New 308W 110 and 130 grain TTSX loading data from Barnes recently published.

Alantoo

Well-Known Member
Barnes have new reloading data for the 110 and 130grain TTSX in .308W on their website. It differs slightly from the data they emailed to me and I posted here earlier.

130grain COAL now down another 0.050" to 2.735"

Alan
 
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nun_hunter

Well-Known Member
I may have another go with the Barnes then as the 130 wouldn't group at all in any powder weight so maybe the new shorter length will help.
 

Alantoo

Well-Known Member
I may have another go with the Barnes then as the 130 wouldn't group at all in any powder weight so maybe the new shorter length will help.
I am still going around and around with them.

I had some 5 shot groups between 0.6" and 0.7" with 2.8 grammes (43.2grains) of H335 and 0.8" with 3.08 grammes (47.5 grains) I went with 3.08 load in order to keep the speed high (it was 3007 to 3024fps)

I have subsequently had occasionally larger 5 shot groups averaging 1.4" with that load which although fine for deer at the range I am shooting has been irritating me, so my next trip to the range will be with some of the 2.8 grammes loads... which are still running 2875fps-ish so quite fast enough for my distances.

I have also just picked up a tub of N135...could not find any more H335... to try with both the Barnes and the 125g GMX.

Alan
 

takbok

Well-Known Member
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Can't work out any of the groups that I should try again at the new COAL or abandon the Xterminator and try a new powder!! It's a 243 case for size reference but 308 that I was shooting.
I had the same sort of groups from my .222 with the 45gr TSX and Xterminator at 2.130" recommended COAL. I ended up trying 2.170" COAL (roughly .020" from rifling) which improved groups quite a bit.
 

Yorric

Well-Known Member
Varget works for me behind 130grn 308 TTSX. I use a top end charge weight & big jump to the lands & get over 3000ft/sec with good groups. :D
Ian
 

Alantoo

Well-Known Member
Can't work out any of the groups that I should try again at the new COAL or abandon the Xterminator and try a new powder!! It's a 243 case for size reference but 308 that I was shooting.
What with factoring in the odd flyer and the jerk on the end of the trigger, analysing these things is really problematic! I have come to the conclusion that on a good day I am about 0.5MOA capable and the rifle and ammunition is about 0.5MOA so if I am to the right and the rifle is to the right it will end up 1" to the right and if both to the left it will be 1" to the left...most will come somewhere within the 0.5" from POI. But the group size is likely to be up to 2".

Great article here... http://www.rifleman.org.uk/Fuller_group_diagnosis.htm

And here...http://www.6mmbr.com/verticaltips.html


These were my load development shots at the tunnel range.
IMG_3087.jpg


But the next two targets were off quad sticks and seemed to be following a vertical stringing pattern...Barrel warming up?..jerk on the trigger being consistently inconsistent?

IMG_3088.jpg


The last seemed to confirm the barrel warm up because the cold barrel first shots on 5 consecutive days were okay.

IMG_3089.jpg

Be interesting to see what the new COAL and the slower speed does.

Alan
 
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nun_hunter

Well-Known Member
I think I'll try some of the lower charges and vary the seating depth. I had read that article before and although very good and explained things very well it gave me less confidence in my ability! Which probably isn't such a bad thing.
 

scotch_egg

Well-Known Member
I tried some 125gr SST through my blaser and had similar results to nun hunter. I loaded to 2.8 oal. I believe a larger jump will benefit from reading this information. I will pick up TTSX if I can find them in stock locally.
 
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Alantoo

Well-Known Member
I think I'll try some of the lower charges and vary the seating depth. I had read that article before and although very good and explained things very well it gave me less confidence in my ability! Which probably isn't such a bad thing.
Exactly what I found too :(

At least it meant that I did not fool myself with a three shot group which many seem to be happy to trust. A ten shot 1.5" should actually be more conclusive and confidence inspiring than a three shot 0.5" clover leaf...I keep telling myself! :)

Alan
 

NigelM

Well-Known Member
I'm not using in a .308, but in both 6.5 and 280 I am grouping best at 80 to 100 thou off the lands. Groups are about 0.3 MOA. Loading much longer than that and the groups soon open up to 1". Everything I read says they like a lot of jump which has been backed up by my experience.
 

nun_hunter

Well-Known Member
Definitely going to try them again with a longer jump as I got quite disheartened after £50 worth of bullets alone not to mention powder etc and my time.
 

nun_hunter

Well-Known Member
Exactly what I found too :(

At least it meant that I did not fool myself with a three shot group which many seem to be happy to trust. A ten shot 1.5" should actually be more conclusive and confidence inspiring than a three shot 0.5" clover leaf...I keep telling myself! :)

Alan
Yeah this is what I've done previously with load development. After the initial powder charges to develop I've shot much larger groups of 6 rounds plus. It's amazing how many times on here of Facebook I see a two short group and the shooter saying how good it is.
 

Southern

Well-Known Member
Since such tiny groups are not necessary for hunting inside 200 yards or so, if you plan to take shots of 300, 400, or more yards, you need to shoot groups at those ranges, from the bench, then from hunting positions: off sticks, sitting, prone, kneeling, with and without makeshift rests like day packs.

It is not only your skills, but some loads actually don't stabilize fully at 100 yards, and will shoot a 1.5 MOA group at 100, but a .7 MOA group at 300. So, at least shoot your promising load at 200, to see what it is doing out there at a range you may use it in the field.
 

srvet

Well-Known Member
Since such tiny groups are not necessary for hunting inside 200 yards or so, if you plan to take shots of 300, 400, or more yards, you need to shoot groups at those ranges, from the bench, then from hunting positions: off sticks, sitting, prone, kneeling, with and without makeshift rests like day packs.

It is not only your skills, but some loads actually don't stabilize fully at 100 yards, and will shoot a 1.5 MOA group at 100, but a .7 MOA group at 300. So, at least shoot your promising load at 200, to see what it is doing out there at a range you may use it in the field.
i have heard of bullets that supposedly don't stabilise at short range but then group better at long range but cannot for the life of me see how this is possible. Unless of course the bullets are somehow guided after firing or capable of defying physics! Has anyone tried mythbusting this one or is there a reason why a bullet will change its trajectory down range. It seems more likely that in the past someone shot a duff group at 100 then a good group at longer distance leading to this urban legend!
 

NigelM

Well-Known Member
i have heard of bullets that supposedly don't stabilise at short range but then group better at long range but cannot for the life of me see how this is possible. Unless of course the bullets are somehow guided after firing or capable of defying physics! Has anyone tried mythbusting this one or is there a reason why a bullet will change its trajectory down range. It seems more likely that in the past someone shot a duff group at 100 then a good group at longer distance leading to this urban legend!
The theory is that the faster the bullet is travelling the higher the spin rate required to stabilise it. A bullet can leave the barrel too fast for spin rate of the barrel, therefore unstable, but as it slows the spin rate becomes adequate and the bullet stabilises itself.
 

srvet

Well-Known Member
The theory is that the faster the bullet is travelling the higher the spin rate required to stabilise it. A bullet can leave the barrel too fast for spin rate of the barrel, therefore unstable, but as it slows the spin rate becomes adequate and the bullet stabilises itself.
Can we overstabilise a bullet or are we just seeing poor accuracy associated with damage to the projectile caused by the excessively fast twist for the velocity? What doesn't hold true is how a bullet that has dispersed by a given amount (1.5 MOA) at 109 yards will miraculously be drawn back in to a 0.7 MOA by 300 yards. If this occurs with regularity then some bullets must be changing direction mid flight
 

A Guy Out West

Well-Known Member
Clean all the copper out of your barrel. I mean all of it. Barnes bullets usually shoot best from a really clean barrel. Don't ask me why.
 

Glyn 1

Well-Known Member
i have heard of bullets that supposedly don't stabilise at short range but then group better at long range but cannot for the life of me see how this is possible. Unless of course the bullets are somehow guided after firing or capable of defying physics! Has anyone tried mythbusting this one or is there a reason why a bullet will change its trajectory down range. It seems more likely that in the past someone shot a duff group at 100 then a good group at longer distance leading to this urban legend!
I don't fully understand how this works but my .30-'06 consistently shoots better at 200m than 100m with 165grn bullets.
 

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