Is less gun sometimes more?

[Dickie]

I had a 270 a while back unmoderated, it was a gutwrencher and it hit hard, that got sold off very very cheaply,
Years later at bisley a friend had a McMillan in shortened barrel and a decent moderator i shot 10 rounds through it and it was a delight to shoot and very accurate It was like a tamed tiger compared to the one I had, really nice piece of kit and so easy to shoot no flip no nothing
I’ve been out with another SD member and his 270 is a spot on real capable all round rifle nothing gets up with a 270 certainly puts them on the deck

Im looking to go to one all round rifle for deer and sorta settled on a 260 sauer 4 series i love my friends one he shoots and it fits me nicely I shoot blasers now they don't do a 260 apparently hence a 270 is now on the books possibly

My thinking is now to see how the debacle over lead pans out, i like the idea of just loading for calibre, bloody copper fiasco
My centre fires 22 h, 204, 222,243,6.5 308 the top 3 or poss 4 are the one rifle replacement

222 I use now for Muntjac, Canada’s 204 has taken over on foxes

Get a .260 barrel made for the Blaser.

 

[geoshot]

"Is less gun sometimes more?"
Maybe,
Until recently I owned a very heavy rifle in .308w, it was better as an F/TR rifle than a stalking rifle, but it was incredibly accurate and was a great range toy or high seat rifle.
I also had a semi-custom 30-06 which was very muzzle-heavy and which could be a right pain to stalk with. A rucsac style sling was really the only way to carry the darn thing. Again, seriously accurate rifle and not ammo fussy, but heavy, long and very awkward to carry.
So
I got rid of them and got myself a Sako S20 in 6.5PRC to use as both a stalking rifle and occasional range rifle.
It's much lighter, dead easy to carry and so far has proven itself to be at least as accurate as either of the two rifles I got rid of, maybe even better AND has less muzzle flip than even the heavy 308!
I'll let you know in due course if it's any use on deer, but I'm not expecting any issues in that regard as others here seem to find 6.5PRC, with a decent bullet, to be anything but inadequate for UK deer.
So, maybe less will be more for me right enough - I certainly hope so

 

[Overlay]

Get a .260 barrel made for the Blaser.

Good idea I have 243, and 6.5 , 308 or 222 for donor if needed

 

[tim@tcs]

"Is less gun sometimes more?"
Maybe,
Until recently I owned a very heavy rifle in .308w, it was better as an F/TR rifle than a stalking rifle, but it was incredibly accurate and was a great range toy or high seat rifle.
I also had a semi-custom 30-06 which was very muzzle-heavy and which could be a right pain to stalk with. A rucsac style sling was really the only way to carry the darn thing. Again, seriously accurate rifle and not ammo fussy, but heavy, long and very awkward to carry.
So
I got rid of them and got myself a Sako S20 in 6.5PRC to use as both a stalking rifle and occasional range rifle.
It's much lighter, dead easy to carry and so far has proven itself to be at least as accurate as either of the two rifles I got rid of, maybe even better AND has less muzzle flip than even the heavy 308!
I'll let you know in due course if it's any use on deer, but I'm not expecting any issues in that regard as others here seem to find 6.5PRC, with a decent bullet, to be anything but inadequate for UK deer.
So, maybe less will be more for me right enough - I certainly hope so

I sold a CG63 in 6.5 x 55 to a good friend. I want it back as a high seat quad bike rifle. It’s a heavy target barrel fitted restocked 1938 Service Mauser. It came fitted with scope bases and the trigger has been made really nice. Ten years ago I’d happily have carried it on the hill!

 

[Dickie]

Good idea I have 243, and 6.5 , 308 or 222 for donor if needed

Not so sure you need a donor nowadays, plenty of previous posts from people that have had it done and by whom.
Go for it.

 

[tackb]

Get a .260 barrel made for the Blaser.

or just buy a 6.5 creedmoor barrel for it

 

[Dickie]

or just buy a 6.5 creedmoor barrel for it

Many other 6.5 are available but 260 was mentioned for some perverse reason

 

[Rafter]

I've shot 4 figures worth of deer with a 260, but the absolute fastest drops I can remember were with a 22.250, closely followed by a 6xc using 87grain vmax bullets - neither of which are suitable, according to the online oracles.

I think there is a lot of rubbish talked about calibers and cartridges when the effort should be expended on bullet placement.

My first deer was shot with a .22lr, and it is no more or less expired than one punctured by my 45/70 or anything else I've used.

 

[Heym SR20]

I've shot 4 figures worth of deer with a 260, but the absolute fastest drops I can remember were with a 22.250, closely followed by a 6xc using 87grain vmax bullets - neither of which are suitable, according to the online oracles.

I think there is a lot of rubbish talked about calibers and cartridges when the effort should be expended on bullet placement.

My first deer was shot with a .22lr, and it is no more or less expired than one punctured by my 45/70 or anything else I've used.

Couldn’t agree more. Only addition I would make is choice of bullet type is also important, but shot placement is, as always, key.

 

[Essexsussex]

I must be the only one to spend around an hour looking for a solidly hit deer, due to losing the sight picture, on firing a (.270).
To be fair, it had bang flopped into a hidden narrow moorland gutter.

You aren’t…

 

[Dhindes]

I've shot 4 figures worth of deer with a 260, but the absolute fastest drops I can remember were with a 22.250, closely followed by a 6xc using 87grain vmax bullets - neither of which are suitable, according to the online oracles.

I think there is a lot of rubbish talked about calibers and cartridges when the effort should be expended on bullet placement.

My first deer was shot with a .22lr, and it is no more or less expired than one punctured by my 45/70 or anything else I've used.

Totally agree. I have rifles ranging from 222 up to 9.3x62. Trust me a 260 grain bullet in the wrong place and you have a wounded runner. I would take placement over caliber any time

 

[Heym SR20]

My Heym 243 jumped out of the cabinet this morning. With an 80gn Fox bullet I went for a wander. Thick freezing fog with 150 yards max visibility. After 5 minutes a yearling roe doe popped out. Gralloched, hung it up to cool and took the hound for a scamper.

I have no doubt that as long as I do my bit the 243 with that bullet will happily kill any deer in the UK. Yes on bigger deer, a 130 to 150gn 270, 7mm or 30 cal is probably a better option, but not necessarily needed.

 

[smokey]

Well folks. Been using a .270 for years, since day one really. And for my distances, it’s point, shoot and usually drop on the spot,(if not, then very close).

The old man wanted a rifle for the occasional stalk and I suggested a 6.5x55. I’ve pinched it a few times. It’s accurate, mild recoil,(not that the .270 is bad unless you’re plinking) and the deer drop nearly as well. Possibly marginally less bang flop but there’s nothing in it.


Spoken to a few PH’s recently and for the usual stuff, they’re just using .270’s and .308’s.


Have I missed a trick by not going down the .243 or 6.5 route at the start? Lots of folk have used a .243 for reds for years. I have to say, a factory 6.5 creed or T3 in 6.5 prc does seem like it would tick all boxes.


Anyone down scaled in the past? I have a .222 and refuse to get rid of it because it’s just a delight but I’m getting towards the idea of one rimfire and one,(or in this case 2) smaller CF being appealing.

They are all good some are better than others in one set of conditions depending on weight ,barrel length and bullet weight etc.
I am recoil sensitive so i prefer the lighter bullets and calibres. which means as i move over to non toxic ammo i will probably ditch my 243 after 47 years and go to 6.5 cm in a tikka for general deer control and keep the 270 for the bigger deer i love the 6.5 x55 but there is so much more variety of ammo in 6.5cr

 

[moeggesit]

Well folks. Been using a .270 for years, since day one really. And for my distances, it’s point, shoot and usually drop on the spot,(if not, then very close).

The old man wanted a rifle for the occasional stalk and I suggested a 6.5x55. I’ve pinched it a few times. It’s accurate, mild recoil,(not that the .270 is bad unless you’re plinking) and the deer drop nearly as well. Possibly marginally less bang flop but there’s nothing in it.


Spoken to a few PH’s recently and for the usual stuff, they’re just using .270’s and .308’s.


Have I missed a trick by not going down the .243 or 6.5 route at the start? Lots of folk have used a .243 for reds for years. I have to say, a factory 6.5 creed or T3 in 6.5 prc does seem like it would tick all boxes.


Anyone down scaled in the past? I have a .222 and refuse to get rid of it because it’s just a delight but I’m getting towards the idea of one rimfire and one,(or in this case 2) smaller CF being appealing.

Always use enough gun, there is no such thing as overkill, dead’s dead. It’s better to use more than too little. That said don’t use anything you cannot shoot accurately, that includes developing a twitch.

I have gone down in calibre and back up again, and use 243 and 308 most of the time. .222 does the job but not as well as 243, 243 not as well as 308.

You don’t need smaller calibre to reduce the recoil and scull hammering thunder, simply a moderate calibre choice. 270 is a fine cartridge but I hate it, same as 30-06, noisy without any added benefit. Agreed that a moderator hugely improves both!

You don’t need super high velocity, ever, it needlessly increase recoil and noise, meat damage and does nothing to improve the kill.

2200-2500fps is a nice place to be in terms of velocity and the trajectory makes no difference at stalking distances. Long range target calibres are certainly fashionable but nobody realistically shoots long range while stalking so why would a marginal long range trajectory be of any benefit?
I appreciate that there are specialist applications where a high velocity long range prairie dog calibre is the way to go, for the <0.001% who needs it.

 

[6pt-sika]

Now I find myself reaching for a 6.5x54 MS , 7x57 or 260 REM most often . The 6.5-06 , 270 , 308 , 30-06 , 6mm-06 , 6.5 Sherman Short and 26 Nosler sit in the safe quietly waiting their turn which occasionally comes at best . All of the heavy shoulder bruisers (rifle wise) have gone down the road . I suppose now the most rifle recoil I get is from the 30-06 and 26 Nosler both of which I’ve not fired in two years

 

[GBR66]

I must be the only one to spend around an hour looking for a solidly hit deer, due to losing the sight picture, on firing a (.270).
To be fair, it had bang flopped into a hidden narrow moorland gutter.

Yes been there with a .30-06 - flip and lost it for that fraction of a second when you want to know if it's down or not. I never really had that with .308. However end result has been effective, but do worry about follow up without a dog in dense/lumpy country. Have just bought a 6.5x55 barrel for my Merkel that I plan on using on fallow in Ireland and roe in England - the .30-06 for stags and Sika.