Permission from Land Owner.

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tomtom

Member
I have a questions relating to this wording.

Must the permission to shoot on a bit of land come from the land owner or is the lease holder of an area of land able to grant written permission?

Thanks in advance,
Tom
 

snowstorm

Well-Known Member
You can only have permission from the lease holder if the terms of the lease from the land owner allow him/her to grant that permission.

There is also a difference between leasing the actual land, and the right to shoot on it.
 

swampy

Well-Known Member
snowstorm is right on that. it maybe that the stalking rights are further sublet. ie you have the land owner who leases the land to a farmer, the sporting rights may or may not be in that and the sporting tennant may or may not be able to sublet the stalking. :eek:

it can be jolly complex
 

Rangefinder

Well-Known Member
The landowner may not be the one who holds the shooting rights either, they do not necissarily go hand in hand. :eek:
 

tomtom

Member
Hi folks, I have another question on this topic, if I may..

How should written permission be presented? What does it need to say, do you need grid refs for the land and description or can it just say any land owned by xxxx? How does the proximity of house affect permission validity, is it acceptable to shoot part of a field where it is safe to do so but not another part because its close to houses, would permission be denied over all of the land because of this?

Cheers,
Tom
 

Rangefinder

Well-Known Member
Tom

Blimey you like the complicated questions, but here goes:

It all depends on your circumstances and that of the land.

If you have an "open" ticket it really does not matter but seeing as you have asked I assume you do not have an open ticket?

It therefore really depends on the topography, size, location etc and I can't be anymore specific than that on what information you have provided.

Do you have an ariel photo of the piece of land?

RF
 

Bandit Country

Well-Known Member
Presented to whom? Insurers, police ..... If this is the land you will be shooting over and it is an intial application for an FAC the FLO will need to approve the land for your calibre. Mark the area on a map and send it in with a letter from the owner or whoever owns the rights AND can grant permission. It may have already been cleared, or it may have restrictions e.g you can't shoot east to west because of a footpath, or whatever. If you already have a ticket but are adding new land the same thing pretty much applies; unless you have an open ticket, when as RF says, it really doesn't matter.
Thing is, different forces can do things differently. I would suggest you talk to your FLO, and get their thoughts as they will be the ones making the decisions - not us! If they come back with a view or decision that you think is unreasonable then you should post it on here and sit back and enjoy all the moaning, whinging and hard luck stories about FLOs and their ancestry that will inevitably follow! :lol:
 

enfieldspares

Well-Known Member
As far as "permission" is defined it is from the person who not only must have the "sporting rights" but also the right to assign them to any other. However it is often the case that there may be a retention by the landowner for "sporting rights" to him or her in person or to his or her family or friends IN ADDITION to that grant to another.

Thus when I owned a pond my lease assigned the "fishing rights" to a fishing club for the coarse fish (but in that lease allowed myself the retention of two rods as in two fishermen) to be retained. But the remaining "sporting rights" and the SHOOTING RIGHTS were fully retained by me.

Also, I think, the Ground Game Act is relevant in the case of rabbits in that notwithstanding who has or does not have the "sporting rights" an occupier (and a defined class of person authorised by that occupier) is entitled to kill rabbits in certain circumstance.
 

enfieldspares

Well-Known Member
In relation to the form it takes keep it simple. A note saying that "Mr J Smith has permission to shoot over the land known as Jones' Farm" is more that sufficient.

Or Jones may add "for deer" or "for foxes" or "for any quarry as her sees fit with shot gun or rifle".

If you have an Open Licence that is all that is needed. If the FEO needs more - it may be that Jones' Farm is well known to him or if in another police force area well known to them - he or she will ask.
 

1820

Active Member
OK OK OK

Yes I am in the same spot of bother!!

where can I down load a generic form that I can just fill in, the blancks , have sighned and send in to the police dep. ??

there must be one some where shurly, or could we put one together on this forum ?? who is a leagal bof??

then I was also thinking .. OK stop lafing I do try to have a little insperation on ocasion..

how about a letter that , or flyer I can drop off at potential land owners/ farmers..

some thing like :

sir maddam , I would ask if you grasoiusly take the time to look at my request ?
I would very much like to Hunt dear/ rabit / what ever , and as I live in the area who would I have to contact to gaine permition for the ocasional use of the wood/forist/ hill/ open land. near you aboude?

bla bla bla

yours ... pleas call number***** any time

hope to hear from you soon..



so what do you guys think??
 

Bandit Country

Well-Known Member
Re: OK OK OK

1820 said:
so what do you guys think??

Been suggested before, mate. The consenus view was that face-to-face wins every time over sending letters - although I'm sure someone will jump in now and say how it worked for them! :lol:
 

IanF

Well-Known Member
1820

Without wishing to be rude - you will only ever get one chance to make a first impression.

Unfortunately, your written presentation lets you down badly. Please do not take this as an insult, as I am trying to make a helpful observation.

If you do decide to go along the path of producing a printed letter or flyer, get someone to help you ensure it is correctly spelled and punctuated.

It may be the difference between your contact details being filed for later, or being screwed up and binned!

Good luck! :)

Rgds Ian
 

Chris Rob

Well-Known Member
Hi Tom

This is the text of my permission letter. The leaseholder conferred with the landowner & gained his OK for me to shoot. A copy of the letter was forwarded to Thames Valley Police Firearms Department so its on record.

avatar_4996.gif

Chris


Grant of Permission to Shoot Deer & Vermin

This is to confirm that:

Mr. INSERT NAME OF SHOOTER (of)

INSERT ADDRESS OF SHOOTER


Has in the form of this written notice, duly signed & authorised by me, been granted permission to shoot Deer & Vermin on land situated at:

INSERT ADDRESS OR LOCATION OF LAND

Using Centre Fire Rifle, Rimfire Rifle & Shotgun.

By myself:

INSERT NAME OF LANDOWNER OR LEASEHOLDER (of)

INSERT ADDRESS OF LANDOWNER OR LEASEHOLDER



Being the rightful and legal leaseholder/landowner (delete as appropriate) of the above-mentioned land.

I understand that INSERT NAME OF SHOOTER, when on the land, will adhere to any rules or restrictions given by me, the leaseholder/landowner (delete as appropriate) mentioned above.


Signed: ………………………………………

Dated: …………………………………………
 

tomtom

Member
Hi Chris, I only just saw your reply, that is very helpful thank you!

My main concern is that one of my, up until now verbal only, permissions is part campsite/part close to houses/part safe shooting ground.

I just wonder if I need to specify in more detail the areas of the land I will shoot on or if just the address will do.

Thanks for your input!

TT
 

tomtom

Member
Hi Chris, I only just saw your reply, that is very helpful thank you!

My main concern is that one of my, up until now verbal only, permissions is part campsite/part close to houses/part safe shooting ground.

I just wonder if I need to specify in more detail the areas of the land I will shoot on or if just the address will do.

Thanks for your input!

TT
 

Heym SR20

Well-Known Member
Chris Rob has it about right.

I have just completed a Lothian & Borders land permission form and they requested a couple of more bits of info so would amend Chris Rob's excellent outline as follows:

Grant of Permission to Shoot Deer & Vermin

This is to confirm that:

Mr. INSERT NAME OF SHOOTER (of)

INSERT ADDRESS OF SHOOTER

Has in the form of this written notice, duly signed & authorised by me, been granted permission to shoot Deer & Vermin on land situated at:

INSERT ADDRESS OR LOCATION OF LAND

Using Centre Fire Rifle, Rimfire Rifle & Shotgun.

The land consists of xxx acres and is of INSERT TYPE - ie ARABLE/ WOODLAND/ ROUGH GRAZING/ UPLAND ETC.

The land IS / IS NOT crossed by footpaths that ARE / ARE NOT regularly used.

By myself:

INSERT NAME OF LANDOWNER OR LEASEHOLDER (of)

INSERT ADDRESS OF LANDOWNER OR LEASEHOLDER

INSERT FIREARMS LICENCE OR SHOTGUN CERTIFICATE NUMBER IF APPROPRIATE


Being the rightful and legal leaseholder/landowner (delete as appropriate) of the above-mentioned land.

I understand that INSERT NAME OF SHOOTER, when on the land, will adhere to any rules or restrictions given by me, the leaseholder/landowner (delete as appropriate) mentioned above.


Signed: ………………………………………

Dated: …………………………………………
 

tomtom

Member
Thanks, that's excellent!

Where you have put inset SGC or FAC number, I assume you mean of the aplicant and not of the land owner / tenant. Is that correct?
 

finnbear270

Well-Known Member
permissions

Verbal permission, is no permission at all, in the event of an accident of any sort, either to life or property, your insurance provider (if you have one), may find difficulty supporting you in the event of any action taken against you.
 

Nick Fahey

Well-Known Member
What actually happens if you have written permision, do they go and see the person, do they ring, how deep is the interogation?
Just asking as one of the people I have asked for permission wants to know.
Cheers
Nick
 
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