Hornady 0-give variations

[Waterfollow]

Recently purchased some Hornady 87gr V-max for use in my .243 and some 129gr SST for 6.5x47.

Set about measuring bullet length from base to o-give (just for interest) before loading and was shocked to find that the 87gr had a variation in length of 15 thou from base to o-give and the 129gr up to 10 thou (although slightly more consistant).

Then measured some Sierra Gamekings and Nosler Ballistic Tips that I have in the cabinet and found them to be much more consistant (within approx 1 thou of each other). Which is more like what I would expect from these manufacturers.

Has anybody else experienced such large variations?

Have looked on the net but all I see is good reports about Hornady bullets and about how accurate they tend to be!

Just can't see how a bullet can be accurate and consistent with such large variations such as this!

Any input appreciated.

 

[bewsher500]

have you shot any of them to find out or just measured them?
stop measuring and get shooting!

 

[Waterfollow]

have you shot any of them to find out or just measured them?
stop measuring and get shooting!

Yes I have shot some loads and wasn't happy with the results. I would get three bullets together and a couple an inch or so away. Which i'm guessing is to do with the variation in the amount of bullet seated within the case (up to 15 thou difference).

 

[bewsher500]

try batching them on ogive - base length to exclude it
would be very surprised in a 1"+ pair of flyers was purely down to a 10 thou difference in ogive length.
Bearing surface and base condition are much more likely to impact group size

I have used Interlocks in .224, .243 and .277 to good effect

what else can you tell us about the load and other groups with other ammo?
interesting

 

[Brithunter]

Although this may come as a shock to many ....................................... the bullets don't all come from the same forming die if one sees photos of the machines they have a row of dies and in factories like Hornady there is a row of machines. So there is bound to be some variation as in one box of bullets no one can say how many of them came through the same die.

​Dies also wear in production.

I also wonder how may people actually check the true precision in grouping of themselves and their rifle over a period of time and not just accept a few groups as gospel at what they and it do achieve as a matter of course.

 

[Waterfollow]

Thought about batching them, but don't feel I should have to with what should be a premium bullet. Especially as Nosler and Sierra are able to make consistant sized bullets! Think I will stick with these brands!

I expect to get half inch groups from my loads, if not tighter. Which I generally get from Nosler and Sierra when used in my .243, 25-06 and 300 win mag.

 

[jcampbellsmith]

As Brit says above, there are manufacturing variables. I like the Hornady bullets, but I've been caught out twice when part way through loading up a batch, I have opened a new box and found the dimensions were significantly different.

Regards

JCS

 

[Waterfollow]

Appreciated, there are always going to be variables in the mass manufacturing of anything. But I see 15 thou as a massive variable when talking loading ammunition. I try to work within 1 thou tolerence when trimming cases and seating bullets, etc. To me the idea of loading my own ammunition is to make a clone every time of the bullet that my rifle shoots consistantly.

 

[bewsher500]

Thought about batching them, but don't feel I should have to with what should be a premium bullet.

Whatever you do don't start weighing cases then!
you will go mad!

 

[webley701]

Some years ago I measured the base to ogive dimension on a few bullets from a new box of .308 155 grn Sierra Match Kings using a Stoney Point gauge. The dimension varied by about 20 thou’ (which surprised me) so I measured all 100 of them. If plotted on a graph the dimension would have had a very distinct ‘double hump’ (bimodal) distribution. The variation within each of the two groups was just 2 or 3 thou but the two groups were separated by over 10 thou. Evidently there were bullets in the box from two different finishing dies (from memory around a 60/40 split).

I’ve not seen this as a regular thing with Sierra bullets so I assume this ‘mixing’ was just a bit of a cock-up at the factory. I’ve read that Sierra say that all bullets in a batch come from a single die. Even if correctly segregated it still would have meant that the base to ogive dimension could vary between different batches. Hence I suppose the value of standing advice to check any new batch used (where the dimension is considered critical – it isn’t always).

Berger (for one) say they use a single die per batch & the smaller specialist producers such as JLK, Barts etc certainly use a single die as in some cases they’ve only got one die set anyway. I don’t know if other makers segregate their bullets but as with most things – the cheaper you go the more likely all the production will go into a single bin for boxing hence the situation mentioned by Brithunter.

 

[achosenman]

Hornady are cheap for a reason...you have found it.

Other manufacturer's get better consistency which is why I choose them over Hornady every time I can.

If you get Lapua brass you don't need to weigh cases. Like bullets some are better than others. The worst for me is Winchester...it's pure tat.

ATB

 

[see it shoot it]

Hornady have gone down with the quality of there bullets,if you want consistant accuracy you have to use consistant bullets

 

[sir-slots-alot]

Hornady have gone down with the quality of there bullets,if you want consistant accuracy you have to use consistant bullets

Yes - I would agree with that. Hornady Vmax were a very consistant and well constructed pill.


In the last lot I bought , I noticed that there were differences in the bullet to bullet measurments of both the 87 grn Vmax and 75 grn Vmax - Upto 10 thou in both bullets.

I compared that with the 88 grn Berger BTHP - Less than 1 thou.

Ok - not going to make much difference in accuracy on something th size of a fox - but you pay top dollar and you want a quality product.




ATB
Alan

 

[Muir]

try batching them on ogive - base length to exclude it
would be very surprised in a 1"+ pair of flyers was purely down to a 10 thou difference in ogive length.
Bearing surface and base condition are much more likely to impact group size

I have used Interlocks in .224, .243 and .277 to good effect

what else can you tell us about the load and other groups with other ammo?
interesting

It won't. If you're getting gross fliers it's not the bullet's ogive.
Try seating the bullet to minimal OAL (deep) and shoot them.~Muir