Lightening a trigger

thomps11

Well-Known Member
Hi all,

Was hoping I could ask the forums advice on something thats been bugging me for a while. I'm shooting a Ruger 77 Hawkeye in .243, really happy with this rifle, its light, rugged and accurate. The one thing that I want to improve on it however is the trigger, I find the pressure a little too much and it ocassionally effects my shot (Well thats what Im blaming it on anyways!)
I've two questions really 1) Can the factory trigger be adjusted, im thinking not.
2) Are there any alternative replacement - adjustable triggers I could fit into this rifle without too much hassle.

Thanks in advance for reading/commenting, your helps always appreciated

steve
 

Claret_Dabbler

Well-Known Member
Order a "Rifle Basix" replacement trigger from Midway or the like. Replace the factory trigger with the new one. Throw the factory trigger over the nearest convenient hedge...
 

dieseldan

Well-Known Member
Have you got a Lansky sharpening kit for knives?

I used my diamond guides on the trigger pall (spelling) and sear and took off all the rough edges and it works a treat. The M77 is a poxy old mauser copy and it is a simple job once you have the stock off.

Only attempt is you are comfy with the process though, a good gunsmith will lighten for an hours labour.
 

Brithunter

Well-Known Member
Have you got a Lansky sharpening kit for knives?

I used my diamond guides on the trigger pall (spelling) and sear and took off all the rough edges and it works a treat. The M77 is a poxy old mauser copy and it is a simple job once you have the stock off.

Only attempt is you are comfy with the process though, a good gunsmith will lighten for an hours labour.
Actually the M77 is heavily influenced by the Mannlicher not the Mauser. I suppose your wonderful Swiss rifle has no Mauser influences at all?

Oh just had a funny thought. My crappy, according to you, BSA only need the ther screws adjusting............................... no stones just one allen key :D. but then it is old school unlike your sooper doopy placcky thing :stir:.
 

jewfish

Well-Known Member
i have just brought a timney trigger from timney in the states £100 to my door fitted it in two mins, dont bother spending good money taking it to a gun smith for ajustments aint worth it throw it! timneys can be ordered with what pull you wish comes with 3 pos safety also you wont be dissapointed
jew'y
 

thomps11

Well-Known Member
Gents,

Hi there, sorry for the delay in getting back to you all been away for a couple of days. Thanks alot for all the advice, appreciate your experience on this. So its either but a replacement (sound pretty easy to fit too!) or do a bit of fettling on the existing trigger components... going by some of my past adventures into DIY i think its best if i go with the replacement trigger system lol

Once again, thanks alot lads hope I can help you out some time in the future

Steve
 

dieseldan

Well-Known Member
I am not interested in viewing you puerile shite anymore and have added you to my ignore list, suggest you do the same.

actually the m77 is heavily influenced by the mannlicher not the mauser. I suppose your wonderful swiss rifle has no mauser influences at all?

Oh just had a funny thought. My crappy, according to you, bsa only need the ther screws adjusting............................... No stones just one allen key :d. But then it is old school unlike your sooper doopy placcky thing :stir:.
 
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Brithunter

Well-Known Member
I am not interested in viewing you puerile shite anymore and have added you to my ignore list, suggest you do the same.
:rofl: Oh dear soemone has chucked the dummy out of the pram :rolleyes:.

Ahhh Steve,

(sound pretty easy to fit too!) or do a bit of fettling on the existing trigger components... going by some of my past adventures into DIY i think its best if i go with the replacement trigger system
If you check the Brownells and Midway USA sites then you will probably find a couple at least of replacement triggers for the Ruger 77 then it just a case of finding a vendor who will sell to the UK or a dealer here with the account to order it for you. Good luck with you venture and let us know how it turns out.
 

dieseldan

Well-Known Member
Ruger Action

I really, really dont want to take the bait on this one again but since the chap that has opened the thread is new I cannot help but point him in the right direction.

Look at the image of a Mauser 98 action, compare it to your Ruger and make your own decision. I am not saying they are the same just open you eyes.

I have one in 223 and I have sorted the original trtigger in less than an hour for free. My friend has one in stainless and was sorted by alex dalgleish gunsmiths in same time. Both shoot really well now.
I do understand that there is a reason for aftermarket triggers in the same way as folk put 20" rims on range rovers,

Some are fitters others others menders and improvers. each to their own.

Be careful of folk that like the sound of their own voice and the over detailed plagiarists out there.
 

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Brithunter

Well-Known Member
Hmmm well this is the Mannlicher Mdl 1903 Shoenauer as this one has the "Shoenauer Rotary magazine":-



Now this is the bolt and extractor:-





Now this is the earlier Mannlicher which uses the same bolt design but a slightly different extractor as it handles a rimmed cartridge rather than the rimless of the Mdl 1903





That's a model 1892 Mannlicher which of course pre-dates the Mauser M98 and the M93. Mauser actually invented the staggered magazine to avoid paying Mannlicher royalties. Bill Ruger was given or acquired a Mannlicher Schoenauer which impressed him and the rotary magazine shows in the Ruger Rim-fires. However as he was selling aminly tot eh US market The Mauser controlled round feed was and in a lot of cases is still seen as the must have on a hunting rifle in the US. The bolt handle mid bolt was seen as a No-No so Ruger adopted a mixture of the ideas and the M77 was the result.

Now although some lay the use of the front twin opposed locking lugs at Mauser's door other gun and rifle makers were also using this idea. We just here commonly about the Mauser and Mannlicher but people forget other parts of the old world were making fine arms to. Russia had quite a few makers and of course the 3 line rifle which we in the UK commonly call the Mosin Nagant was introduced in main steam service witht eh Czars armies in 1891. The Nagant part was Belgian by the way to they were also in the running for using the twin lugged bolt. Being a member of the HBSA and having an interest in the Historic small arms helps here of course ;).

Seeing as how the Mauser commission rifle was heavily Mannlicher influenced and I don't know off hand if it was just the "Packet Loading" system they referred to I would hate to say that Mannlicher or Mauser first used the twin front locking bolt :!:
 

Muir

Well-Known Member
Brit: You certainly have an odd take on American gun makers.

Ruger's rotary magazine was influenced by the Savage Model 1899 rifles, of which he was a big fan, and on which he did much experimental engineering -including, IIRC, converting one to semi automatic. This influence shows in his company's Model 96 Rimfire rifle which uses both the Ruger rotary detachable magazine and the drop-from-lock breech bolt found on the Savage. Savage's influence is evident when you look at the rifle.

The rotary magazine was a stroke of genius for use with the .22LR. As you are aware, due to the rim, most detachable .22 magazines must be "in line, single stack" and curving forward to keep the rims from snagging each other. The rotary magazine allows the cartridges to be kept apart until they are delivered to the integral feed ramp. Not only that, but the magazine takes up only about as much vertical space as a 5 shot single stack, and fits flush. It was perfect for his Ruger 10/22 carbine.

But of course, this has nothing to do with the Model 77 centerfire...

On that subject, the Mannlicher mid bolt a "no-no"? More like "Commercial Suicide". I can guarantee you that Ruger never considered it. American (and most other nationals) shooters would have rejected it. Lack of a rear bridge to mount a scope on would keep the rifles on the shelf gathering dust. I love M/S rifles but I take them in their context: a classic and somewhat "dated" design. (admittedly, I have only one...sigh!)

Do I think they influenced Bill Ruger? Nope. But that's just my opinion. Respectfully....~Muir
 
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Brithunter

Well-Known Member
Hmmm I recall reading in one of the gun digests and it was in there written by an American I might add that the Mannlicher influence of Ruger.. I had forgotten about the Savage and I should not have done as I know someone who collects them.................................................... shush we won't tell him ;)

Myself I have never fallen for the savage under lever and find it ungainly looking. The Mannlicher one was invented and pattended by Schonauer but I am not familiar enough with the savage to say how similar they are :oops:. Others were also playing with rotary magazines I believe..


Oh and in the BSA Armatic .22 semi auto rifle it has a straight twin stack mag that feeds form a central position if memory serves me correctly. I have handled a few but not jumped on one as yet. perhaps one day as it's an interesting little S/A .22 L/R.

Oh sadly I only have a few Gun digests and I don't believe I have that particular one. Another thing on the wish list :rolleyes:
 

Muir

Well-Known Member
You dont like the Savage?? I like them quite a bit tho I don't own one. They used to be cheap and common but now that the 1899 has been discontinued thge prices have climbed. The accuracy of these rifles has always been hit and miss. The one caliber I want is .303 Savage using a .311" bullet. I found one at a gun show a while back but the bore was shot and the man wanted $450 for it. The most common Savages are the late model 99's in .308 and 243. They look cheesey to me as the stocks are impress-checkered and glossy. Oddly, they are some of the more accurate. Huh!

You're right, the rotary magazine was being worked on in a few quadrants back then. I know that Savage demonstrated an early version of his rifle with the rotary magazine in 1892 in Springfield, Massachusetts at the National Armory. He was hoping to garner interest in his rifle as a military weapon. I remember seeing the account of it at the Armory. The two magazines are similar except that the Savage is not as easily maintained and had a brass cartridge "counter " on the side of the action to tell you how many cartridges remained. I am not familiar with the MS's ability to handle fully rimmed cartridges -maybe you could illuminate? The Savage handles either rimmed or rimless.

That BSA sounds cool. I'd like to see one of them: I wonder how the magazine/mechanism decides which stack feeds? You have my permission to buy one and report!:)~Muir
 

Brithunter

Well-Known Member
Ahhh Muir,

The Schoenauer was only offered in rimless cartridges it was the mdl 1892 and 1893 (also know as the Dutch M95) that used the rimmed cartridges and used the Mannlicher packet loading system, which as you know is the spring steel clips that are actually the feed lips of the magazine. However the bolt design except for the extractor stayed the same through to the Shoenauer model 1903, 1905, 1908, 1910, M30 (Greek) and the 1954 Americanised Schoenauer witht eh slanted rearward bolt handle.

Now as for the BSA Armatic well we will see how things go next year with the licence renewal ;) the collection is not complete without one that's for sure and collection is a "GOOD" reason so we shall see :evil:.
 

Muir

Well-Known Member
Yes on the 92 and 93 models: gottcha. But did they ever make any of the spool magazine guns (like the 1903) in a rimmed caliber? I was uncertain. I don't recall any.

That slanted bolt handle is ugly as sin: tank about poor taste! In fact, all the 1954 MS guns look ungainly to me. I'd rather have a good surplus Greek in x54 than one of those.~Muir

PS: I still covet that 1892.....
 

Brithunter

Well-Known Member
As I am feeling wicked here is another that is closer to you now:-












The building int he background is the Bisley Pavilion the rifle is now in teh US and has taken a number of deer there. I just took to photos and sent them over via e-mail with the dealers details they sorted the rest out.

No I have never seen a Schoenaer chambered for a rimmed cartridge but that does not mean that there were none just I have never seen them of heard of them. I feel it's unlikly they made them in rimmed calibres but :-|
 

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