To stainless or not to stainless

[nevilleblack]

Hi,
I'm thinking of purchasing a a new 243.
Would you guys recommend going for a stainless steel barrel?
Does it have many advantages?

 

[Jager SA]

Stainless is fine, less to look after, however without care it will rust, less that chromoly of course. Chromoly on the other hand is harder wearing but requires more care to maintain.

 

[Erik Hamburger]

Stainless: Virtually no cleaning required, but more viseable.

Wrapping some scrim netting around the barrel, and securing it with Sellotape (yes, really) has given me the best of both worlds: Virtually no cleaning regime; no more shine and a break-up of the outline. Unorthodox? Yes. Effective? Yes.

 

[RobNorfolk]

Stainless is a lot less to maintain, in that you don't have to look after the blueing. I like that I don't have to be in a mad rush to dry and clean the rifle after being out in the rain. They are not generally shiny, but if you want a different finish you can Cerakote (or similar) for not too much money.
For stalking purposes, the lifespan will be the same.

 

[whinfell]

I have had 2 Tikka rifles in stainless that both developed rust spots on the barrel, one of them was only 3 weeks old when rust started appearing on the barrel, i am meticulous in my cleaning regime, needless to say there won't be a third, i got a full refund from my dealer for both rifles, the last time i was in his shop he showed me a brand new Tikka that he had ordered for a customer guess what rust spots on it, a brand new rifle that has never been in the field, doesn't inspire confidence does it.

 

[Tom D]

I have had 2 Tikka rifles in stainless that both developed rust spots on the barrel, one of them was only 3 weeks old when rust started appearing on the barrel, i am meticulous in my cleaning regime, needless to say there won't be a third, i got a full refund from my dealer for both rifles, the last time i was in his shop he showed me a brand new Tikka that he had ordered for a customer guess what rust spots on it, a brand new rifle that has never been in the field, doesn't inspire confidence does it.

All stainless will rust as you describe, especially if handled with a sweaty hand before being put away​, this is why you are suposed to wear cotton gloves to handle antique metal and paper. I have had minor rust spots on my LW 7-08 barrel from this. A light rub with duraglit metal polish easily removes them and a light coat of oil helps protect..

Maybe I have particularly corrosive sweat lol,

Just remember that if a little sweat can corrode the outside of your barrel, imagine what the ammonia from your moderator can do to the inside. Stainless is definately not maintenance free. I still prefer it to blued though.

 

[gmart122]

Stainless steel gun barrels are made from an uncommon types of stainless called Martensitic. It is characterised as being stronger and tougher than other stainless types; but is less resistant to corrosion. This is used to fullfill the barrels primary function which is to expell bullets. Its corrosion resistantance is a secondary function and is not a material of workmanship problem at Tikka.

Most stainless you will encounter will be Austenitic and far better at corrosion resistance. This includes any moderator, so can't be compared to a gun barrel.

All said for a stainless gun barrel to rust there has to be something wrong with the care of it. Even bare mild steel will not rust if it has a coating of oil on it.

 

[ejg]

One of the best things one can do with a new rifle, stainless or not.
Unpack, take out of the stock and wash with hot soap water, then rinse well, dry, and flush with WD40 and cover with a good gun oil.
If a synthetic stock then also wash it well, even timber, wipe it with a damp cloth.
This will remove unwanted corrosive leftovers from the production or handling.
I have no corrosion problems whatsoever, my rifle safe at home is less than 25yds from a salt water river, my workshop with gun safe is 100yds from the estuary.
edi

 

[private fraser]

More info here...

http://www.thestalkingdirectory.co.uk/showthread.php/63709-Why-stainless

 

[adriandavidb]

One of the best things one can do with a new rifle, stainless or not.
Unpack, take out of the stock and wash with hot soap water, then rinse well, dry, and flush with WD40 and cover with a good gun oil.
If a synthetic stock then also wash it well, even timber, wipe it with a damp cloth.
This will remove unwanted corrosive leftovers from the production or handling.
I have no corrosion problems whatsoever, my rifle safe at home is less than 25yds from a salt water river, my workshop with gun safe is 100yds from the estuary.
edi

Old thread but . . .

Wouldn't a flush with WD40 alone do the trick? I was under the impression it comprises a lubricating fraction thinned with a volatile lighter spirit that evaporates off leaving the more viscous component behind to coat and protect the metalwork.

 

[swarovski]

Stains less , my t3v went rusty, sent it back, it was bead blasted or something simalar,its been fine since, this happened years ago

 

[ejg]

Old thread but . . .

Wouldn't a flush with WD40 alone do the trick? I was under the impression it comprises a lubricating fraction thinned with a volatile lighter spirit that evaporates off leaving the more viscous component behind to coat and protect the metalwork.

The water will dilute/flush of non organic "acid/bases". WD40 or white spirits etc. might dilute flush organics such as oils, greases, cutting fluids but might not do the job on salts etc. from surface treating.
edi

 

[The deer man]

It's not unusual for stainless steel to rust however it would generally be caused by the introduction of a contaminate in some form or other rather than the stainless steel product itself.

Put very simply stainless steel contains chromium which forms a passive outer layer (of chromium oxide) so long as there is oxygen, this is it's protective layer. Take the oxygen away in an area by an aggressive contaminate i.e. salty water droplets, spec of paint, iron oxide contamination, pollution, chemicals etc. and the oxygen is removed from that isolated spot and so starts corrosion.

Rarely the fault of the stainless steel itself (assuming it is top quality) but generally the fault of the keeper/owner of the product who does not understand the importance of keeping stainless steel clean and free of contamination.

I hear you say, so why have stainless steel, the answer is it's still far more resistant to 'rusting' than other steel.

Regarding the post about the Tikka rifles, somewhere along the line a contaminate was probably introduced. Now whether that was at the factory, proof house or retailer who knows but probably not the fault of an inferior stainless steel rifle barrel and action.

Remedy is to completely remove the rust spot or pitting by polishing out or an appropriate form of blasting. Then as far as guns go, keep clean or Cerekote it!

Having said all that, after many years in the marine industry, I've seen stainless steel with great chunks eaten out of it! This had more to do with highly inferior stainless steel and galvanic corrosion, something we should never see in guns.

 

[Monkey Spanker]

Stainless with a cerakote finish. Low maint and low vis.
MS

 

[dan71]

I have never had stainless but i have never also had a gun go rusty. Keep them well oiled and if you get them wet make sure you dont put it away wet and make sure its oiled!

 

[telecaster]

I have never had stainless but i have never also had a gun go rusty. Keep them well oiled and if you get them wet make sure you dont put it away wet and make sure its oiled!

+1
Blued or stainless look after them the same.

 

[adriandavidb]

The water will dilute/flush of non organic "acid/bases". WD40 or white spirits etc. might dilute flush organics such as oils, greases, cutting fluids but might not do the job on salts etc. from surface treating.
edi

Yep I'm aware; I have a degree in chemistry. I was not questioning why you would treat the rifle to an aqueous wash first; rather why use WD40 and THEN an oil, when the WD40 will leave behind a protective organic film after the lighter fractions have evaporated, so no need for the oil after.

My apologies; perhaps I should have made myself clearer

 

[adriandavidb]

It's not unusual for stainless steel to rust however it would generally be caused by the introduction of a contaminate in some form or other rather than the stainless steel product i

Put very simply stainless steel contains chromium which forms a passive outer layer (of chromium oxide) so long as there is oxygen, this is it's protective layer. Take the oxygen away in an area by an aggressive contaminate i.e. salty water droplets, spec of paint, iron oxide contamination, pollution, chemicals etc. and the oxygen is removed from that isolated spot and so starts corrosion.

Rarely the fault of the stainless steel itself (assuming it is top quality) but generally the fault of the keeper/owner of the product who does not understand the importance of keeping stainless steel clean and free of contamination.

I hear you say, so why have stainless steel, the answer is it's still far more resistant to 'rusting' than other steel.

Regarding the post about the Tikka rifles, somewhere along the line a contaminate was probably introduced. Now whether that was at the factory, proof house or retailer who knows but probably not the fault of an inferior stainless steel rifle barrel and action.

Remedy is to completely remove the rust spot or pitting by polishing out or an appropriate form of blasting. Then as far as guns go, keep clean or Cerekote it!

Having said all that, after many years in the marine industry, I've seen stainless steel with great chunks eaten out of it! This had more to do with highly inferior stainless steel and galvanic corrosion, something we should never see in guns.

Absolutely, well put!

Even stainless steels will corrode in anaerobic conditions (you can test this if you want by leaving your rifle submerged in a peat bog for a while!! ). Galvanic coupling can often explain isolated spots of corrosion in poor quality steels but that would be unlikely in a rifle as you say.

I guess some here aren't aware that a 'stainless' rifle will never be as stain-less as as (for example) a Rolex submarine watch, because stain resistance and hardness/toughness are to some extent mutually exclusive in stainless steels. 'True' stainless steels are martensitic; rifle barrels are austenitic and have a different micro structure.

Maybe cerokote idea is a good one, sounds a bit "belt and braces", but that way you keep the slightly superior corrosion resistance for the bore, although of course chrome/moly barrel will take more rounds before it's shot out.

 

[Alantoo]

Stainless steel gun barrels are made from an uncommon types of stainless called Martensitic. It is characterised as being stronger and tougher than other stainless types; but is less resistant to corrosion. snip...
Most stainless you will encounter will be Austenitic and far better at corrosion resistance. snip

snip... 'True' stainless steels are martensitic; rifle barrels are austenitic and have a different micro structure.

Confused?

As an (unqualified) blacksmith, rather than a gunsmith or chemist I have always understood that the most corrosion and stain resistant Stainless steels were the Austenitic, 316 best catering and 304 Architectural. The Martensitic were the 400 grades (with higher carbon content and so hardenable) were less corrosion resistant.

Alan

 

[ejg]

Yep I'm aware; I have a degree in chemistry. I was not questioning why you would treat the rifle to an aqueous wash first; rather why use WD40 and THEN an oil, when the WD40 will leave behind a protective organic film after the lighter fractions have evaporated, so no need for the oil after.

My apologies; perhaps I should have made myself clearer

No worries, oil after wd40 ? Some oils might just be slightly better at corrosion protection than wd40, wd40 cleans very well and removes water well. As far as I understand wd40 uses a fish oil, not 100% sure if this is true or not. Fish oils are very difficult to manufacture synthetically, as a BASF guy in the field explained to me once.

The point of shooting out stainless or chrome molly barrels would be down to the material used. A certain percentage of wear would be from corrosion as hot gasses pass, main wear would possibly be down to thermo shock behaviour of the material leading to more or less fire cracking. Several parameters involved in that, like e-module, thermal conductivity, tensile strength, thermal expansion. (all of these at different temperatures)

edi