Knives. How do we stand.

basil

Distinguished Member
For all my hunting needs i`ve always used a five inch knife. I`m an ex slaughterman so i have a stash of these and they serve my purpose well, but because times are changing will i still get away with carrying it in my car.
In other words, do i have good reason to carry such a knife??
basil.
 

Andy L

Well-Known Member
Basil, I believe that if you have a lawful need for the knife then you are permitted to carry it in the car and infact on your person if you are off stalking.
 

wadashot

Account Suspended
I think you are right about us having a good reason for carrying a knife, but i would still be very wary of taking one into a shop which is attached to your belt. I have done this a few times in Scotland over the years thinking that the Scots have a more relaxed attitude to shooting related issuse as they are used to seeing people dressed up to go shooting. But it only takes an over the top passer by to see a knife slung around your waste and they will be onto the old bill sharpish, :eek: it`s just not worth the hassle, just rememeber to take it of your belt before leaving the car. ;)

wadas
 

joelewis1971

Well-Known Member
I Must admit I've been wondering about the same things as basil.

I had to go up to London on Friday to see some clients working on the Olympic project.
On the way i had the radio on and the news mentioned what the powers to be wanted to do with kids caught carrying knives after all the stabbings that have happened.

It made me think of all the times i had had a knife as a kid, fishing, shooting , and so on and i was wondering about what would happen if you were caught with them today if you were in your teens

When i remembered my spare Frost clipper knife, sharpening stone, and
Leatherman were in the glove box .


Now i Know i've got reason to have them when out stalking/ fishing
but what about keeping my back ups in the car glove box when not out in the field

Any one know the answer ?


Joe



,
 

basil

Distinguished Member
I think alot of the future "offences" will depend on the officer, for instance, if he decides yes, your a hunter and can relate to your needs of the knife, and you`re not openly displaying it to the public, you might be ok.
On the other hand, if you have an officer who is looking for browny points it could be a different story...........
basil.
 

wadashot

Account Suspended
300wsm said:
I hope all of you are anyway but if you sign yourself up to a Deer road traffic colisions scheme then you would have a reason for carrying a knife
That really wouldn`t work where i live as there`s no deer :eek:

wadas
 

basil

Distinguished Member
300wsm said:
I hope all of you are anyway but if you sign yourself up to a Deer road traffic colisions scheme then you would have a reason for carrying a knife
Thanks for the answer, how do we go about signing up?
basil.
 

stone

Well-Known Member
basil said:
300wsm said:
I hope all of you are anyway but if you sign yourself up to a Deer road traffic colisions scheme then you would have a reason for carrying a knife
Thanks for the answer, how do we go about signing up?
basil.
i am all for this idea wsm but like basil says how?
on approaching west mids police about this they said they use there own poeple to for this, forrest enterprise also told me the same and tonight some one else i spoke told me, that there rangers from the humber to the m25 also deal with there own aswell, so there must be something i am missing here ,which i was going to approach the BDS about next week at the CLA, probaly, you will be the one they direct me too, if you are on the stand on the sunday, if so i shall see you there and we can talk further but for now would not mind a bit more info if you don't mind
cheers mate
 

snowstorm

Well-Known Member
I think you are OK with knives in the car, it's just for carrying one in public you need good reason.

I might be legally allowed to do it, but I doubt I'd walk down a high street with one on my belt, no more than I'd walk down a high street with a gun bag over my shoulder just for the sake of it. I'd just leave it in the car if you were in town.

If I was shooting, and went into town for a paper with my knife on my belt the police could ask why I needed it and I couldn't justify it ! I don't need a knife to buy a paper.

Out of town though you are likely to be able to say you are actively enaged in hunting.
 

JAYB

Administrator
Site Staff
Digging deep into my memory, the prevention of Crime Act 1953 Section 1, I know it is section 1 because there was only one section ;)

Anyway this act was brought in to deal with the "Teddy Boy" thing of whacking each other with bike chains and the like. It is the "offensive weapon" act, and the criteria applied for having whatever could be described as an offensive weapon in your possession was, "lawful authority or reasonable excuse". So if you apply this to the modern day then, when you are engaged on stalking and you have your knives with you then you would have a reasonable excuse. However if you say "had to go up to London on Friday to see some clients working on the Olympic project" and you just happened to have in your possession the knives in your glove box, although you are a stalker you would not be engaged in stalking, therefore your reasonable excuse disappears, Joe!, clean out your glove box.

It was a fine line and depended a lot upon the Police Officer dealing with the situation, but please be aware. I don't know what the criteria for the new legislation is regarding possession of knives, but I am sure that exceptions will be in there. Maybe Swampy could give us the up to date news.

John
 

Pete E

Well-Known Member
I 've had this discussion with the village bobby in the past looking for guidance and I'm still no better off...My question sparked a lively debate between the two PC's in the village station at the time, and this alone opennd my eyes as to how gray the area was!

As already suggested, part of this will come down to the Officers concerned but another big part is the Chief Constables policy...if he happens to have a bee in his bonnet about knives, the message will go down to the rank and file Police that no leeway should be given...

As the law stands, you would need a good reason/reasonable excuse to be in possession of any fixed blade, any locked blade or a conventional folder with a blade of 3" or over if your are in a public place.

So if you are stopped while out stalking you would be fine...

However, if you keep a knife in your vehicle "as a matter of course", you are liable to be done for that as many Police Officers don't consider that "reasonable"...How being a member of a "Deer RTA Scheme" would effect you, I don't know...Again, if the Police wanted, they could simply charge you and let the Courts decide if you were breaking the law or not!

Of course the final judgment will be down to the Courts, but even if your are cleared at that stage, you've still gone through a lot of hassle and I suppose there is possibility that includes having your FAC pulled while its being sorted...
 

basil

Distinguished Member
Can you imagine taking the head off a 400lb Red Stag with a three inch blade? I`m starting to feel sorry for you guys!!
basil.
 

Pete E

Well-Known Member
basil,

If you're taking the head off a stag, cutting steaks for the BBQ or any number number of other legitimate reasons, you use carry a knife with what ever length blade you wish.....The problem comes when your carrying a knife with no apparent good reason at a time and in a place that cause the Police some concern over your true motives..

Regards,

Peter
 

techman

Well-Known Member
Knives, how do we stand

Hi all, Slightly off thread. But.
A few years back a keeper was detained by the police for having a loaded rifle in his vehicle when lamping and travelling from one farm to another.
He was found not guilty by a judge as he ruled that a vehicle was not a public place. Whether this ruling still stands. I do not know but would like the answer.
 

JAYB

Administrator
Site Staff
Part of the wording of what he was charged with would have been that he "had with him in a public place a loaded firearm", and in this case the judges interpretation was that his car was not a public place, therefore his offence did not meet all the criteria of the charge, therefore not guilty.

The prosecution would have been at liberty to have appealed the decision and had the whole matter put before an appeal court. They obviously did not feel it was worth it.

If it had gone to appeal court then the finding of the court would have become what is known as a stated case, which means that there would be a benchmark in relation to those circumstances.

What it does not mean is that those particular circumstances would apply to everyone out lamping and travelling from farm to farm or wherever to control vermin or something similar. The circumstances of each case are peculiar to that case, and even if used in defence cases to show a similarity of offences it is not set in concrete, defence or prosecution councils are there to find loopholes and they do. The vast majority of cases however are so similar that the precedent of a stated case is usually enough to provide clarification of a point, but not always.

So I suppose the answer is, the evidence of the keeper being found not guilty is good evidence for the defence, but it is not the be all and end all.

I bet that really helped :D :D

John
 

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