Reloading 6,5x57 , need some ideas

foreigner

Active Member
Hi guy, i am rather new in the reloading world and try to find a good load for my 56 cm gunbarrel, it has a 1/9 twist. I am trying to find a good load for those120 g Nosler Ballistic tip.
Used vithaviouri N140, N133,N150 and N160.
I know every gun is different but can anybody put me on the right track?
 
Hi guys, i looked at the vithaviouri reloading site of course but no data for the 6,5x57 available. Can’t find much info on this caliber online ...
 
Have you seen this old thread?

This is not recommended at all but as a last resort:
I also have an unusual 6.5 calibre cartridge (6.5x54) and where I can't find the right data, I compare load data I do have with another similar calibre (6.5x55) and calculate the relative difference in loads - then extrapolate that to the combination I want to use. For example, my cartridge loads are often around 10% less than the 6.5x55, so I'd very carefully take 10% off the starting load listed for the other cartridge and try that.

I wouldn't do this unless I couldn't use an alternative bullet or powder combination for similar effect. And I don't recommend anybody to try it.
 
The 6.5X57mm is very close to the 6.5X55mm Mauser in 'internal ballistics' terms (ie the metrics that determine the pressures and MVs cartridges produce with any given barrel length and bullet weight).

They also operate at equivalent pressures, CIP MAP for the modern (SE) 6.5X55 at 55,114 psi; 56,565 psi for the 6.5X57mm, so the latter is in no way peak-pressure constrained in any comparison. (This assumes your 6.5X57mm rifle uses a modern or otherwise strong older action such as the M98 Mauser in good condition. As many German and Austrian 6.5X57s were built around the older, weaker M93/95 action, such historic pieces should be restricted to Swedish military Mauser pressures, ie around 45,000 psi. It also assumes your rifle is bolt-action using the rimless version of the cartridge not the 6.5X57R rim version that is rated at lower maximum pressures.)

Where there is modest divergence is in case capacity (measured in water in grains weight) in that the 57mm case variant is listed in QuickLOAD as 59gn water compared to the Swede's 57gn. So, the German model runs with a slightly larger combustion chamber volume behind the same bullets going down the same bore. This reduces pressures slightly compared to the 6.5X55 when combining the same powders, charges and bullets - ie it is a 'right-side (safe) change as it lowers pressures not the reverse. Running a 120gn Nosler BT load in QuickLOAD with various powders confirms that with same weight charges showing 1,000-1,500 psi lower pressure in the 6.5X57mm.


Of the powders you list, N133 is unsuitable being too fast burning and N140 is marginal especially in still larger case than that of the 6.5X55mm. Of N150 and N160, I'd lean toward the latter as a very much better match that will give a 90% + case fill with full working loads. In fact, I'd prefer something a tad slower burning.

Hornady lists the 6.5X57 in its reloading manuals, but it is old data and only uses three Reach non-compliant US powders - IMR-4064 / 4350 / 4831. It didn't test the cartridge with any 120gn bullets (actually didn't make any back when it worked up the data for this cartridge) so the nearest equivalent is the 129gn SST. Comparing the IMR-4350 maximum loads for this bullet with those in the same company's table for the 6.5X55 again shows that the 6.5X57mm allowed maximum is slightly higher than the 6.5X55's so the latter will be usable and should be safe as producing slightly lower pressures. The same relationship applies to the two cartridges in Hornady's 140gn bullet table, here for IMR-4831.

There will be data around online for the 6.5X57 I'm sure, most likely on German hunters' sites and forums. There is one here for Ballistix Bullets, a South African custom bullet manufacturer. Again, it's not the actual loads that matter, but the colmparison it allows between 6.5X57 and 6.5X55 recommendations, the same pattern applying of the same powders being used, but with marginally heavier maximum loads for the German cartridge demontrating the suitability of starting with readily available 6.5X55mm Viht data.

Vihtavuori - Balistix Bullets

I'm sorry to look so long-winded on this, but on those occasions where extrapolation between cartridge's data is attempted, serious research and justification is needed to be safe. Put all of the above factors together and I personally would be happy to use published 6.5X55 loads. Usually, extrapolating loads from one cartridge to another is an unwise and potentially very dangerous practice, not at all recommended as Apthorpe says in his post, but it is safe and allowable in a few cases such as this where the two have very similar characteristics. (Another widely used example for a European cartridge is the 7X64 Brennecke which is very close internally to the 280 Remington and whose much more widely available loading data can be used with a small reduction in maximum charges purely for insurance.)

So use Viht's loads tables on its website for the 6.5X55 (lower pressure 'Swedish Mauser' not the higher pressure 'SKAN' table initially) for the 120gn Lapua Scenar L which will be close enough to your Nosler bullet to be safe. It lists 43.8gn starting and 45.7gn maximum of N160.

This compares to Nosler's load for the 6.5X55 for the 120gn Ballistic Tip in the company's No.6 Reloading Manual of 42.5gn starting / 46.5gn maximum N160 (for modern strong action rifles in good condition) so ties in OK.

Ideally results should be checked out on a chronograph to ensure they're in lone with expectations - ie slightly reduced MVs.

In most circumstances I'd have recommended requesting a QuickLOAD user to model the bullet / powder combination for you, would have done so myself. However, I won't trust the program with Viht N160 - it undercalculates pressures by ~5,000 psi IME and I've blown a primer or two and wrecked the odd case finding this out the hard way over the years. So, for other forum members who will no doubt be inserting copies of N160 runs for the 6.5X57 for you in a spirit of helpfulness, please don't!
 
There are a few people shooting 6.5x57 in the UK, myself included.

Even if you can get the older US powders, the data in the Hornady manual seems to be aimed at very low pressures, expecting older rifles to be used. I have a reloading brochure from Vihtavuori dated 1983 which has loads for 6.5x57, for a 125gn SP Nosler it gives a maximum of 41.2gn N140 for a 2760fps MV and 3350 bar pressure.

When I tried the Hornady manual loads they gave such low pressures that the cases didn't obturate in the chamber, so soot and gas came puffing back along the bolt and out into my face. Another problem was the S&B cases splitting necks on first firing, solved by using only RWS cases. The RWS cases are very good but the necks will harden after a few reloads and need annealing.

My Sauer 90 is quite fussy about bullets, RWS factory kegelspitz worked quite well but I eventually settled on 140gn Nosler for target work. Faster powders seemed to give poor results, so ended up with Viht N165 which was perfect. I settled on 47.0gn with the 140gn Noslers. I've not used magnum primers but have not had any ignition problems or hangfires with standard primers, although I've not used ball powder.

Getting dies can be a problem, I managed to find some Redding dies which have worked well but they're not common. Ideally I'd like a bushing neck die but Redding didn't accept the order last time I tried. Norman Clark had some used 6.5x57 dies at the Bisley Phoenix meeting but they sold quickly.

I'd say it's now more accurate than most 6.5x55s I've tried, but it would be hard to justify against a 6.5x47 or 6.5mm Creedmoor where it's quite a challenge to find a load that doesn't shoot well.
 
Getting dies can be a problem, I managed to find some Redding dies which have worked well but they're not common. Ideally I'd like a bushing neck die but Redding didn't accept the order last time I tried.
Would it be possible to bump back the shoulder with a Redding 7x57 body die and then neck size with a 6.5x55 Lee neck sizing die ?
 
Send an E-Mail to RWS for data.
I had a M/S with 24 inch barrel and used RWS factory ammo 127gr cone-points very accurate.
 
Would it be possible to bump back the shoulder with a Redding 7x57 body die and then neck size with a 6.5x55 Lee neck sizing die ?
I could always remove the decapper-expander from the Redding full-length resizing die and use it as a body die. I also have a Redding S bushing neck die in 6.5x55 so could try that, probably with a gap between the die and the shellholder.
 
I have a Sauer 90 in 6.5x57 I have found mine likes 120grain Sierra soft points and 40 grains of Vihtavori N140. I use the rifle for mainly roe deer and muntjac. I tried N150 but results were not as good with the 120 grain bullet. The German literature on the rifle suggests fast light bullets and when I bought some used cases they had used 93 grain bullets.

You can convert 7x57 cases to fit if you need to, neck up to 30 calibre and then size to 6.5x57 it put on a false shoulder, no need to fire form just use.
 
foreigner, I have a 1995 Vihtavuori reloading manual which doesn't list the bullet you want to use. The nearest data in it is for the 125 grain Nosler Partition. Unusually, it doesn't state a starting load, just a maximum of 41.2 grains for a claimed velocity of 2760 fps.
Do bear in mind that Viht powders have changed over the years, so unless you have some very old N140 do start conservatively. Be careful.
 
I suspect if you e mail Vihtavouri they will let you have their historic data

If you pm me your e mail I can take a photo of my 1997 guide and copy it to you. I reloaded a 6.5x57R for a few years and found it to be very similar to 6.5x55.
 
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