Penned deer escapies

jtl

Well-Known Member
A farmer friend has a ten reds and two escaped and have been out for 3months, my question is can I shoot these out of season as farmed beast or do they classify as wild beast and must be dealt with within the normal season. Two hinds, one now with calf
 

IanLuc

Well-Known Member
I was just about to ask a similar question. A friend in perthshire has about 20 escapees running around, I am heading up to try for a stag in 3weeks but hinds will be out.
 

timbrayford

Well-Known Member
The Forestry Commission have helped to defined this:-
"deer that have escaped from captivity and are not visibly marked are considered feral wild deer"
 

countrryboy

Well-Known Member
If they are visibly tagged is there then ownership issues with the vension or live deer?

Assuming there on someone elses land
 

timbrayford

Well-Known Member
If they are visibly tagged is there then ownership issues with the vension or live deer?

Assuming there on someone elses land
If they are visibly tagged they are treated exactly the same as any other escaped livestock e.g. sheep or cattle, and even whilst they are on your land remain the property of their owner, in brief:-

You may detain the animal and if it is not claimed within 14 days you may sell it at public auction , the owner being liable for any damages caused

You may not kill the animal (criminal damage) without the permission of its owner

You may not keep the carcase (theft) again without the permission of its owner
 

Ben1987

Account Suspended
I believe they are now wild and that the normal seasons apply. How did he TB test them?
Slightly off topic but regarding tb tests, I was speaking to a farmer and haulier about cattle to tests on Saturday...if they're subject to the same sanctions as cattle then they only need tb test of you're going to move them i.e sell them either through an auction or direct to another farm. If they're going direct to slaughter you don't need to test them before they go - I buy a deer from you, you test it, that test is valid for 60days, I then keep it for 12 months and take it straight to the abbatoir and no need for a test. You'd only need to test a straight to slaughter animal if the previous owner got a reactor and then for traceability the ministry contact you and ask you to test animal X.
 

howa243

Well-Known Member
Slightly off topic but regarding tb tests, I was speaking to a farmer and haulier about cattle to tests on Saturday...if they're subject to the same sanctions as cattle then they only need tb test of you're going to move them i.e sell them either through an auction or direct to another farm. If they're going direct to slaughter you don't need to test them before they go - I buy a deer from you, you test it, that test is valid for 60days, I then keep it for 12 months and take it straight to the abbatoir and no need for a test. You'd only need to test a straight to slaughter animal if the previous owner got a reactor and then for traceability the ministry contact you and ask you to test animal X.
I was just trying to get a feel for whether they were 'farmed' or not. If they are farmed then seasons don't apply but I believe they would have to be slaughtered at an approved establishment. If they are not then the normal seasons apply irrespective of whether they are within a fence or not. I think.
 

Duncs

Well-Known Member
If they are tagged....what is to say they have not been injected with something not suitable for the food chain? Or are all "injections" safe now? Thanks for any reply.
 

enfieldspares

Well-Known Member
Like Tim B says. If tagged and marked they are 'property' and so remain in the ownership of the farmer AND the farmer remains liable for any damage they cause. There's statute law on damage and liability of escapees and a third paty landowner's right to 'take' them.

Yet, oddly, tagged pheasants, aren't seemingly 'property' thus as only 'property' can be stolen the offence of poaching for they LIKE WILD DEER belong or the right to 'take' them belongs to the owner of the land on which they are found.
 

Salvo

Well-Known Member
Tagged (escapee) or not, why would you want to shoot them 'out of season'?
 
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baguio

Well-Known Member
If they are visibly tagged they are treated exactly the same as any other escaped livestock e.g. sheep or cattle, and even whilst they are on your land remain the property of their owner, in brief:-

You may detain the animal and if it is not claimed within 14 days you may sell it at public auction , the owner being liable for any damages caused

You may not kill the animal (criminal damage) without the permission of its owner

You may not keep the carcase (theft) again without the permission of its owner
Just because they have a tag on them doesn't mean that you can establish ownership without shooting them. I realise that you know who the owner is in this case but in general I suspect that it wouldn't be so easy? A tagged deer could have been living wild for a considerable length of time and be in a different county to it's original home!
 

timbrayford

Well-Known Member
Just because they have a tag on them doesn't mean that you can establish ownership without shooting them. I realise that you know who the owner is in this case but in general I suspect that it wouldn't be so easy? A tagged deer could have been living wild for a considerable length of time and be in a different county to it's original home!
Even so the law still applies (Animals Act 1971), time & distance do not appear to be of significance.

It must be extremely difficult even if you spot the tag to start with, reading it and contacting the owner must be quite challenging, let alone contacting them and seeking their permission to kill the creature.

If you fail to spot the tag and Mr Plod catches you in possession of the carcase you have potentially committed at least two serious criminal offences (criminal damage & theft)
 

Ranger22

Well-Known Member
I have shot tagged deer, it is very difficult to see the tag until it is on the deck. The last one was a hind, the tag was hidden inside the ear. The outer part of the tag wasn't there, if it had been there it may well of been easier to spot it was a tagged beast. The nearest deer farm was forty miles away, the owner was informed but he didn't want the carcass returned.
 

novice

Well-Known Member
I have shot tagged deer, it is very difficult to see the tag until it is on the deck. The last one was a hind, the tag was hidden inside the ear. The outer part of the tag wasn't there, if it had been there it may well of been easier to spot it was a tagged beast. The nearest deer farm was forty miles away, the owner was informed but he didn't want the carcass returned.
40 miles? Wow that's some distance. Was that cross open hill ground?

Novice
 

baguio

Well-Known Member
40 miles? Wow that's some distance. Was that cross open hill ground?

Novice
But 40 miles could have been over several years. In which case it's not very far at all! Even the fattest of us probably cover 40 miles in a year whilst stalking?
 

Pedro

Well-Known Member
Here's some food for thought.

Okay, so you rear animals or birds, having bought them or bred them, watered them, fed them, seen to their vets needs, no doubt involving a lot of working hours over a long period, with the intention of getting something back, whether that's sport, food or both. There's a fair investment in bringing these creatures to the condition where they can be harvested.

Now, for a minute, just forget about the law. Forget about whether these are wild, property, game, or whatever else in the eyes of the law. Forget about where they have escaped or wandered to. What would you think after putting in that effort and cost if someone just comes along, shoots them and carts them off?

I can understand it perhaps if the creatures have been abandoned, but just because they have strayed onto someone else's land, doesn't mean that they have been abandoned.
 

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