Identify deer using scope

[Milligan]

Surprised this is still going,

I'm not
And look, it's at 3 pages now.

 

[Freeforester]

Or another point of view is yes, assuming the scope is of sufficient quality to allow you to get a clear image at the top end of the mag range and you can hold the rifle steady enough. If you're really worried about pointed a loaded rifle at possibly the incorrect sex deer then unload and do it with the bolt back.

Or detatch the scope from the rifle, otherwise get yourself a decent spotting scope, 20-30 mag is perfect for the job, beyond 35'and you'll struggle to hold it steady enough to catch the details. I've used a 25-40/75 for looking at roe heads since the mid 1980's I very seldom bother cranking it above 35x, too much shimmer or instability if you're on the move, even with sticks.

 

[finnbear270]

OK, Bino’s first, or MK1 eyeball, secondary examination in scope OK.?

 

[billy_boyle_2010]

Scanning for suitable quarry with binoculars of course. But IMO when a deer is identified- and potentially in a safe shooting spot- further analysis with the scope isn't unsafe.

 

[smullery]

I went out stalking yesterday morning after roe bucks. I spotted a roe deer just as it was getting light, maybe 4.15am. The deer was grazing about 150m away in waist high grass, between 6 year old Sitka Spruce. Boy was it hard to identify the sex, all I could see was the top of a red summer coat until eventually I saw her neck patches and ears and I walked on. I can normally tell the sex pretty quickly, but June is probably the hardest month as the woodland cover is so high and they are not yet rutting. We don't have arable or mown rides around here.

This got me thinking if some higher magnification would help in these situations to spot presence of antlers, anal tush, pistle, patches on throat etc. I use 8x42 binos and a fixed 6x42 rifle scope and I steady both on quad sticks.

I have never used variable magnification scopes and was always taught not to use the scope for spying. Is it acceptable and do high variable mag scopes at say 10x or 12x help? Clearly I would only spy stationary deer with safe backdrop etc. not widely glassing the countryside.

Thanks,

Only way to tell a Doe is to look at the tush on the backside.

Only way to tell a Buck is no tush on the backside.

Applies 365 days a year

P.S. At this time of year Bucks tend to have Antlers, or as I think, more than two ears.......

 

[Cumbrian 1]

I've never scanned with a rifle scope but have I ever gone "Oh look a roe" or whatever, got the rifle up quick (assuming its safe to do so) and double checked the sex and condition through the scope before taking a shot or not? Sure.

Sometimes you dont get long to take a shot and I've been able to get a few on the deck this way where if I'd been farting about with the binos first I'd have missed the opportunity.

No Stubear, you think it’s okay but then what about the TEMPTATION!!!!!! Before you know it you’ll be using you rifle/scope combo for every day uses, driving to the shops checking those traffic lights etc

 

[Cumbrian 1]

Or detatch the scope from the rifle, otherwise get yourself a decent spotting scope, 20-30 mag is perfect for the job, beyond 35'and you'll struggle to hold it steady enough to catch the details. I've used a 25-40/75 for looking at roe heads since the mid 1980's I very seldom bother cranking it above 35x, too much shimmer or instability if you're on the move, even with sticks.

I have to agree regarding the top end magnification, I now use a Swarovski fixed eyepiece telescope 15-30 scope for spotting as my roe ground is quite hilly and you can identify antlers at quite a distance. I use a bean bag on the car roof for stability

 

[Tis1979]

“ I have never used variable magnification scopes and was always taught not to use the scope for spying. Is it acceptable and do high variable mag scopes at say 10x or 12x help? Clearly I would only spy stationary deer with safe backdrop etc. not widely glassing the countryside.”

surely people are over thinking this, does a variable scope help in the situation described for identifying the sex of the deer?.....Yes it does. Also being able to have it at 2.5 x mag is great in woodland for stalking.

 

[deerly departed]

Using a rifle scope to scan is not good. Most sensible shooters will recognise this as a fact.

Your best argument is to use a scope to check would be to double check your initial feelings once spotted and all other consuderations have been green lighted in your mind before you squeeze the trigger. It should be to reinforce your initial feeling that its compliant to GL conditions.

It might save a mistake being made and the wrong animal being dropped.

If you dont believe the quarry isnt compliant to GL using bins, its simple... walk away or reposition so you can reassess and make a better decision without the need for checking with a scope on a rifle. Your removing one area for an accident that could be a life changer.

The fact you have any doubt means the shot isnt on in the first place .... period.

Decent bins are a worthwhile investment so spend what you need to the level you need.

 

[bogtrotter]

Using a rifle scope to scan is not good. Most sensible shooters will recognise this as a fact.

Your best argument is to use a scope to check would be to double check your initial feelings once spotted and all other consuderations have been green lighted in your mind before you squeeze the trigger. It should be to reinforce your initial feeling that its compliant to GL conditions.

It might save a mistake being made and the wrong animal being dropped.

If you dont believe the quarry isnt compliant to GL using bins, its simple... walk away or reposition so you can reassess and make a better decision without the need for checking with a scope on a rifle. Your removing one area for an accident that could be a life changer.

The fact you have any doubt means the shot isnt on in the first place .... period.

Decent bins are a worthwhile investment so spend what you need to the level you need.

Well said, It is strange really, a few years ago, no one would have even considered using a scope to do this but as more
and more people enter the stalking world there seems to be a relaxing of the etiquette ,tradition ,best practice call
it what you will.
No matter that all best practice guides BDS , SNH, DI and several others all outlaw the practice there are still those who
consider it ok not only are they prepared to do it but they come on an open forum and advocate its use to others.
As I see it its a case of many people not having grown up with a background of firearms like many of us had nor the
mentoring that many of us had.
As a youngster this kind of practice would have resulted in being banned from handling any firearm for an extended period.
I know the above makes me sound like an old fart ,which admittedly I am , but where firearms are concerned you can't
be too careful.

 

[Tis1979]

Well said, It is strange really, a few years ago, no one would have even considered using a scope to do this but as more
and more people enter the stalking world there seems to be a relaxing of the etiquette ,tradition ,best practice call
it what you will.
No matter that all best practice guides BDS , SNH, DI and several others all outlaw the practice there are still those who
consider it ok not only are they prepared to do it but they come on an open forum and advocate its use to others.
As I see it its a case of many people not having grown up with a background of firearms like many of us had nor the
mentoring that many of us had.
As a youngster this kind of practice would have resulted in being banned from handling any firearm for an extended period.
I know the above makes me sound like an old fart ,which admittedly I am , but where firearms are concerned you can't
be too careful.

I respect what your saying but the op is asking if a variable scope would help identify the deer age/sex etc which it would, being a responsible firearms user he’s only going to mount the rifle in the direction of the deer if it is safe to do so as he has stated, if it is indeed the deer that he after he takes the shot, if it is not he doesn’t.
Years ago we were taught that was not the done thing.......absolutely, but like anything you either move with times or you do not, the same people didn’t like binoculars when they were introduced then variable scopes......imagine there faces when you turn up with a thermal.

 

[Freeforester]

Hadn't realised the basic laws of physics, momentum and terminal ballistics had changed so much! I'd be prepared to do it, once the scope was off the rifle, not before. Old fashioned, sure, why not? Beats the alternative, and I'd personally not be continuing the stalk with anyone waving a firearm around like that, and nor am I sorry to declare so.

The problem I'd have is with the underpiece and the afterpiece, not the optic piece.

But hey, crack on, I'd not be part of the story thereafter.

 

[Tis1979]

Hadn't realised the basic laws of physics, momentum and terminal ballistics had changed so much! I'd be prepared to do it, once the scope was off the rifle, not before. Old fashioned, sure, why not? Beats the alternative, and I'd personally not be continuing the stalk with anyone waving a firearm around like that, and nor am I sorry to declare so.

The problem I'd have is with the underpiece and the afterpiece, not the optic piece.

But hey, crack on, I'd not be part of the story thereafter.

The op never said he was waving a firearm around, he’s confirming the deers sex before he takes the shot.

 

[Freeforester]

Basic Level 1 stuff, is Safety. I wonder if he ran the scenario past the examiner, what the outcome would be, pass or fail?

Having failed to identify what you are intending to shoot (- its possibly too far to see the sex with the naked eye, so he chooses to identify with an optical aid, in this case attached to an item capable of lethal force), you've failed basic identification procedures also. Try explaining to your FEO at your next renewal, I think you'll find it might make for a bit of a wake up.

 

[Tis1979]

Basic Level 1 stuff, is Safety. I wonder if he ran the scenario past the examiner, what the outcome would be, pass or fail?

Having failed to identify what you are intending to shoot (- its possibly too far to see the sex with the naked eye, so he chooses to identify with an optical aid, in this case attached to an item capable of lethal force), you've failed basic identification procedures also. Try explaining to your FEO at your next renewal, I think you'll find it might make for a bit of a wake up.

safety is paramount totally agree. Do you check the deer in the scope before you take your shot? Or assume you have it right? say a doe with an antler Or a Hummel, this in no way a dig at anyone just a discussion about checking the deer in the scope before you take the shot.

 

[Freeforester]

0- 0:50:



I'm not the one looking to learn the basics here. In order to make contact with the deer everyone has to look in the general direction of the animal, by then I've done the preliminary stuff, decided whether it is or isn't a suitable cull, safe backstop, thereafter I'm looking at the part of the animal I'm going to hit, not whether it's Bambi or his mum, sorry.

 

[Tis1979]

0- 0:50:



I'm not the one looking to learn the basics here. In order to make contact with the deer everyone has to look in the general direction of the animal, by then I've done the preliminary stuff, decided whether it is or isn't a suitable cull, safe backstop, thereafter I'm looking at the part of the animal I'm going to hit, not whether it's Bambi or his mum, sorry.

No need to apologise, and good for you

 

[Freeforester]

As Smullery says at #45, if you spend a bit more time looking at the back end than the front end, you'll know whether it's a female or male; Shot this one in 1984, I could see there was something akin to a cauliflower floret-sized bump, but was 100% sure of its sex prior to taking it and its doe calf.



I've had a guest shoot a Hummel, under instruction to do so; I've also had a guest shoot a hind in mistake for a Royal, he 'identified' it through his scope; it's best to learn from the mistakes of others rather than to repeat them yourself.

 

[Tis1979]

that’s great I am certainly not questioning your ability to stalk, the post was created by a guy asking if a higher mag scope will confirm what he‘s seen in his binoculars before he takes the shot. My answer to that is it will.

 

[Freeforester]

There's no doubt about the optical aspects, only the safety implications.

I'll leave this there, I've got a safe guest to guide in 15!