MOTO service station parking fine

paultap

Well-Known Member
Hi guys

I recently parked at a moto service station (near Cardiff) and apparently exceeded the free parking period which was two hours. I say apparently, as I didn't see or realise that there was a time limit, although supposedly there is a sign stating this.

I was in the service station waiting to receive a phone call from a pigeon guide who was supposed to be looking for a location and then to tell me where to meet him, most annoyingly I got no phone call and my phone calls to him went unanswered.

Anyway, I received a notification through the post with photos of my car shown entering and leaving the service station. The company "CP Plus" are demanding £100 or £60 if paid within 14 days, they have even included a pharagraph siting a landmark Supreme Court ruling that a parking charge notice on private land is enforceable.

Before I pay up, does anybody have any experience of such fines and if they are enforceable.

many thanks.
 

Highlandsjohn

Well-Known Member
My wife received one similar in a tk max deserted car park she used to turn safely at 9pm.
The general consensus (on line experiences) was to ignore it. Google may be your friend here..
 

re'M'ington

Well-Known Member
Google it Paul,but I am sure I read that as long as you don't enter into any conversation or any communications with them then there is no contract,and I believe that is the point.I also read that someone said while parking he left a note on the car saying that this car has been left here illegally and that somehow counts too,but you need to do some proper research,or if you are a bit flush give it a go and just ignore them to see how far they go,worse case scenario it will cost you £100 rather than £60,keep us in the loop mate it will be interesting.

Martin
 

nun_hunter

Well-Known Member
I went through this recently and found POPLA.co.uk a great help.

Bottom line is that things have changed since 2012 when before that you could just ignore them and nothing would happen. The fact that they have written to you after the fact means they're affilliated to an official parking body which means they have access to the DVLA database and if you ignore them you'll likely find yourself in court (or at least the threat of court). If you have a genuine greivance the fine is disproportionate or lack of signs (you state you didn't see a sign and so werent aware. So was the signage adequate?) then lodge an appeal. The appeal will be bolstered by photographs of the signs and the fact they werent clear or were hidden from view etc.

Best case is you win the appeal and don't pay, or likely they lower the fine from £60. Worst case you end up in court and pay the fine plus costs and maybe more.
 
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enfieldspares

Well-Known Member
First if it is described anywhere as a "fine" it is illegal. Bill of Rights. Same one that the Government is coming uo against in the Supreme Court under Article 50..except their's is a different section.

So it can't be enforced. So what they've presumably done is make a "Parking Charge" to which...on a big notice...by parking there you've agreed in contract to accept. It's that interpretation acceptance of a contract by action that the Courts will have stated cases on.

So they must prove that contract existed.

YOU DO NOT HAVE TO VERBALLY AGREE TO A CHARGE FOR A CHARGE TO BE ENFORCEABLE UNDER CONTRACT LAW - ACCEPTANCE BY DEED IS SUFFICIENT.

Some of that will reference that the notice must be visible and able to be seen as you enter the premises. So a notice inside a snack bar there isn't sufficient if it isn't anywhere else!

At the very least they MUST be able to provide evidence of the actual sign that you were supposed to have seen AND that you could have been reasonably been expected to see it. It isn't enough to show you merely entering or leaving. You must be proven to have seen the sign.

However it may be worth a contavct direct to Moto. Explain that you were tired, felt it unsafe to drive on without a rest, thought that it might be half an hour but in fact "time flew by". Also explain that there was no notice...that you were aware of explaining how you could PAY (or needed to PAY) to have a prolonged stay. Then ask for their opinion.
 
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nun_hunter

Well-Known Member
First if it is described as a "fine" it is illegal. Bill of Rights. So it can't be enforced. So what they've presumably done is make a "Parking Charge" to which...on a big notice...by parking there you've agreed in contract to accept. It's that interpretation acceptance of a contract by action that the Courts will have stated cases on.

Some of that will reference that the notice must be visible and able to be seen as you enter the premises. So a notice inside a snack bar there isn't sufficient if it isn't anywhere else!

At the very least they MUST be able to provide evidence of the actual sign that you were supposed to have seen AND that you could have been reasonably been expected to see it.

However it may be worth a contavct direct to Moto.
Explain that you were tired, felt it unsafe to drive on without a rest, thought that it might be half an hour but in fact "time flew by". Also explain that there was no notice...that you were aware of explaining how you could PAY (or needed to PAY) to have a prolonged stay. Then ask for their opinion.
This is definitely worth it, especially if you mention how often you use their services. My mum had a charge from a Lidl car park and complained to Lidl direct after the parking company weren't interested in waivering the charge. She contacted Lidl showing them a copy of her receipt from the shopping she did and that she shopped their reguarly and in the end Lidl contacted the parking company and got them to rescind the ticket.
 

enfieldspares

Well-Known Member
In another life...well a current life but I don't do it that way anymore...I used to regularly leave my car at Moto Service Stations for four days. From years 1999 to about 2004. The standard charge then was £6.00 a day and you paid at the cafe and either they put the car details in a book or you got a ticket to put in the windscreen. We didn't like the tickets for the obvious reason it showed that your car was unattended for four days.

Some services made no charge...but still asked you let them know so they could record it.

Certainly this still goes on. Feeder drivers and tour managers for coach tours. Where the feeder and main driver will change at the service station when, say a part from Yorkshire is going to Paris and so will take on the main driver at Donington Services or Dover Services (Moto) and may have been there two or more hours waiting if the tour coach has been delayed either outward (M1/M25) to Dover or inward from France by ferry problems in the Channel.

Now none of this applies to you UNLESS you made enquiry at the cafe and were told you were waiting for someone by a pesron inside the Service Station or in the parking that you thought spoke with the authority of Moto that "It's OK...don't worry about it". But...as it may go to Court don't make this up if you didn't!
 
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Pedro

Well-Known Member
My thoughts are that it could well be enforceable (not really sure though), but many aren't enforced ultimately. They will threaten to take you to court and send you notices etc. until it comes time to take you to court. Many just then seem to give up. I expect that the cost of taking you to court isn't worth it for £100, even if they are awarded costs.

The other way to look at it is to judge what aggravation you will go through if you don't pay it. You may well decide that it's worth paying £60 just to avoid the hassle, a valid viewpoint, but one the parking company often relies on so that people pay. So that'll depend on the thickness of your skin. It is probably worth checking up on the signing though. Assuming you live fairly close. You could spend £60 on fuel just doing that!
 

biffo

Well-Known Member
Ok, so the deal is that the implied contract is with the driver of the vehicle. Not the owner. You are under no obligation before court or at court to state who the driver was, the onus is on them to provide evidence. Ignore, ignore , ignore. If you felt like it ask them for photographic evidence of who the driver was at the time. They will babble on about the owner being liable but that is just babble. Ignore. And they will go away.
 

plonker

Well-Known Member
If you don't fancy trying your luck then tell them you were extremely I'll and needed the time to recover.
Dave
 

Archer

Well-Known Member
A friend of mine overstayed by about 15 mins - (genuine as I was with her) in what we thought was a council P&D car park.
It turned out to be a private car park which,when we checked, is signed - but not that well.

Anyway, first she knows is when bailiffs arrive with a writ issued by the courts.
Why?
Well she had moved just before the event, failed to notify the DVLA which meant all the paperwork went to her old address and the new occupants didn't send the mail on (yep, 2 mistakes there- tell DVLA and also pay to have post redirected)

Bottom line?
For all those who say ignore it, this tale proves it can end up very costly ,so I would say
"If you were over 2 hours pay the £60 "
 

timbrayford

Well-Known Member
Presumably they will use what used to be called the Small Claims Court, if this is the case then apply for the proceedings to be transferred to your local court. If this will involve them in a lot of travel they may abandon their claim if the costs of them attending are in excess of the £ 100 that they are claiming. As others have said though google first to find the best defence.
 

Loki

Well-Known Member
Dont Pay...

Hi

This website seems to help a lot of people:


  1. http://www.donotpay.co.uk/signup.php.
  2. This one also advises options:http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/reclaim/parking-ticket-appeals.
From recollection the ruling was that it was for the site/their agents as in the Car Parking Management, to prove that the loss of the space left them significantly out of pocket (another customer could not use the space hence loss of earning) and that the 'fine' or whatever was reasonable compensation to offset this.

I would suggest perusing 2 first and then 1.

L
 

Archer

Well-Known Member
How about using Google maps/street view to see the entrance road/ car park?.
That way you will see if there are any signs displayed
 
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old man

Well-Known Member
A friend of mine overstayed by about 15 mins - (genuine as I was with her) in what we thought was a council P&D car park.
It turned out to be a private car park which,when we checked, is signed - but not that well.

Anyway, first she knows is when bailiffs arrive with a writ issued by the courts.
Why?
Well she had moved just before the event, failed to notify the DVLA which meant all the paperwork went to her old address and the new occupants didn't send the mail on (yep, 2 mistakes there- tell DVLA and also pay to have post redirected)

Bottom line?
For all those who say ignore it, this tale proves it can end up very costly ,so I would say
"If you were over 2 hours pay the £60 "
Probably the correct answer, I know it's like rolling over but you need to protect your ticket?
 

Essex stalker

Well-Known Member
There was a case of this in Chelmsford about a year ago and the chap decided not to pay and took it all the way to the high court where he lost his case and ended up having to pay. It made the tv news etc.
 

otbed

Well-Known Member
Some good websites for advice as given above. But also remember that any 'contract' with the parking company is between the driver and the company, NOT the registered keeper. If you were not the driver but merely the Registered Keeper they have a problem because they'll never be able to enforce the charge on you. Question is, have you admitted being the driver? As the RK you are not obliged to tell anyone who was driving your car (in a private, non-public car park or highway of course) on the day. Merely tell them it wasn't you and invite them to send their claim to the driver and not to bother you again.
But research it first. They'll keep trying over a long period to frighten you into paying but ultimately they only have a claim against the driver. It is a PITA but maybe it would be easier to pay up.
 

Archer

Well-Known Member
Don't pay, how to wriggle, don't tell them your name Pike suggestions being made but how about Standards and Values?

You use a motorway service car park, it isn't waste land, it has been created by somebody so why should you not expect to pay for its' use? and what if someone damages your car? would you tell the person responsible to duck and dive to avoid being identified?

Anyway, back to the OP, if he used the Moto Services car park M4 J33 there is a VERY clear sign stating terms and conditions for free parking as you enter the car park and, I bet, others attached to posts in the car park as well so unless he can prove he stayed under 2 hours the operators are acting according to the terms and conditions shown on the sign
 

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