Support your local RFD

[Foxyboy43]

I had an interesting and in truth depressing chat with my local gunshop owner yesterday which has probably been repeated by many on this site. The gist of the conversation was that shooting and in turn gunshops are in the advanced stages of a perfect storm. The RFD outlined the host of problems the industry faced which included the well-discussed licensing delays and as a direct result the stock which he has paid for sitting as “dead money” in his gunroom for up to a year because of licensing inefficiency, compounded by buyers often going off the purchase because of the delay thus leaving him with £1000+ of unwanted stock; current unavailability of practically anything shooting related - especially ammunition and reloading components; the coming compulsory “lead free” initiative; the increasing lack of interest from the younger generation in shooting; and of course the sweeping price increases in all new stock when it can actually be found e.g. £7.25 for a box of plastic wadded shotgun cartridges because he had no felt wads - the cause of the conversation in the first place! Added to this of course is the ongoing tightening of fiscal belts generally which impacts directly on the less essential (never!) items such as those associated with shooting.
Now, being of a certain age and relatively comfortable in retirement these many things will have only minimal impact on Foxyboy PLC and each will be addressed with little other than an occasional rant (moi?) but what of the young lad of my youth who started out shooting rats with a sightless .177 air rifle and over very many hugely enjoyable years progressed through single-barrelled shotgun to double, then over and under, then .22, 22 magnum, .222 and still more years ago than I care to remember, c/f rifles for deer? What chance would he have now of repeating this long and most fulfilling journey through life - particularly if there is no local dealer to tempt, encourage and advise him? Soooo spare a thought for your local RFD, if he goes that is yet another nail in the coffin of the sport beloved by all of us - use him or lose him!

 

[vmaxphil]

I did yesterday bought a nice raffaello black 12 bore

 

[deerstalker.308]

All this is true, and the same in many niche markets (and more broad-spectrum ones too.) Challenging times ahead for all.
Gunshop owners moaning? Never known of that before . But in all seriousness some are great, others are utterly useless and don’t do anything to warrant loyalty. I support my gunsmith, lovely chap, known him personally for years, he always goes above and beyond, but sorry to say many others in the region need a rocket, customer service and business sense often sorely lacking, some are their own worst enemies!

 

[Franchi Matt]

Public opinion is changing, influenced by the latest this that and the other.
All this - 'be kind' shizzle doesnt help imho.
I think Tom has the right idea

 

[Liveonce]

but what of the young lad of my youth who started out shooting rats with a sightless .177 air rifle and over very many hugely enjoyable years progressed through single-barrelled shotgun to double, then over and under, then .22, 22 magnum, .222 and still more years ago than I care to remember, c/f rifles for deer? What chance would he have now of repeating this long and most fulfilling journey through life - particularly if there is no local dealer to tempt, encourage and advise him?

This is exactly the issue I was trying to get across on the varies posts about the lead ban, but let’s not go their hear.

 

[Bavarianbrit]

My experience of rfd"s was their aloofness when selling to their customers as if they all knew better when in reality they are mostly just sales assistants. Apart from Wilsons at Manston rip.

 

[NullMac]

but what of the young lad of my youth who started out shooting rats with a sightless .177 air rifle and over very many hugely enjoyable years progressed through single-barrelled shotgun to double, then over and under, then .22, 22 magnum, .222 and still more years ago than I care to remember, c/f rifles for deer? What chance would he have now of repeating this long and most fulfilling journey through life - particularly if there is no local dealer to tempt, encourage and advise him? Soooo spare a thought for your local RFD, if he goes that is yet another nail in the coffin of the sport beloved by all of us - use him or lose him!

I found the air rifle and 22lr phase to be completely underwhelming. Had I not found mates through clay shooting that had rifles I would not have bothered with them. There is more than one way into a sport.

I agree though that if we want to have the services of an RFD then we had better spend some money with them. They do the awkward stuff that online does not want to know about

 

[Taff]

My experience of rfd"s was their aloofness when selling to their customers as if they all knew better when in reality they are mostly just sales assistants. Apart from Wilsons at Manston rip.

I would say you have very little experience of rfds, only one I can think of like that was Avalon guns, went once never again, spent my money with Gary, first time I met him he sent out for ice creams as it was a hot day.

 

[Cottis]

Public opinion is changing, influenced by the latest this that and the other.
All this - 'be kind' shizzle doesnt help imho.
I think Tom has the right idea

Tom is right. If people just upheld basic standards both for themselves and for others, the world would be a better place.

It has to start personally. When you give a crap about your own output and how that impacts on others, you can then hold others to the same account. It snowballs and there is then a consistent expectation that people will be doing the right thing in the right way, most of the time.

I was having a conversation with people at work the other day about attractiveness. Contributions ranged from being visibly good looking, good humour, personality, money, all the usual stuff. I said that for me, one of the most important attributes I look for in people is competence. Just good old fashioned basic competence. I want them to be good at stuff. Not because stuff is difficult but because they give a crap about their performance and have standards which they seek to always maintain. That does not include how their hairs looks or what they wear. I couldn't give less of a toss about that.

It is the same for gunsmiths/shops. Like @deerstalker.308 says, some are good and some are not. This is entirely my view as well. Historically, they have all done fairly well as it is a captive market. Especially with consumables. You might only buy a gun once every 5 yrs but to run it, you need ammo, maybe cleaning stuff, accessories etc. Online shopping has changed this. Yes you cannot have a gun delivered easily or even at all but almost everything else you can. Then factor in added mobility. Although it is not a regular occurence, when I buy a new gun, it is a one event. I don't mind driving a 6hr round trip to access quality service, a range to try out the gun etc. I would not dream of buying a gun from my local. They are welcoming and nice enough people but they know very little and want to sell you what they have. Their prices are also ludicrously high and while I believe in the mantra "use it or lose it" there is a point where I cannot forgive certain pricing. A few years back I was faced with HMR ammo at £21-22 per box when everywhere else was selling it at £13-16. I was buying 500 or 1000 at a time a few times a year and quite quickly went elsewhere, as even factoring in fuel, I was saving too much to ignore. I told them and explained but it fell on deaf ears.

Good businesses in any industry are flexible and move with the times. Good places last. Others do not.

I now tend to use Norman Clarke for smithing work and the odd ammo purchase and Reloading Solutions for my ammo components. The only other stuff I need sporadically is rimfire ammo which i just tend to pick up as and when I am in random places where I phone ahead to see what they have and how much is it. I have effectively shunned the locals. They are just on the take too much and it isn't warranted enough with their lack of what I perceive to be objective knowledge.

 

[Liveonce]

it’s not an easy business to be in, i had a good friend who was. RFD in kent before he died a few years back of cancer, he made his money out of secondhand guns and gunsmith work, he traded from home so had no room for clothing and did not even stock ammunition or cartridges. Profit on clothing and footware is good he said but the profit on ammunition and cartridges did not justify the effort of stocking them.
The importers of ammunition and firearms would not supply him as he had no “shop” so he could only buy some items like ammunition from the middle men like Kranks, hence could not compete price wise with shops a few miles away that did buy direct from the importers.
Their is a limited number of customers for shooting, unlike say food which everyone needs.
It was a life style business for him which did not make him rich, i suspect a lot of the small one man RFDs are in a similar position.
RIP Chris.

 

[Bavarianbrit]

I would say you have very little experience of rfds, only one I can think of like that was Avalon guns, went once never again, spent my money with Gary, first time I met him he sent out for ice creams as it was a hot day.

I have 45x firearms on my paperwork. I once collected 110x items for a German rfd pal from the Peterborough area to courier over to him and was underwhelmed there too. Now Southams auction house don't start me ranting about them.

 

[Rhodesianjess]

RFD known to me certainly not helpful to the shooting man, unless you are spending lots in his shop he's really not that interested. Ammunition for rifle and shotgun always above the "going"rate price wise. It's actually cheaper to run 40 miles roundtrip to another shop!
If you take a weapon in for repair, it's a 3/4 week turnaround as he sends it away, then puts 20 per cent markup on what he was charged. Found that out by accident,yet he trades as a gunsmith
If you're in the market for Airsoft military weapons, knives of all size and shape, clothing or boots at much inflated prices compared to what you can find on internet, then he's your man.
I lament the retirement of a true gunsmith who traded locally, could fix any gun ever made, could bed and accurize rifles and general all round craftsman. Never even stocked ammunition, just fixed and traded weapons.
Sign of the times unfortunately I think.

 

[Foxyboy43]

Oh dear! Not exactly a glowing view of (some) RFDs is it? To be fair I haven’t really experienced the “rip offs” but NI is a small place so word would travel pretty fast…..
The problem is of course where else can you buy ammo or powder/primers?

 

[Klenchblaize]

I do recall the days when it was a pleasure to enter just about any gun shop and indeed a general sports shop that sold air rifles and archery equipment. (Remember those where you could also pick up a pair of bowling shoes, an ounce of Old Fowler pipe tobacco and not just the latest drive-by trainers?)

In this regard I have to give a special mention to Gentrys of Welling and both John and Ken who were consummate professionals back in the 70’s and would give no less attention to a spotty 17-year old when selling a tin of air rifle pellets as they afforded the chap looking at a side lock AYA. I kid you not.

Fond memories

K

 

[User00053]

Seem to remember gentrys often advertising in the shooting times, are they still trading or any info when it closed?

 

[Malxwal]

I think we all understand that it's tough going for an RFD in the current climate, with little chance of the outlook brightening. However, basic rules of retail and a forward view of customer retention still apply.

 

[Klenchblaize]

Seem to remember gentrys often advertising in the shooting times, are they still trading or any info when it closed?

In the 80’s it was rumoured John and Ken had a serious falling out, about which I never asked and to this day do not know the reason for, but whatever it was Ken left the little & large partnership-like arrangement.

I can’t say it was never the same again at that point as there were other Shop Assistants who knew their onions and were fun to engage with through to the early 90’s, at which point I lost contact.

Today I believe the shop is simply called John Forsey Guns.

K

 

[User00053]

Thanks kb, yes John forsey guns good for wildfowling cartridges, but thanks for a memory jolt back to shooting times days as gentrys was like a household name in the adds back then

 

[trickie]

I agree it’s a problem, but as money gets tighter, you tend to shop around. Some of the RFD’s I have used, are more expensive that others local to me I use them more and the expensive ones less. The other thing that pleases me not is that some off them have become almost drop shippers (Riflemans Firearms for one). On occasions I’ll pay a little extra, but not for a few weeks wait when I can get most of the stuff delivered for less (Spud for one, also other forum supporting RFS’s) via a quick call or web purchase.

trickie