POACHING REPORTING

swampy

Account Suspended
#1
OK GUYS, I AM PUTTING MY HEAD ABOVE THE PARAPET HERE.

I am a policeman by trade. I am very aware of the frailties of the force- so please don't tell me about them!

Here is the deal: All over the East of england we are plagued by poachers. Typically they drive in from out of area and Lamp deer. They are shooting a lot of them. 20+ per night. They are driving all over the ground and tearing it up. Intelligence suggests that a single crewed nights officer stopped a car on nights. The car was suspected of being involved in poaching. The driver stabbed the bobby. that was in cambridgeshire.

The police are ruled by stats. "If the calls aren't recieved- then it's not happening" so they don't deploy people to the rural areas becuase the stats aren't there. So we all need to get it's profile raised. If you have poachers on you YOU MUST PHONE IT IN TO THE POLICE AND ASK FOR A LOG NUMBER. This way it will be counted. If you find wheel tracks all over your beat that have been made the same applies.

The same deal with the guys illegally coursing.

It might seem the police aren't interested..... remember the person you speak to might be a town living person who knows nothing about the countryside and might be a minimum wage employee. Please keep phonong them in.

Hell we pay a lot of council tax, we need to start to use the systems in place to get the cover we deserve.

steve
 

monynut

Well-Known Member
#2
swampy

l live in the east of England and l called the police out a few months back when l had poachers running the deer on the ground that l am a part time keeper on, after watching the buggers for an hour the boys turned up only to say that the force chopper was out of action and the best they could do was have a drive around with the blues on and hope it was enough to send them on their way, on another occasion l had the hare coursers pay me a visit and after waiting 2 hours they sent out a wpc, nothing wrong with sending a wpc but when faced with a group of coursers what could she of possibly done to stop them or even arrest them.

Correct me if l am wrong but does each force have a wildlife officer who is trained to deal with any form of wildlife crime and if so how could you go strait to horses mouth so to speak do they have direct numbers or do you have to go through the control desk.
 

Fester

Well-Known Member
#3
HI steve
Me & a mate were out lamping one night when we stumbled accross 3 lads with a shot gun & lamp. :eek: After some very careful thinking we called the lads over. (they finally came after nearly 10 mins of calling) I locked my rifle in the back of my landy & used my lamp to find there position. I kept the lamp on them at all times to keep a watchful eye them as they approached me. We asked if they had permission to be on that piece of ground (knowing full well they didnt as im the only shooter on there) & they replied yes they did. They couldnt produce written evidence so we asked them to leave , which they did. I recorded the reg of there vehicle & passed this onto the farmer who also said they did not have permission.
The problem i am faced with is the fact that my local station is not manned at night so if i had called the police they would of had to attend from the derby branch some 20min drive away & probably would of been lucky to of actually seen them within the hour (at no fault of there own) :D
We have seen this vehicle about on numerous occasions around the area but have been informed they need to be "caught in the act" by the local police for anything to be done about it :???:
Where do we stand in this situation :???:
Its all well & good reporting this type of incident but if nothing can be done then were obviously wasting our time :cry:
Ok so there probably after the odd rabbit or something but in my eyes if there on land they shouldnt be on & carrying a firearm then they have committed an offence :???:
I have not witnessed any poaching of wild deer on my land apart from one of our captive reds that was shot with a crossbow last year at night :cry:
They sent the firearm squad out in the morning who then proceeded to walk around the farm looking like a SWAT team on manouveres :eek: long after the crime had been committed & the criminals were tucked up in bed :rolleyes:
 

Rob Mac

Well-Known Member
#4
Evening

I think Swamp is making a very good point. If the crime isn't reported, as far as the stats are concerned it never happened.

The police might not be able to do anything about it this time around, but more resource might be allocated in the future.

Cheers,

Rob
 

poddle

Well-Known Member
#5
Had a problem last November on my shoot, Plod could not care less.

Had Gyppo's running dogs at hare with lamps and a roe was shot with a 22rimfire. Pheasants being shot from their roost, again with .22

Staked the place out ourselves every night for a week or more, and our presence made them sod off. We also made a visit to the local Gyppo camp, and warned them off.
Plod, waste of time, too busy pestering lawful gun owners and working out ways to put even more paper work between us and our sport.
 

swampy

Account Suspended
#6
monynut,
no not all forces have a wildlife officer, mine being one of them. It managements eyes - why should they- there aren't the calls for service. what area are you in?

Poddle and steyr,
You are right in what you say which is why YOU MUST report these incidents and raise the profile of the problem. How can you complain when you know that in order to get a better response you need to keep phoning in. In order to make the "couldn't care less" attitude change it must be a countable stat.

We as individuals hold the key to inproving the service to rural areas. to getting the rural stations manned at night.

As for deployment of female officers, A female officer is equally trained to a male officer. If the force sent out a male officer instead of a female they would be guilty of sex discrimination.
 

Beowulf

Well-Known Member
#7
Well done Swampy! I to get fed up with the police, but it is up to us to make the Government and Police listen. The Gypo site adjoining the area I stalk get regular visits from the Police I'm glad to say. Unfortunately they cannot be there all the time!

We all need to help the law to catch these poacher scum! This forum can help to do that. If you see anything that's not right post it! The same thing may be happening on your neighbour's land.
 

monynut

Well-Known Member
#8
swampy said:
monynut,
no not all forces have a wildlife officer, mine being one of them. It managements eyes - why should they- there aren't the calls for service. what area are you in?
swampy

l am in cambridgeshire very near the suffolk border not far from newmarket, l have ground in both counties, incidently when ever l call in an incident l always ask for a incident no l take it that it is the same as what you call a log no.
 

swampy

Account Suspended
#9
poaching

Yes a log number is an incident number- if you ask for one then the complaint has been on the computer and it is auditable and will be counted.
 

Drew

Well-Known Member
#10
If we don't tell em, they won't know...simple as that. If we want more and better policing of poaching we have to make the crimes known. More power to your elbow Swampy.

While we're on the subject of reporting poachers lets also not forget the scum bags who are poisoning and shooting our raptors...every red kite or eagle they show poisoned on the telly is another nail in the coffin of fieldsports. There's no need for it, it's old thinking. Report them. Be they keeper or crofter, farmer or shepherd it's legit fieldsports which gets the blame.
 

remmy7

Well-Known Member
#11
Hi All'

Swampy is indeed correct, if the Police don’t know about a poaching incident then they cannot possibly deal with it. However today’s Policing is increasingly Intelligence led and resource management plays a vital role in dictating what gets priority. Urban/rural areas with total population of say 100,000 people, the majority of which are within say two residential towns, will typically see a shift of around 10 or 12 Officers to deal with all that comes their way. It doesn’t take a genius to work out that a few Pub brawls an RTA or HB in progress will soon rob the area of all available manpower/womanpower and when the usual routine and youth disorder calls are included in the equation then the thin blue line is getting thinner and thinner. This is why poaching incidents should be reported as it lifts the prominence of the offence up the scale of "we have to do something about this" The average urban Officer that may be sent to deal with a poaching incident may never have before had such a call and may never get another one in his/her service therefor it is perhaps understandable that they may not be up to speed with what is required in the way of approaching/dealing with such an incident. Whilst WLO,s or WECO Officers as they are now called are perhaps better placed to deal with incidents ( more than a few of these are Stalkers/Anglers etc) a force of around 1000 officers may only have 5-6 WECO,s. In Forces of this size WECO,s are often volunteers and do this job in addition to their normal duties or indeed in their own time ( I dare say you know where I am going with this so I wont continue) There is currently an HMI thematic inspection of Wildlife Crime so one would like to think that the situation can only improve as Forces are asked to state their position on the subject. With this in mind now is the time to show the extent of the problem and this can only be done by phoning in and getting the incidents logged.

Regards Remmy7
 
#12
Good post Swampy

Yes we must all report these poaching incidents to the Police.

We have had similar problems in the south east with dog men
and crossbows being used in the last few years. :evil:

I have got to say the Kent Police force has been very responsive to call
outs and on one occasion at 2.00 am in the morning two 4x4's complete with search lights arrived within 20 minutes of calling them.

We did not catch the poachers on that occassion as they disappeared
into 2000 acres of forest (could have done with a dog section )but we
gave em something to think about ;)


You need to make contact with the local beat officers and WLO's before you have further problems, meet up with them explain what has happened in the past and if possible have a set meeting point on your ground to save time when its a real inccident in the darkness of the night.

Get their personal mobile numbers(If they will supply these, not sure they supply them to public,I have done this but work for LA )so you dont waste time going through switch boards.

If a few of your neighbours are having the same problem get together with them and approach your Rural and Environmental crime coordinator (if they have one) who should be able to help with intellegence gathering and provided the details of the police officers who can help.


As poddle has said getting out on your ground night watching if you can
let the word get about that your patch is being watched and make life as difficult for the A*******s :evil: as possible they will soon move on to some easier ground.

Lets not let them get away with it ;)
 

Fester

Well-Known Member
#13
Some very good posts here.
Hope nobody thinks i was knocking the police because im not. Its not there fault they take so long to reach my area.
In future i will keep them informed of poachers i see.
Had a conversation with a friend tonight who has informed me that a van has been spotted around this area. There shooting deer & just leaving them where there shot. That makes me even :evil: . The police are aware of it so hopefully they will soon be caught :???:
 

JAYB

Administrator
Site Staff
#14
Fallow Stalker,

A fine bunch of thief takers you are talking about there, a mighty mob close to my heart.

I am happy to say that up with me there is no poaching problem. There was a time a few years ago when I could lie in bed and hear a shot got off in the woods out back of me, but, I knew who it was and it would have been one for the pot. Not only that it is a FC wood, and now following the attention of the contract killers a few years back the deer numbers are a fraction of what they were.

Swampy is right, report the poachers each and every time, persistence is the name of the game, demand an incident number and a name every time. Another good thing is to ask for the name of the supervisory officer on duty at the time. The higher you shake the tree the better the results. Don't be rude or give the impression of being rude, but be persistent.

John
 

MR FISH

Well-Known Member
#15
i agree with alot of what's been discussed on this post, especially about generally raising the level of concern about poaching. when i renewed my FAC i was talking to the officer about the poaching problem and he suggested that its the language we use to report poaching that makes a big difference. he said most calls start with words to the effect of "i've got a problem with poachers, can you send an officer" which usually results in most officers being otherwise involved and the level of importance isn't as high as it should be. However, if an incident is reported as " there are 3 individuals trespassing my property, i believe they could be armed and i fear for my safety" then a switchboard controller will automatically know its serious without any mention of poaching.

I think it comes down to the perception of poaching, it's no longer an old boy wandering onto some farmland to shoot a pheasant for his tea, poachers are now far more advanced and organised and willing to take bigger risks at any costs.
 

poddle

Well-Known Member
#17
Somwhere along the line it is assumed that we did not call the police when having trouble with poachers. We did call the police, and they would not come


We had to deal with a gang of criminals with abloody firearm without assistance.
So think about that one! :evil: :evil:
 

stone

Well-Known Member
#18
i remember a story about a keeper on ragley hall
one night he caught a poacher in his woods so he beat and tied him up and that was where he stayed untill morning , when he was released , never been back since, not that i condone such an action but word of mouth can often be a good deterent as was in this case.
as for these modern day poachers, best left for the police to deal with these viscious thugs , i like mr Fish's method (report them as armed intruders) i know that works :lol:
 

poddle

Well-Known Member
#19
A mate of mine had a man on his roof with a knife for several hours and the police never came.
A guy around the street from me also beat the living crap out of his girlfriend and waved his shotgun around in the street threatening folk and the cops took nine months to take his gun off him
 

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