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CDSG Shooting Sports
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Grantoliver

Guest
Many months is my view. I was going to suggest last year but it looks like the vegetation around it was quite lush before being killed off by the toxins given off by the decaying body. So the earliest I would go for would be early spring this year.

CSI East Midlands.
 

wadashot

Well-Known Member
It obviously wasn`t there when the farmer first sowed hi crop, and to be honest a carcasse does not take a long time to decompose in warm weather. It will have been fly blown within hours of dying and they will have hatched off into maggots within 1 or 2 days. :eek:
The question i would be asking myself is how it might have died, although natural causes is a probability, you should be asking if it was shot at by poachers or has the stalker on this or neighbouring ground taken a bad shot without following it up. :rolleyes:

wadas
 

300wsm

Well-Known Member
How old was it?

You could then judge the antler development normal for the area against the bucks antlers that would give you a starting point for length of time it had been dead.
 

sikamalc

Administrator
Site Staff
Looks to me as though its been there about 4 to 5 months. The only way you will really tells its age is by the teeth. Its obvious its a mature animal but it appears from the photograph supplied that something (ie rats etc) have chewed the spellers off the antlers, so its not so easy to judge the age by the antlers in this case, at least thats my opinion.
 

300wsm

Well-Known Member
This is all a bit of guess work and deduction,

Its looks as though it was still in velvet when it died and,
This year the fallow in the park did not start to cast until I came down to Quex, this would mean had it died then it would have had no antlers,
the antlers look fairly well developed but depending on area I may well be wrong!

Last Aug a muntjac was knocked over on the track down to the house I left the carcass on the verge to see now quickly it decomposed It took less than 2 weeks to just be skin and bones.

My guess would be less than 6 weeks.
 

stone

Well-Known Member
mjjl
is the crop winter rape or spring rape?
that will give an indication when the crop was planted , even the farmer can tell you that
looking at the way the mask has decomposed suggests atleast 3 months
looking at the antler formation gives you no idication of actual age possibly 8years +
as for cause of death thats easy
starvation
why cos you can see his ribs :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
 
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Grantoliver

Guest
I agree that had this died in the summer or at least what passes for one in this country it would have gone in no time. Thats why I am fairly sure it died before the flies became an issue. The shrinkage of the skin and the fact that it is largely in one piece indicates to me a winter death. Hence the reason that I think early this or late last year.
 

sikamalc

Administrator
Site Staff
You will be suprised how long skin as seen on this carcase can last out in the weather over a period of months, even years if in the right area and conditions.
 

300wsm

Well-Known Member
The fact it is in summer coat (I think rather than menil) indicates it was not a winter death.

Also was the rape swathed or direct combined as some of the rape under the carcass looked as thought it had been swathed in which case the carcass has not been there long at all.

As malc said sometimes the skin can last a long time depending on conditions, other times it is gone in a matter of weeks
 

stone

Well-Known Member
right i am beginning to like this game
i think it must be winter rape as most spring rape may not of been harvested as yet
so if it was in velvet it would hav to be in the later stages or the antlers would not of been so fully formed and would of rotted away a lot more, so i think this is before antler drop so possibly june the latest maybe, thought about the summer coat , spots quite prominent and bright, maybe a common or menil with a the camera slightly distorting the true colour making it a little lighter than it is to the naked eye, but with the warmer winter a moult could hav happened a little earlier so possibly early stages of summer coat starting to show
jaw bone is displaced which means it has been moved or knocked possibly by the combine thats why it's lay on cut rape, as head in funny angle or has been moved for the picture
the colour of the antlers is causing a few questionable doubts as if this was in velvet but in the late stages where hard horn was starting to show then less than 6 weeks is an option, but my deer are still in velvet or the larger heads are
uuummm
now where did i put sherlock's numbers :confused:
 

300wsm

Well-Known Member
Stone,

Common's dont have a red coat with spots in winter coat :lol:

If there is a picture that the dorsal stripe can be seen on that would tell you if it was a menil
 

Fester

Well-Known Member
Yep! Looking at them pics im gonna guess its definately dead that is :eek:
Its hard to tell really when it died, The way the weather has been lately its a guess to be honest.
As waddas has already said, It would of been fly blown within hours of death in the sun, The maggots do a bloody good job in the heat, I watched a RTA roe doe last year end up in this state of decomposition within a couple of weeks.
Not only the maggots will have helped it along, Crows,Foxes,Badgers all kinds of insects & vermin would of helped themself to a nice bit of rotting fallow haunch just to help it along a bit :eek:
CSI Fallow cops are needed on this 1 :D
Nick (Fester :D )
 

stone

Well-Known Member
now the thing i hav over looked is the comments mjjl made about the smell
if it had been there for a while the smell should realy not quite be that bad
but as it nearly made him gip, so this in mind and the possible summer coat mixed in with wada's assumption then
300 may be nearer the mark at 6 weeks ,than i think
bugger :lol:
 

JAYB

Administrator
Site Staff
Stones right, if it was still smelly and ripe I would not have put this past 6-8 weeks, if that. It was still remarkably complete as well, the foxes would have had it divvied up and removed what they could, plus all the rest of nature's refuse collectors. I don't think he had been there that long.

What is it on Spike Milligan's headstone, "I told them I wasn't feeling well", I think this boy could make the same claim :eek:

John
 
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