Registering as a food business

VSS

Well-Known Member
As I said take NO advice from this site other than contact you LA for their opinion of your individual situation!
Just bear in mind that you may shoot deer in a county other than where you live, and sell to an AGHE in a county other than where you live. Would you contact all the Local Authorities involved for their opinion? No, of course not! You simply comply with the law, by registering as a food business.

As stalkers, we are extremely fortunate to be able to sell carcasses in this way. People who keep farmed deer can't do it, neither can people who keep sheep, cattle, pigs etc. If we abuse the system then we'll lose the privilege.
 

VSS

Well-Known Member
After being the instigator of that first thread, I went through the process with Oxfordshire county council. After some confusion about who was responsible, I am now registered. Interestingly though, there was no inspection and no real concern about what I was up to. I also only have it by email that I’m registered on their books.
It was a fairly straightforward process.
To be honest, I was quite surprised that they bothered to come out and do an inspection, but the fact is that they did. Therefore, anyone applying for food business registration must be prepared for the possibility that they might be subjected to an inspection, which is why I posted my experience.
 

VSS

Well-Known Member
Thorough as usual Tim, and very informative. Before I make enquires, is their any follow up? Is their a review process, or duration of license?
RS
I don't think there's a specific duration. However, I could be subjected to another inspection at any time.
The only specific requirements stated on the letter are that I contact them for guidance if I decide to install a larder/butchering facility at home (for carcasses intended for sale. Home consumption doesn't apply), and that I inform them of any changes to what I'm doing, so that they can update their records.
 

Monkey Spanker

Well-Known Member
I don't think there's a specific duration. However, I could be subjected to another inspection at any time.
The only specific requirements stated on the letter are that I contact them for guidance if I decide to install a larder/butchering facility at home (for carcasses intended for sale. Home consumption doesn't apply), and that I inform them of any changes to what I'm doing, so that they can update their records.
I used to get re-inspected every two years. Then it became just a phone call. Since then I’ve not heard from them. Still got the registration. Could all change soon though if venison gets given a higher risk status which is being pushed at present.
MS
 

Cris

Well-Known Member
Yep, best ignore several knowledgeable members who have pointed out the correct guidance note and link to a government website.

There are no “individual circumstances”. If you supply to an AGHE you should be registered.
As I said don’t take advice from so called knowledgeable people on this site but find out for yourself.
 

bullet chucker

Well-Known Member
When I notified my authority the party involved were nonplussed as to what I wanted? I had a lot of questions asked of me,such like who would I supply too and how many? it was apparent that they had not had to deal with a request for a private individual just asking to be registered.I gave them the details of the AGHE I would be using and my registration number. Have had no visits as there is nothing to inspect!

BC.
 

25 Sharps

Well-Known Member
As I said don’t take advice from so called knowledgeable people on this site but find out for yourself.
What is your issue? Other than having a different personal experience to others and the way the regulations state it should be carried out? or do you just not like being shown you're wrong.

Plenty of good advice and insight, on this and other threads on this forum, if you dislike it so much why are you a member?
 

FISH BOY

Well-Known Member
I don't think there's a specific duration. However, I could be subjected to another inspection at any time.
The only specific requirements stated on the letter are that I contact them for guidance if I decide to install a larder/butchering facility at home (for carcasses intended for sale. Home consumption doesn't apply), and that I inform them of any changes to what I'm doing, so that they can update their records.
Cheers Tim - very useful :thumb:
 

25 Sharps

Well-Known Member
Para 15, supply of game in fur would cover most of us without getting nickers in a twist.....
No it doesn't! If you read all the elements referenced you will see all paid supply into the food chain, has to be by a registered food business!

Paragraph 17 qualifies the previous 2 paragraphs and states .

"However, even though such supply is exempt from the food hygiene rules, under European food law you are operating a food business1 . You will therefore be required to register with your local authority as a food business (see paragraph 43) and the game will be subject to the traceability requirements of Regulation 178/2002 (see paragraphs 45-47). Furthermore, irrespective of whether the individual or estate is a food business or not, there are duties under Regulation (EC) 178/2002 and the Food Safety Act (Food Safety (NI) Order in Northern Ireland) not to place unsafe food on the market or to mis-describe food. "
 

Cris

Well-Known Member
No it doesn't! If you read all the elements referenced you will see all paid supply into the food chain, has to be by a registered food business!

Paragraph 17 qualifies the previous 2 paragraphs and states .

"However, even though such supply is exempt from the food hygiene rules, under European food law you are operating a food business1 . You will therefore be required to register with your local authority as a food business (see paragraph 43) and the game will be subject to the traceability requirements of Regulation 178/2002 (see paragraphs 45-47). Furthermore, irrespective of whether the individual or estate is a food business or not, there are duties under Regulation (EC) 178/2002 and the Food Safety Act (Food Safety (NI) Order in Northern Ireland) not to place unsafe food on the market or to mis-describe food. "
Taken out of context the quote means nothing.
You need to read the complete document and decide what requirement you come under. There are situation were it clearly says you do not have to register.
As I said the only advice is you for people to do just that and read the complete document, decide where they fall under it and then talk to their local authority for confirmation. Then register or rest assured.
 

25 Sharps

Well-Known Member
Taken out of context the quote means nothing.
You need to read the complete document and decide what requirement you come under. There are situation were it clearly says you do not have to register.
As I said the only advice is you for people to do just that and read the complete document, decide where they fall under it and then talk to their local authority for confirmation. Then register or rest assured.
No there are not! Please clarify if that is the case, which section clearly states under which circumstances you can sell game and not need to be registered as a food business.

To put it in context.

Page 9 flow chart.

2. If you are a hunter, estate or shoot that supplies all of your in-fur/infeather wild game carcases directly to the final consumer or to local retailers that directly supply the final consumer and not to Approved Game Handling Establishments (AGHEs). ==>

You are not subject to the requirements of the EU Food Hygiene Regulations. However, you are responsible for supplying safe food under The Food Safety Act 1990 and Regulation 178/2002. For more information see Paragraphs 15 to 17.

Leads on to para's 15-17

Direct supply of small quantities of in fur/in feather wild game carcases to the final consumer or local retailers
15. The supply, by the producer, of small quantities (see paragraph 16) of primary products direct to consumers or local retailers is not covered by European food hygiene legislation. Therefore, if you (whether as an individual hunter, estate or shoot) hunt wild game and supply it in-fur or infeather only in small quantities directly to the final consumer, and/or to local retailers directly supplying this game to the final consumer, the game will not be subject to the requirements of either Regulation 852/2004 or Regulation 853/2004. Regulation 178/2002 (Article 3, point 18) defines the final consumer as “the ultimate consumer of a foodstuff who will not use the food as part of any food business operation or activity”.


16. In the UK the terms “small”, “local” and “direct supply” are interpreted as follows:  Small quantities is regarded as self-defining because demand for in-fur or infeather carcases from final consumers and local retailers is limited.  Local is within the supplying establishment’s own county plus the greater of either the neighbouring county or counties or 50km/30miles from the boundary of the supplying establishment’s county, but never beyond the UK except supply from Northern Ireland to the Republic of Ireland. When the supplying establishment is located in the Scottish islands, local is interpreted as anywhere within Scotland.  Direct supply to the final consumer is not restricted by what is local. An individual or an estate can supply final consumers who order from them via the internet/mail order as well as those who collect themselves.

17. However, even though such supply is exempt from the food hygiene rules, under European food law you are operating a food business1 . You will therefore be required to register with your local authority as a food business (see paragraph 43) and the game will be subject to the traceability requirements of Regulation 178/2002 (see paragraphs 45-47). Furthermore, irrespective of whether the individual or estate is a food business or not, there are duties under Regulation (EC) 178/2002 and the Food Safety Act (Food Safety (NI) Order in Northern Ireland) not to place unsafe food on the market or to mis-describe food

How is that open to interpretation?

The only circumstance identified as not requiring registering is "If you shoot wild game only for your own private consumption or to give away to family and friends for private consumption on an occasional basis. " (page 9, clarified para's 12-14)
 
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75

Well-Known Member
There are situation were it clearly says you do not have to register.
Yes, I'd also be interested in this.

Whilst I understand the sentiment of "don't believe everything you read on the internet", your comments of "take no advice from this site" are rather patronising to many of the long standing members (including those who run the site!) who help others out by providing advice on a range of subjects. It's also slightly ironic that you're giving advice but, in the same post, telling others not to take it ;)
 

Cris

Well-Known Member
Taken from the Wild Game Guide as we have got into a quoting game.

Wise advice. Talk to your local authority to be sure of what is right for you.

My last post on the subject and by the way I don’t believe I have said that nobody needs register. Just that as the guide states there are different circumstances and not everyone will fall under one in which they have to register. I.e supplying without payment or for own consumption.

“Legal Status of Guidance
11. This guidance has been produced to explain the legal requirements of Regulation (EC) 178/2002. It also explains the legal requirements of the EU Food Hygiene Regulations referred to in paragraph 1. It cannot cover every situation and you may need to consider the relevant legislation itself to see how it applies in your circumstances. If you follow the guidance it will help you to comply with the law. Businesses with specific queries may wish to seek the advice of their local enforcement authority. This will usually, depending on the arrangements, be the environmental health or trading standards department of the local authority.”
 
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25 Sharps

Well-Known Member
Yes, I'd also be interested in this.

Whilst I understand the sentiment of "don't believe everything you read on the internet", your comments of "take no advice from this site" are rather patronising to many of the long standing members (including those who run the site!) who help others out by providing advice on a range of subjects. It's also slightly ironic that you're giving advice but, in the same post, telling others not to take it ;)
I was about to post he's being ironic, but you beat me to it!!
 

25 Sharps

Well-Known Member
Taken from the Wild Game Guide as we have got into a quoting game.

Wise advice. Talk to your local authority to be sure of what is right for you.

My last post on the subject and by the way I don’t believe I have said that nobody needs register. Just that as the guide states there are different circumstances and not everyone will fall under one in which they have to register. I.e supplying without payment or for own consumption.

“Legal Status of Guidance
11. This guidance has been produced to explain the legal requirements of Regulation (EC) 178/2002. It also explains the legal requirements of the EU Food Hygiene Regulations referred to in paragraph 1. It cannot cover every situation and you may need to consider the relevant legislation itself to see how it applies in your circumstances. If you follow the guidance it will help you to comply with the law. Businesses with specific queries may wish to seek the advice of their local enforcement authority. This will usually, depending on the arrangements, be the environmental health or trading standards department of the local authority.”
So you're saying now the only situation identified is if you are not selling?

That's not what you said or advised earlier in the thread when you were advising people not to take any advice from this forum...
 
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Orion

Well-Known Member
Wise advice. Talk to your local authority to be sure of what is right for you.
Unfortunately, as we have heard on this and other threads on the subject, not all L A Environmental Health employees fully understand the Regulations and are subsequently advising wrongly. Maybe it’s a career path to becoming an FEO? ;)
 

VSS

Well-Known Member
My original post wasn't intended to start a discussion about whether or not registration is required under different circumstances. I refered only to one specific scenario (that of direct supply of in-skin carcasses straight from the field to an AGHE), for which registration very definitely IS required.
It was intended as a bit of a "heads up" warning that you may be subject to an inspection when registering, even though there are no premises to inspect, and to give you an idea of what sort of things an inspector may wish to see / discuss.
Initially I wasn't aware of the requirement to register for this purpose, until it was pointed out to me on the earlier thread, and I confirmed it by downloading the linked document. My LA inspector also referred to the same document.
 

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