Stalking on 6 acres?

JTO

Well-Known Member
#21
I think you will gradually have to fence the whole plot as and when you can afford it. Badger tunnels will have to be included, as it seems you are willing to tolerate them. Foxes will get through deer fencing OK. The usual preservative will only save the posts for 25 years, better to use pressure creosoted posts, it they are still allowed.
 

Tis1979

Well-Known Member
#22
Ash dieback is certainly a concern. It seems to be across the whole UK now (except Northern Scotland). I'm not planting any extra due to this but there is a decent quantity of self-seeded ash across one area of my site which I plan to clean up and then coppice, mostly for firewood. With Dutch Elm disease and the future likelihood of extreme weather from global warming I'm looking into long term sustainability of the woodland for centuries to come. At the moment it's mostly beech high forest with a few over stood hazel stools, some birch and the occasional conifer. If something turns up that kills beech it'll be devastating.

The long term goal is to diversify, clear a fair bit of the beech canopy allowing more light into the understory. I'll then promote the ash and hazel as well as add in some oaks, sweet chestnut, hornbeam and perhaps something hopefully more future proof in a changing climate like black locust.
That’s great, sounds like a good project such a shame about ash, fingers crossed emerald beetle doesn’t make it here as that would be the nail in the coffin for it I reckon.
Good luck with it, I would go with The fencing option.
 
#23
You will need to find someone with an Open FAC to manage the deer and who is experienced and insured. High seat as said will be required and pointing away from the bridal path.
OK thanks. A high seat could be located as you say. How do I go about ensuring someone has the correct credentials? I assume it can all be shown with correct paperwork? Does the insurance requirement lie solely with the shooter alone or is it recommended I put my own public liability cover in place too?
 
#24
I'm wondering, would it be possible to make use of such a small plot when shooting deer?
Yes. Absolutely. Six acres is actually quite large! A good, solid, safe high seat is all you need. Indeed you may be able to offer a sporting lease, for say an initial one year with an exercisable option if you are OK to renew on a one year rolling basis with the insured lessee responsible for providing the high seat and appropriate disposal of the gralloch. I am certain there's a talent here on SD that'd be able to advise on such a lease that complies with your covenant. My only experience of letting ground was letting my pond for fishing two decades ago. So there will be fellow members here better able to advise.
 

VSS

Well-Known Member
#25
With regard to Ash dieback. I know it's not what you originally posted about, but as the topic has cropped up I thought I'd add my bit:
A couple of years ago I coppiced a small plantation of about 40 Ash trees. They were planted about 30 years ago, were all strong healthy trees, no signs of disease, good timber. However, every single bit of regrowth from the stumps has been killed by dieback, despite their being no sign of it beforehand. So, where I was hoping to have a nice crop of coppice poles in future years, I now have nothing. Wish I had never cut them down now.
 

FGYT

Well-Known Member
#26
You will need to find someone with an Open FAC to manage the deer and who is experienced and insured. High seat as said will be required and pointing away from the bridal path.
??? Might be but may not be required . Police can and do clear land a lot smaller than 5 acres even without need for high seats I have a 3/4acre (0.75acre) perm cleared for 6.5mm CF with no high seat condition. And a 4 acre for up to .243
 

kieran222

Well-Known Member
#28
You might have more success placing an advert in the "Deer Stalking Opportunities". I don't believe you will need to pay someone to do it and should at least be able to come to an arrangement for 50% of the venison in exchange for the permission to shoot. I would be selective about who you get, ensuring that they have insurance and experience. I think most people who would take this on would be happy to provide the high seat. If the land isn't already cleared for center fire rifle just check any applicants Firearms Cert to see if deer are on the cert and it is an open ticket permitting them to shoot on land without having to have it cleared for permission.
 

Tis1979

Well-Known Member
#29
??? Might be but may not be required . Police can and do clear land a lot smaller than 5 acres even without need for high seats I have a 3/4acre (0.75acre) perm cleared for 6.5mm CF with no high seat condition. And a 4 acre for up to .243
That’s incredible they cleared that, but if the topography suits why not I guess, is it an old bomb pit or similar?
 

JTO

Well-Known Member
#31
No it's my garden has a reasonable fold in it only asked for something to get the fox in my chickens expecting rimfire from upstairs windows but came back cleared for all my guns so have a 88yrd zero lane down the middle
Good old Jerry!
No such thing as safe or unsafe land, it's the shooter.
Plenty of foxes being shot in London gardens.
 

countrryboy

Well-Known Member
#32
Ash dieback is certainly a concern. It seems to be across the whole UK now (except Northern Scotland). I'm not planting any extra due to this but there is a decent quantity of self-seeded ash across one area of my site which I plan to clean up and then coppice, mostly for firewood. With Dutch Elm disease and the future likelihood of extreme weather from global warming I'm looking into long term sustainability of the woodland for centuries to come. At the moment it's mostly beech high forest with a few over stood hazel stools, some birch and the occasional conifer. If something turns up that kills beech it'll be devastating.

The long term goal is to diversify, clear a fair bit of the beech canopy allowing more light into the understory. I'll then promote the ash and hazel as well as add in some oaks, sweet chestnut, hornbeam and perhaps something hopefully more future proof in a changing climate like black locust.

Sounds a brilliant project, add in some wider possibly permanent/semi perm glades for butterfiles wild flowers (althou coppicing will give u that as well)
Must admit never a fan of beech as u get very little understory/vergetation below.
Sounds like a good mix ur plannning, mibee add the odd fruit bearin tree (if they grow down there?) Blackthorn for sloes or damsons, even juniper?? or goosegogs, even rowan for jelly.
Handy for making/flavouring spirts or cooking game

If u had a lot of overgrown stools u can buid wigwams over the stool to protect it with the brash, but it doesn't really offer it that much protection really


I don't know the total size exactly but I'd be surprised if it's any less than 100 acres. That's a good point about having limited success if only controlling the deer passing through my plot. A joint management plan would be great but may not be possible because some other owners of nearby plots are very fond of the deer and don't like the idea of shooting them. Also, some of the plots haven't been sold to private owners yet, they're held by an investment company who I assume wouldn't allow stalking other patch.

I've looked into temporary fencing which I'm leaning towards as a short-term measure. My hesitation is I have a badger set within the area to be fenced, I don't want to disturb them if I can avoid it. I also have a foxes as well as other wildlife passing through which I want to keep promoting.

I've not got round to checking every deer on my camera but definitely roe and muntjac seen so far.


U wouldn't actually need to shoot the adjoining plot but if u had 3 or 4+ plots (more the better) scattered throughout the main body of the woodland atleast then the deer wouldn't get wise to only getting shot at in ur small plot, might turn them nocternal in ur plot if u hit them too hard

Plus these folk when they see wot a cracking woodland ur creating with a bit of management they might see the light and realise ur not going to wipe the deer out and u'lll get so many other benefits of having them controlled and managing the woodland better.

Wish u all the luck with it sounds a cracking project for the future
 

foxdropper

Well-Known Member
#33
Without surrounding culling ongoing you are totally wasting your time without full fencing and purely a feel good factor until next week when more move in .
Is there an established browse line to worry about or are the deer more interested in other areas .Takes a large population of roe and muntjac to become bothersome in woodland that I do know .Fallow on the other hand !!!!
To the chap recommending setting up a lease ,wash your mouth out sir ,leases are what bugger up our sport .
 
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Buckaroo8

Well-Known Member
#36
OK thanks. A high seat could be located as you say. How do I go about ensuring someone has the correct credentials? I assume it can all be shown with correct paperwork? Does the insurance requirement lie solely with the shooter alone or is it recommended I put my own public liability cover in place too?
Yes, for recreational stalking you’ll want to see that the stalker has public liability insurance, which is usually included with membership with any of the large shooting organisations. You’ll also want to see his/her FAC and check that the conditions on it allow them to have a rifle and ammunition to shoot deer. You will need to give written permission to the stalker but you should reserve the right to retract permission any time you like. Don’t enter into anything long term.
Dsc1 and Dsc2 are voluntary qualifications that show a basic level of competency. Many fine stalkers don’t have either qualification and do just fine.
 

slider

Well-Known Member
#37
However, it clearly states shooting for the requirement of pest control so long as done safety and without causing undue annoyance to other woodland owners is permitted.
It would be worth double checking this as deer aren't classed as pests in teh eyes of the law.
 

countrryboy

Well-Known Member
#38
I'd second wot buckaroo has said, possibly include a map with ur written permission so the stalker knows where boundries are (esp if any issues with nieghbours) And keep it semi informal so u can terminate it if not going how u want it.

But as foxdropper has said ur just peeing into the wind if ur the only person controlling them, the stalker will shoot plenty and ur freezer will always be full but u'll probably never drop the density low enough for coppicing. Nature hates a vaccum so deer will draw in as quick as u can shoot them esp if u creating better feed/habitat.
But if u had many wee plots scattered all throu the wood all with a high seat etc u could begin to make a difference even if areas u can't shoot.

Infact probably worth putting some markers/tape/spraying trees round ur boundries anyway so if u ever have contractors in cutting/coppicing makes it easy for them to see boundries.
I know i almost caused problems cutting off boundry the other week (to be fair was never told where the boundry was) but suspected that area of the exact timber (easy access too) i was after was on the wrong side, luckily i found enough coppice on my side to finish the load.
But easy done when woods just sectioned off with no natural boundry (ditch, burn, hege, fence line etc)

So always worth haveing clear boundries esp if loads of wee plots/sections, just makes it easy for anyone working for u

Also +1 for wot slider said from wot i've heard of those agencies splitting woods up and selling wee bits deer is not always included, infact i've heard in some u have to ask permission to do any woodland work/felling too! Sort of defeats the point in owning them
 

JTO

Well-Known Member
#39
I think you should get some fencing done ASAP to avoid boundary disputes in the future. If a small tree is growing on the boundary, which side of it marks the boundary when it has grown in diameter, for example?
 
#40
Now of course once you as the owner enclose that woodland or coppice you can in fact possibly and lawfully shoot the deer with a shotgun using appropriate cartridges as detailed under the statutory defence allowed under s7 of the Deer Act 1991. So no need at all for any stalkers with rifles. You can do it yourself with a s2 12 Bore shot gun and AAA buckshot. Hull Cartridge and Eley sell them. In fact I've a box myself somewhere of the very stuff.

As here:

Deer Act 1991
 

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