I didn't take my own advice

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Scots_stalker

Well-Known Member
dont ask someone if they have permission

​i was out tonight
with the 243 , As it was getting dark was making my way back to the car when I heard a loud angry voices. I observed a man in his late 40s shouting down his phone . I moved into full view , I took off my hat and face mask , I unclipped my mag and opened and removed my bolt, as I walked towards them (in the direction of my Landy ) another man came into view , he had 2small girls with him , he was carrying a silver barrelled /black stocked rifle which he raised to his shoulder , I coughed to make my presence known , he looked at me and proceeded to fire the gun ( turns out to be an air rifle ). At an angle of 45 degrees to me ,

i said it was good practice to break or unload a gun when approached , straight away the man on the phone said he had permission to be there and had done for years , I asked his name to which he said "your a dick ". I walked passed the group as they were between me and the car. As I did I was called all the effin bs etc etc. I said I was going to call the police as I was assaulted here last December , to which I got told " no wonder you got punched with your ****ing attitude "

i did not reply. But I did indeed call the police who were there within 10 mins and stopped the group out on the main rd.
I spoke to a constable who said straight away that he wasn't taking sides and that the man in his 40s was in a terrible rage with them. He asked if I was ok but didn't take a statement

as I was leaving the farm the group was at the end of the road with an officer. The older man lying on the road on his side. I didn't make any eye contact with them.

Ive come home and written everything down as I remember it happening

at no time did I raise my voice or be rude. Indeed with the small girls there i didn't all I wanted was to get away to my car ,

your thoughts please
 
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norma 308

Well-Known Member
Looks like you did the right thing chap I hope I would have done the same thing .i think if anyone is on your permission with a gun then for safetys sake you should know .
alas too many folk think they can roam where they want .
i would think the police will be in touch soon enough for a statement if you rang them .keep us informed .
regards
​norma
 

al4x1

Well-Known Member
It's usually best to call the landowner in that situation, they will know who has and who has not got the right to be there. They also can decide on a police call some are happier than others to make that call
 

norma 308

Well-Known Member
Ps I assume folk know who has permission to be on the same ground as they use if firearms are being discharged .
 

Dragunov

Well-Known Member
You were well within your rights to contact the police, maybe a quick call to the land owner to update him on what went on so he can call the police if he wants to. It sounds like they were poaching. Interesting that the older guy was being made the lay on the road, the police must have thought he was a threat to them.
 

willowbank

Well-Known Member
This is a scenario that goes on alot more than is realised, bob the builder flush with some cash money walks into the local gunshop and comes away with camo and an air rifle, he knows nothing of the law on firearms or the wildlife and countryside act, he then proceeds to wander through any woodland that takes his fancy and shooting at anything that moves, if challenged he reverts to either a barrack room lawyer or neanderthal man.

My opinion is that the sooner air rifles are licensed in the same way as other firearms the better for all concerned.

I dont like legislation but in the interests of safety and protection of wildlife its about time something was done, imagine the damage that some of these people would do being let loose with a center fire rifle or a semi auto shotgun.

Regards WB
 

finnbear270

Well-Known Member
Your for instance scenario, reminds me of a guy in a near to me shooting school, perusing the air rifles at length....... eventually after much chinwagging, he stated to the salesperson ... "I'll have the one with the wooden Andle":D
 

bobthedug

Well-Known Member
had someone decked him?
​didnt understand this bit

I don't follow this either. Did the cop put him there as he was he posing a threat and the cops colleague remains with you whilst this is going on.
Is he making out you decked him. When did you mention or ask if he had permission as from your story he replied he had when you explained a safety issue.

Are you a witness or possible suspect. Did they or him get detained or taken away in the police vehicle.

From what you say this could be a L O S or a day in court a witness
 

Scots_stalker

Well-Known Member
Sorry. I will expand. The police car apon entering the road to the farm came across the group where one officer detained them , the other officer then drive the police car onwards to the farm where i was awaiting them. After he took my name etc. i left via the same road ( the only one available ). when i passed the group the older man was laying on his side on the grass. He was either resting like this or had been put there by the officer. I did not slow down or make eye contact as i left. This bit of ground has only myself named as a stalker and another chap as a shotguner named as authorised users. So i knew straight away he should not have been there ,
 
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limulus

Well-Known Member
This is a scenario that goes on alot more than is realised, bob the builder flush with some cash money walks into the local gunshop and comes away with camo and an air rifle, he knows nothing of the law on firearms or the wildlife and countryside act, he then proceeds to wander through any woodland that takes his fancy and shooting at anything that moves, if challenged he reverts to either a barrack room lawyer or neanderthal man.

My opinion is that the sooner air rifles are licensed in the same way as other firearms the better for all concerned.

I dont like legislation but in the interests of safety and protection of wildlife its about time something was done, imagine the damage that some of these people would do being let loose with a center fire rifle or a semi auto shotgun.

Regards WB

Willowbank

Please have a read of this:

Gun injury statistics

Air rifle injuries are reducing
ALL injuries involving ALL firearms form less than 0.01/100,000 population (0.00001%). Compare this to the 45-58 killed or seriously injured people per 100000 using cars.
Do we really need any more legislation 'in the interest of safety' for airgun/rifle ownership or is it just the latest political fad to improve our utterly dangerous lives?
 

Apache

Well-Known Member
Ps I assume folk know who has permission to be on the same ground as they use if firearms are being discharged .

I've seen that point made a number of times, but I fail to see the reason. If you accidentally shoot someone whether they had permission to be there or were trespassing you are in bother. It's amazing where walkers and courting couples turn up where they shouldn't be.

Very simply if you only take safe shots with appropriate backstops there is no risk.
 

willowbank

Well-Known Member
there is always "risk"

Agreed there is always risk but we can all do our utmost to minimise any apparent (and that is the word) risk.

My point regarding licensing Airweapons was to prevent people just walking out of a Gunshop with what is a dangerous piece of kit, then shooting any wildlife that they fancy with no comeback whatsoever. I am far from being a killjoy and fully realise that Airguns are for the mostpart the way youngsters get into the sport.

Regards WB
 

bewsher500

Well-Known Member
Agreed there is always risk but we can all do our utmost to minimise any apparent (and that is the word) risk.

My point regarding licensing Airweapons was to prevent people just walking out of a Gunshop with what is a dangerous piece of kit, then shooting any wildlife that they fancy with no comeback whatsoever. I am far from being a killjoy and fully realise that Airguns are for the mostpart the way youngsters get into the sport.

Regards WB


totally agree
most youngsters who start with an air rifle do so under the tutelage and supervision of someone older and responsible
I have air weapons and have no issue with registering it

I see no issue with wholesale registration of a weapon that can put a hole in a piece of board at 30 paces.
what I find odd is that the shooting community instead of getting in on it and dictating how and where the changes take place just rebuff the idea like it is a draconian measure to disarm the public

only those inclined to hide things would avoid registration
 

LuckyEddie

Well-Known Member
totally agree
most youngsters who start with an air rifle do so under the tutelage and supervision of someone older and responsible

I see no issue with wholesale registration of a weapon that can put a hole in a piece of board at 30 paces.
what I find odd is that the shooting community instead of getting in on it and dictating how and where the changes take place just rebuff the idea like it is a draconian measure to disarm the public

only those inclined to hide things would avoid registration

I got my first air rilfe at the age of 17 and taught myself how to shoot since my dad never had a gun and we didn't know anybody who did.

I have no qualms about a licence being introduced as long as it brings benefits and is linked to my FAC.

As it stands I have my doubts as to how great an improvement in public safety the licencing system will produce.
The current set up should work - but it doesn't.
For instance I heard that a gun shop had been selling two air rifles a month for over a year to a guy, who unbeknown to them, was an ex-con.
Until the police were forced to carry out checks on shops selling these types of weapons they had no idea who was buying these types of weapons.

So we end up paying for the police inefficeincy -again!

Ed
 

Amberdog

Well-Known Member
Not good I would also contact Basc etc to get advice....just incase they say you where aggressive towards them etc last thing you need is the boys in blue removing your firearms until it's all sorted

​Amberdog
 

limulus

Well-Known Member
totally agree
most youngsters who start with an air rifle do so under the tutelage and supervision of someone older and responsible
I have air weapons and have no issue with registering it

I see no issue with wholesale registration of a weapon that can put a hole in a piece of board at 30 paces.
what I find odd is that the shooting community instead of getting in on it and dictating how and where the changes take place just rebuff the idea like it is a draconian measure to disarm the public

only those inclined to hide things would avoid registration

I understand your concerns but have to disagree.
Where does it stop? Nail guns for the workplace? A kid making his own bow and arrows? A catapult? The elastic to make a catapult?
I just despise the ever increasing mamby pamby 'it's for your safety' attitude to the diminutae of every day life.
we have perfectly adequate laws already entrenched in our society, lets see those laws enforced instead of imposing more please.
 

Cernunnos

Well-Known Member
dont ask someone if they have permission

​i was out tonight
with the 243 , As it was getting dark was making my way back to the car when I heard a loud angry voices. I observed a man in his late 40s shouting down his phone . I moved into full view , I took off my hat and face mask , I unclipped my mag and opened and removed my bolt, as I walked towards them (in the direction of my Landy ) another man came into view , he had 2small girls with him , he was carrying a silver barrelled /black stocked rifle which he raised to his shoulder , I coughed to make my presence known , he looked at me and proceeded to fire the gun ( turns out to be an air rifle ). At an angle of 45 degrees to me ,

i said it was good practice to break or unload a gun when approached , straight away the man on the phone said he had permission to be there and had done for years , I asked his name to which he said "your a dick ". I walked passed the group as they were between me and the car. As I did I was called all the effin bs etc etc. I said I was going to call the police as I was assaulted here last December , to which I got told " no wonder you got punched with your ****ing attitude "

i did not reply. But I did indeed call the police who were there within 10 mins and stopped the group out on the main rd.
I spoke to a constable who said straight away that he wasn't taking sides and that the man in his 40s was in a terrible rage with them. He asked if I was ok but didn't take a statement

as I was leaving the farm the group was at the end of the road with an officer. The older man lying on the road on his side. I didn't make any eye contact with them.

Ive come home and written everything down as I remember it happening

at no time did I raise my voice or be rude. Indeed with the small girls there i didn't all I wanted was to get away to my car ,

your thoughts please

I am very sorry to read of your experience on this occasion and in the previous one. I'm relatively new to stalking and still have a positive view of the sport. Perhaps with experience, this may change.

By your account, you have been civil and responsible. You have not initiated any verbal or physical confrontation and have contacted the police to voice your concerns. I assume the police obtained your details? If so they may contact you to take a statement at a later date, if necessary. There is nothing to stop you contacting the police to enquire how the matter was resolved. You are a tax-payer. The police work for you (or at least they should. However, I am also painfully aware of their limitations and failings).

It's easy to be wise after the event and I am somewhat reticent about passing comment on other peoples experiences; I think though, if a similar situation arises again, I would be inclined not to engage these individuals (I will refrain from using some of the more descriptive four-lettered nouns I'm thinking of) in conversation and simply call the land owner and police immediately. The police are paid to deal with confrontation. You do not need to place yourself in a stressful position whilst in possession of a firearm. Although sometimes, it's hard not to challenge someone when presented with stupid, thoughtless behaviour.

As for the discussion about airguns, I have always thought that the problem isn't the object itself, but the people who have access to them. Airguns can still be dangerous in the wrong hands and whilst further government meddling in aspects of peoples lives goes against my libertarian tendencies, it may be worth considering incidents such as this (forgive me if anyone has seen this before):

Urban deer face death in agony from armed neds | UK | News | Daily Express

Not to mention the number of cats and dogs that get maimed with airguns by some of the more unscrupulous members of our society.

I would have no concerns about making access to airguns for oxygen-wasters (damn...and I was doing so well) difficult or impossible.

I hope you're OK.

Regards,

A fellow Lanarkshire man.
 
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perdix

Well-Known Member
Ah,the good old Scottish Express!
The reason that this is in the headlines up here at the moment I would imagine is not for anything other than to push along the airgun licencing that Alex Salmond and Co are attempting to bring into force.
The running dog problem has been on-going for years and years.It looks like that because the deer are moving into the urban sprawl instead of the scroates having to get into the countryside to dog them dinner is being brought to them!
The penalties for poaching with air weapons or dogs can be quite severe if the police attending the scene of any capture see fit to push it or the CPS deem it as a worthwhile case.
The problem I found over the last few years is that there seems to be an unwillingness to take offenders through the court system.I have had guns given back to poachers and them sent on their way as well as having no help with "trespass in pursuit of game" prosecutions.
​Like has been said,the laws are there to be used but seem to be ignored.
 
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