes that they may have "designed" but which are made in Asia, most after a flurry of publicity are long gone leaving no warrenty or servicing facilities :evil:.

Of course some new outfits will thrive and become indistry leaders..:)
 

Sampo

Well-Known Member
Depeds on what you are going to use it for - range/ stalking/ mix of both. If its only for range, I am of the opinion that most mid range scopes would work fine and for the amount you stated, you might even be able to pick up a used Zeiss or Vortex high end, which performs well. Do keep in mind that range days are usually in the sun, with plenty of light, stationary target with a shot missed is not as bad compared to when you are stalking.

If its for stalking, I would probably go with the best European scope your budget allows as you need something for the low light but believe this may not be the case as you have mentioned about 200-600 yards.
 

Bowland blades

Well-Known Member
Well one assumes target shooting ? Not many specify 600 for deer / fox and from 200 ? Anyway adjustability and tracking are going to be paramount and in that budget I would suggest a good leupold ( lots of fakes take care check serial numbers on thier page ) . Secondhand not a big problem as they are lifetime guarantee
To get better your needing to spend a lot more
 

johndeere

Well-Known Member
This would be my choice



I have the delta Stryker and I like it a lot, I only have Swarovski scopes to compare it to I will be fitting up a 204 very shortly and it won't be with a Swarovski.
 

spannulman

Well-Known Member
I have a meopta, the basic Artemis, which cost about £300 new a few years ago and it is excellent, although a 1” tube. The same meopta may have gone up in price though whereas S&B prices for the Klassik scopes seem to have gone the other way.

I bought a used 6x42 S&B from a member on here two years ago and it is great, much like the meopta, and I bought last month a new S&B 8x56 for just under £400. It isn’t as big a brute as it sounds and the glass is excellent quality. I don’t think you could beat it for that price.
Both the meopta and Schmidt & bender are as good as each other and i have a swarovski Which I no longer use now and they’re as good quality as that except for the coating on the tube which, on the swaro, is more stipled and feels like it would be less likely to mark.

The only criticism of the S&B in both sizes is that the reticle is thicker than the meopta. I believe that is to help in low light but it means I can’t get such a close group (5 rounds touching @100yd) as with the meopta. Not a big issue for me, and someone told me to use one of the right angles of the cross hairs As the point of aim to get around this. But if you are using it out to 600yd I suggest meopta as the thicker reticle might be a problem for you at longer range.
 

Bowland blades

Well-Known Member
I have a meopta, the basic Artemis, which cost about £300 new a few years ago and it is excellent, although a 1” tube. The same meopta may have gone up in price though whereas S&B prices for the Klassik scopes seem to have gone the other way.

I bought a used 6x42 S&B from a member on here two years ago and it is great, much like the meopta, and I bought last month a new S&B 8x56 for just under £400. It isn’t as big a brute as it sounds and the glass is excellent quality. I don’t think you could beat it for that price.
Both the meopta and Schmidt & bender are as good as each other and i have a swarovski Which I no longer use now and they’re as good quality as that except for the coating on the tube which, on the swaro, is more stipled and feels like it would be less likely to mark.

The only criticism of the S&B in both sizes is that the reticle is thicker than the meopta. I believe that is to help in low light but it means I can’t get such a close group (5 rounds touching @100yd) as with the meopta. Not a big issue for me, and someone told me to use one of the right angles of the cross hairs As the point of aim to get around this. But if you are using it out to 600yd I suggest meopta as the thicker reticle might be a problem for you at longer range.
The good thing about the reticle thickening up at higher mag is you can still use it ! I have a decent leupold on one of my rifles but turn the mag up and the cross hair is way too fine to decern in woodland shade or low light ! I sold off my NF immediately I stopped target shooting
Have three s&Benders on rifles and can and have shot under moonlight on a good full moon with them for fox over bait . No illumination ( I personally hate illuminated reticules ) too distracting and if they are too bright your pupil reacts and closes up your iris
The smallest deer offer a 4" target a fox around half that , your not going to miss because the reticle was a bit fat
Target shooting is a different matter of course , its hard to shoot sub moa if your reticle offer 2 moa
 

Griggo06

Well-Known Member
The good thing about the reticle thickening up at higher mag is you can still use it ! I have a decent leupold on one of my rifles but turn the mag up and the cross hair is way too fine to decern in woodland shade or low light ! I sold off my NF immediately I stopped target shooting
Have three s&Benders on rifles and can and have shot under moonlight on a good full moon with them for fox over bait . No illumination ( I personally hate illuminated reticules ) too distracting and if they are too bright your pupil reacts and closes up your iris
The smallest deer offer a 4" target a fox around half that , your not going to miss because the reticle was a bit fat
Target shooting is a different matter of course , its hard to shoot sub moa if your reticle offer 2 moa
Interested to hear what s and b you have. I'm looking for a new scope and have been told go leupold you won't regret it.
 

DVS1

Well-Known Member
I have the Titan scope on my HMR and a S&B on the 223. I prefer the ret of the S&B as I'm obviously approaching the time of life where my eyes will struggle with the finer ffp rets these days.

The titan is a well built and bright optic, can be fussy on torque specs on the tube which can affect the parallax adjustment. I've used with nv pard007 and it works fine.

In that price range you also now have 2 vortex scopes, the venom and strike eagle. Venom being brand new and the same as the Strike Eagle with a few less features. Also the Sightrons are also a thought but I have no experience with those optics.

My advice would be to try and look through as many optic choices as you can. I find the modern day ffp rets are so fine that I need them at a minimum of 16x or 18x to be able to feel comfy with the ret.

Good luck with the choice 👍
 

Muir

Well-Known Member
Egads! You're buying the canoe paddle?? :eek:
I have the CZ Grendel Varmint (and standard American) and love it. Beware of using too large a piece of glass. This will force you to lose cheek weld. I have a Cabelas-brand 4-16 x 44mm on mine with high Leupold rings and it is too high. I had to add a cheek pad to get a good weld. Not certain if that will be an issue for the MTR but you might want to put off any decision as to a scope until you get the rifle in hand. It will save you money and back-tracking.

Two hundred to 600 is good playground for the Grendel. Our group shoots them to 900 on steel. Large deer to 250 yards, not a problem. One of my favorites.~Muir
 

Bowland blades

Well-Known Member
Egads! You're buying the canoe paddle?? :eek:
I have the CZ Grendel Varmint (and standard American) and love it. Beware of using too large a piece of glass. This will force you to lose cheek weld. I have a Cabelas-brand 4-16 x 44mm on mine with high Leupold rings and it is too high. I had to add a cheek pad to get a good weld. Not certain if that will be an issue for the MTR but you might want to put off any decision as to a scope until you get the rifle in hand. It will save you money and back-tracking.

Two hundred to 600 is good playground for the Grendel. Our group shoots them to 900 on steel. Large deer to 250 yards, not a problem. One of my favorites.~Muir
Why did you put it in High mounts ? 44 mm leoplod on the same IMG_20210531_212211_BURST001_COVER.jpg IMG_20210531_212211_BURST001_COVER.jpg
 

Muir

Well-Known Member
What height are yours? The ones on mine looked high when I pulled it out of the safe to see what scope I actually had on it. I am a fan of low-mounted glass so I can't imagine myself settling for anything higher than necessary but, frankly, I've forgotten the specifics. It was what I had lying around in CZ that worked. I keep telling myself to get a shorter set of rings. ~Muir
 

Bowland blades

Well-Known Member
What height are yours? The ones on mine looked high when I pulled it out of the safe to see what scope I actually had on it. I am a fan of low-mounted glass so I can't imagine myself settling for anything higher than necessary but, frankly, I've forgotten the specifics. It was what I had lying around in CZ that worked. I keep telling myself to get a shorter set of rings. ~Muir
These are the standard height CZ scope mounts carrying the cz brand . The cz have always been funny with mounts so you are best buying tge ones cz offer . To be honest its the same with many rifle makes sako , Blazer being just some of the others
 

Muir

Well-Known Member
These are the standard height CZ scope mounts carrying the cz brand . The cz have always been funny with mounts so you are best buying tge ones cz offer . To be honest its the same with many rifle makes sako , Blazer being just some of the others
I'm not a huge fan of CZ rings. The cap screws have snapped off at 18 in/lb on two sets of mine. Now I just bite the bullet and buy Leupold /CZ rings. Better finish, better fit and made for the CZ receiver.
The last time I looked, the CZ factory rings were all high.~Muir
 

Bowland blades

Well-Known Member
I'm not a huge fan of CZ rings. The cap screws have snapped off at 18 in/lb on two sets of mine. Now I just bite the bullet and buy Leupold /CZ rings. Better finish, better fit and made for the CZ receiver.
The last time I looked, the CZ factory rings were all high.~Muir
Got no more than 1 cm under my 44 mm p/a front ring leupold , cleaning it just now ! Thats on a skinny sporter on a varmint barrel it would be closer . Gun was bought new just over a decade ago cz527 in 22 hornet . My 16 year old daughter was using in this afternoon with a good check weld
Definitely not high mounted
 
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