Thoughts on my dual purpose stalking / target spec
- Thread starter TRNCNDNT
- Start date
Hi all,
Just a heads up from the off - this will be fairly lengthy because I’ll be commenting on my logic / justification for the choices of each of the component parts of the spec, so people know my reasoning for their response so any recommendations are based on (or rationally countering) what my choices are. Anyway…
So after years of telling myself I wanted a dedicated stalking rifle that was lightweight and compact along with a heftier and longer target rifle I’ve capitulated after coming to the realisation that I simply don’t - and won’t - shoot as much as I want to.
Quite frankly, I can’t afford to shoot as much as I’d want due to ammunition costs, outing / trophy fees and the price of fuel to travel to where I’d stalk or target shoot. I work an amazing shift pattern (incredibly lucky) - 4 on 6 off 12 hour shifts, however, shooting always involves long travel (and therefore fuel) from my home. I have loads of time to shoot just not the money! To that end I’ve decided I just want a canny nice rifle that does both well but neither close to perfect. I could get 2 factory rifles with 2 different low to mid-range scopes (good ‘ol 4A for stalking and ‘Christmas tree’ for targets) that would both be used infrequently or I could get one nice custom that I would grow fully accustomed to the fit and feel of whilst also loving the aesthetics - I’ve chosen the latter…
Here’s what I was thinking:
Action - Tikka T3X Donor Action / Trigger - I like Tikka actions and if there’s anywhere I can save money on the build without me caring it’s this.
Calibre - 6.5 Creedmoor - I’m not a reloader and this calibre represents the best variety and availability of target and hunting ammo. Good trajectory for targets (applies to hunting too really), big enough for all U.K. deer (would probably restrain from big lowland reds though) and very manageable recoil.
Barrel - I’ll go with whichever quality barrel maker the smith I choose recommends whether it be Phoenix, IBI, Bartlein, Proof etc. Profile will be up for discussion too based on overall weight to compromise for both stalking (manoeuvrability) and target shooting (heavier for recoil reduction and heat dissipation). My main concern here is barrel length, and it’s also the factor I’d like opinions on more than anything else. I was thinking 22” because - whilst obviously still inefficient for a 6.5 Creedmoor which would usually have 24-26” barrels for the maximum velocity and burn - I feel it’s the right compromise level between compactness / weight and the muzzle velocity sacrifice. It should be noted I intend to use a compact forward-mounted mod so this will add length. My main question here is what would your opinion be on dropping to 20” from 22”? Would that extra compactness outweigh the extra muzzle velocity loss for the dual purpose I describe? Looking forward to the debate here.
Stock - McMillan A10 Adjustable - Now this here is a biggie for me. I’m relatively short (5’8”) with small-ish hands and have always found traditional stocks (both ‘Hunter’ and ‘Tactical’) to have a long grip to trigger reach, resulting in a skewed and less-than-ideal trigger finger pull and angle. Honestly I didn’t even know this until a year ago (after shooting for 17 years!) when I shot a chassis rifle and realised how much more comfortable the grip and trigger pull was. This stock is one of the very few traditional tactical (I.e. non-chassis, which I wouldn’t want to stalk with) that has a shorter grip to trigger reach. I’d be opting for the carbon woodland ambush camo which looks particularly tasty also.
Scope - the quite literally brand new Delta Stryker 3.5-21 x 44 FFP DLR-1 reticle. I’ve owned and looked through many Delta’s and I’ve always liked the glass quality for price. The magnification range fits my purpose (along with 9 yard parallax if required) and it also has plenty of elevation for target shooting. The 34mm tube will give good FOV. I acknowledge the light gathering of the 44mm objective isn’t ideal for low light stalking, however, the weight (around 800g) and length (13”-ish) is appealing on that front and the nearest competitors on the lightweight but high quality scope front for stalking would be the Leupold Mark 5HD 3.6-18x44 MIL which is same objective lens and the Kahles K318i, both of which have less maximum mag and are about a full grand more. I feel the reticle on my choice is good for stalking with the illuminated cross but still allows for quick drop calculations without the cluttering of a ‘Christmas Tree’.
(And I can get the thing on 0% klarna over a year at optics warehouse to ease the burden of the rifle build haha).
Very much welcome all thoughts, opinions and criticisms of my rationale. I’ve thought this through long and hard so don’t tear me apart too hard if I’m talking crap
If you go ahead with that build, it'll be a money pit that probably ends up on the classifieds here for 1/2-1/3 of the original cost (which ≠ 'value').
Better to buy two rifles, get them secondhand for a song, shoot the barrel out and go from there.
A 'do it all/jack of all trades' will be rubbish at both.
Action choice is easy, either Tikka T3, Savage or a Rem700/clone. Anything else and you will have trouble finding parts.
Savage make some very capable target rifles. Heavy for field use but Bryan Litz uses them as test mules. Look for a model with a 'target accutrigger' (red blade). The floating bolt head has been copied by numerous companies as it really does work.
If we were in the USA, a Rem 700 would be the way to go. But in Europe, Tikka T3x is the way forward.
Budget for some good scope mounts and rail (don't touch anything UK made). Spending £100-200 on a set will save you money as it's the second most important factor aside from a scope.
Keep in mind that the Delta Titanium/Javelin models are just the Bushnell Elite 6500/Tacticals of yester-year. Literally the same spec of scope!
The latter can be had for anything between 1/2-3/4 the price of a Delta, either second hand or new-old stock.
Also, what sort of 'target shooting'? That's a very broad church...
Yeah totally acknowledge there's going to be trade-offs from the off, which is why I want a 22" mid-weight barrel. The stock I go for will be carbon fibre. I know it'll never be as heavy as I'd like for target shooting but it is what it is. I actually don't mind a bit weight when stalking, I do a lot of training in the gym both weights and cardio (a little fun side fact, I did PARAS 10 this September and came in under the 1 hour 50 - although by a mere 2 minutes - but was still absolutely chuffed!) so rifle weight when stalking isn't a massive concern for me, it's the un-wieldyness of the longer barrel in the field more than anything.
Also as a few have asked it would just be casual target shooting, I'm not into any disciplines in particular, though I'd like to do tactical / McQueens sort of stuff. PRS sort-of appeals to me but I'm put of by all the bags and stuff, I like the idea of multi-positional shooting but would prefer just the good 'ol rifle and scope, maybe a bipod to deploy at best.
Lovely set up. Which model is the stock?
ColinBr
Well-Known Member
That's the PSE E-Tac. It has a pistol style grip on it, so is more vertical.
We started running a 1000m steel range at the beginning of the year
Whilst we have plenty of dedicated target rifles show up
what is most gratifying and the main reason I built it, is watching stalkers and pest controllers turn up with a “non target rifle and scope” (whatever that may be!) and smack gongs at 800-1000m
Bog standard T3 in 308 with a 3-12x scope
First time past 200m and we had him out to 880m with consecutive hits.
Parker Hales, vintage service rifles, open sighted classic stalking rifles.
They are all waaaaay more capable than you make out.
Now we have people who were worried about 300 jumping straight out to 5-600 and going out from there.
Still plenty of people who have thrown money at the problem and have specced out a “King of One Mile” rifle but don’t necessarily follow the fundamentals or are trying to run before crawl
No amount of mental masturbation on specification will help you read wind, learn your drops and drifts, build a consistent position and release the trigger well.
By far the most difficult choice for a mixed use rifle is the scope.
Get one with a fine enough graduated reticule that illuminates so you can see it when dark or wound down in FFP
Delta, Sightron, Meopta etc all have great optics and features for the money.
Choose one with matching turrets and reticule units!
Dial for elevation
Hold for wind (keep it simple!)
Decent repeatable turrets are the norm now not the exception
At least within the accuracy most can demonstrate at range!
The rest is largely irrelevant.
Learn your rifle and spend the rest on range time.
You might feel more comfortable on the range with a chassis built target queen, but unless you are competing in some money pit PRS championship then you will do just fine.
I ran a bog standard tikka t3 varmint in 308 I bought from a customer!,
Standard stick for years fitted with a second hand sightron 6-24x50 scope and a copy Atlas bipod on it for years.
Total cost under a grand!
It shot a ragged hole with factory target ammo, accounted for some very unlucky vermin including a 500yd crow.
The most satisfying thing it/I did was win a interbranch BDS competition against a field that was littered with Borden custom rifles, Blasers, Nightforce, PM2s, Swarovski etc.
Firing point looked like a whose who of brands and kit totalling 10s of thousands
Couldn’t do it now!!
Not sure I have a single rifle that shoots as well or i have the confidence in!!
And I have suffered from specification creep in every department!!
Whilst we have plenty of dedicated target rifles show up
what is most gratifying and the main reason I built it, is watching stalkers and pest controllers turn up with a “non target rifle and scope” (whatever that may be!) and smack gongs at 800-1000m
Bog standard T3 in 308 with a 3-12x scope
First time past 200m and we had him out to 880m with consecutive hits.
Parker Hales, vintage service rifles, open sighted classic stalking rifles.
They are all waaaaay more capable than you make out.
Now we have people who were worried about 300 jumping straight out to 5-600 and going out from there.
Still plenty of people who have thrown money at the problem and have specced out a “King of One Mile” rifle but don’t necessarily follow the fundamentals or are trying to run before crawl
No amount of mental masturbation on specification will help you read wind, learn your drops and drifts, build a consistent position and release the trigger well.
By far the most difficult choice for a mixed use rifle is the scope.
Get one with a fine enough graduated reticule that illuminates so you can see it when dark or wound down in FFP
Delta, Sightron, Meopta etc all have great optics and features for the money.
Choose one with matching turrets and reticule units!
Dial for elevation
Hold for wind (keep it simple!)
Decent repeatable turrets are the norm now not the exception
At least within the accuracy most can demonstrate at range!
The rest is largely irrelevant.
Learn your rifle and spend the rest on range time.
You might feel more comfortable on the range with a chassis built target queen, but unless you are competing in some money pit PRS championship then you will do just fine.
I ran a bog standard tikka t3 varmint in 308 I bought from a customer!,
Standard stick for years fitted with a second hand sightron 6-24x50 scope and a copy Atlas bipod on it for years.
Total cost under a grand!
It shot a ragged hole with factory target ammo, accounted for some very unlucky vermin including a 500yd crow.
The most satisfying thing it/I did was win a interbranch BDS competition against a field that was littered with Borden custom rifles, Blasers, Nightforce, PM2s, Swarovski etc.
Firing point looked like a whose who of brands and kit totalling 10s of thousands
Couldn’t do it now!!
Not sure I have a single rifle that shoots as well or i have the confidence in!!
And I have suffered from specification creep in every department!!
Did you choose to bed the action?
ColinBr
Well-Known Member
Yes. Didn't see the reason not to
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