RSPB and "gamebird" shooting

kes

Well-Known Member
Despite their constitution the RSPB carried out a survey of its mebers (randomised about 5,500, included 500 volunteers in it and some 2,500 RSPB staff and concluded that " a minimum of 14 % of respondents were against some form of game shooting".
Here is the info


"At the RSPB’s AGM in 2019, our Chair of Council, Kevin Cox, announced that the RSPB was reviewing its policy on the most intensive forms of gamebird shooting especially driven grouse moor management (which involves shooting our native red grouse) and large-scale release of non-native game birds, primarily pheasants and red-legged partridges, now in excess of 57 million birds annually.

We are very keen to provide regular updates on this review and today, I report the results of the first phase which involved a consultation of our members, volunteers, staff and other stakeholders.



It is worth remembering that we are doing the review because there is growing public concern and mounting scientific evidence about the environmental impacts of these types of shooting. Impacts include the ongoing and systematic illegal persecution of birds of prey such as hen harriers; the ecological impact of high numbers of game birds released into the countryside which may increase the density of generalist predators; the mass culling of mountain hares in some parts of our uplands (hopefully now consigned to the history books after last month’s vote in the Scottish Parliament to give mountain hare greater protection); the use of lead ammunition; the impact of burning peatlands and medicating wild animals for shooting.

Results of the consultations

As I reported in May*, through the various consultations we ran we received views from:

  • a randomised sample of 5,265 RSPB members (full survey responses)
  • an additional 663 RSPB members and others (online comments)
  • 2,847 RSPB staff and volunteers
  • more than 23 organisations or groups with an interest in nature conservation, animal welfare, land management and gamebird shootings
  • more than 60 individuals through some confidential conversations
(* figures updated to reflect final response numbers)

The headline findings are as follows:

  • RSPB members, staff and volunteers are broadly aligned in their views, specifically: the majority are knowledgeable about the issues associated with intensive gamebird shooting, the majority support the conservation principles; any opposition to the approach proposed is more likely to come from the shooting (1%) or landowning (5%) part of the membership; a minimum of 14% support some sort of ban on shooting (intensive or otherwise).
  • Given the size of the samples, we have high confidence in concluding the views we received provide a good reflection of the whole membership, staff and volunteers
  • The views expressed by the other organisations (conservation, animal welfare and shooting groups) and individuals reflected different values, motivations and long held positions. At one end of the spectrum were respondents who valued shooting as an activity with social, environmental and economic benefits. Conversely, at the other end of the spectrum were responses with animal welfare interests who expressed little value of shooting, considering it unnecessary and harmful. Other responses ranged in between, from seeking sustainable shooting and highlighting concerns over environmental impacts of current practices, to supporting a total or partial ban.
  • The confidential interviews provided a few additional insights, specifically: the pride in conservation associated with shooting; the observed increased interest in the environmental impacts of the industry, particularly more intensive forms; and dismay at the state of the relationship between the shooting community and the RSPB
For those of you that would like to find out more, please do look at:

  • an infographic which summarises the results of the survey of members.
  • the summary of the reports on the consultation with stakeholders
  • the summary of the report of the confidential interviews with members of the shooting community
These are posted at the bottom of this blog.

Thank you"

Perhaps common sense rather than the anarchists have prevailed, despite the attempt to skew the result and abandon their constitution which does not allow them to lobby against shooting.

For info.
 
Funny how an organisation holding Royal Charter and a constitution that specifically prohibits the opposition of game shooting has come to this.

That's what you get when your organisation is infiltrated by wannabe anarchists, no good will come of it. Just look where that lead the Labour party...

Much like the Scottish Independence Referendum, such 'one off' polls will be undoubtedly be bought back via stealth and opportunism until achievement of the 'correct' result (i.e desired by the ones who schemed it up).

Having studied politics, I see no 'democratic' value at all in conducting such polls; their purpose is not to steer decisions, but serve as PR for ones that have already been made behind closed doors (if they work as intended).

E.g: The Brexit referendum, I'm not happy about the result (I don't vote on anything out of principle, for reasons as outlined above) but have accepted that I will have to plan a future that does not involve residing in the UK, despite being born here with full citizenship.
 
...."a minimum of 14% of RSPB members were against some sort of ban on shooting"?

So isn't the headline that should be fanfared "over 85% of RSPB members are not against some sort of ban on shooting"??
Isn't that what the RSPB's own survey is showing? Sounds like an opportunity for every org to use this information for positive PR, surely.... c'mon BASC, fire up the media centre engines; other orgs, get all over this!
 
Funny how an organisation holding Royal Charter and a constitution that specifically prohibits the opposition of game shooting has come to this.

That's what you get when your organisation is infiltrated by wannabe anarchists, no good will come of it. Just look where that lead the Labour party...

Much like the Scottish Independence Referendum, such 'one off' polls will be undoubtedly be bought back via stealth and opportunism until achievement of the 'correct' result (i.e desired by the ones who schemed it up).

Having studied politics, I see no 'democratic' value at all in conducting such polls; their purpose is not to steer decisions, but serve as PR for ones that have already been made behind closed doors (if they work as intended).

E.g: The Brexit referendum, I'm not happy about the result (I don't vote on anything out of principle, for reasons as outlined above) but have accepted that I will have to plan a future that does not involve residing in the UK, despite being born here with full citizenship.
What you waiting for?
Dont let the door hit your arse on the way out!
 
The point is worth making in support of shooting and the RSPB that ONLY 14% of a selected group of RSPB supporters think shooting or game shooting should be stopped.
Publish this survey and ask the membership for support on GL discussions to protect birds by controlling corvids, or as justification for their control by shooting.
Video links to clear predation (which we all know about) would help massively.

The point is also worth making that all our orgs should, on this basis, suggest their members have a dual membership and do so to enhance our already strong conservation values by linking to RSPB agendas which support wildfowl etc explicitly. In the longer run, reasonable people could challenge for board places, to support the views of the majority of the RSPB membership, since funds are currently being wasted on legal battles directed by people like Avery and Packham to serve their own agendas and clearly NOT the members, nor is there any willingness to share agendas like e.g. Marsh Harriers. The current president Ms Krestofnicof (sp) however, strikes me as a pragmatist and realist - why not ask her ?
Very strong statements from BASC et al would allow shooters to re-orientate misplaced opinion about raptor predation by simply stating that BASC et all will institute legal proceedings against any members found to be controlling raptors without legal authority. This has been said but needs to be renewed and reinforced as part of a 'handshake' policy change.
This type of support from shooting will be seen for what it is - a genuine revulsion against killing B.O.P. and law- breaking and a genuine willingness to support conservation.
If anybody can make a case for banning lead on conservation and sustainability grounds even if voluntarily , surely such a massively supported agenda by the membership would be a game-changer.

I am sure a sensible policy could be made of this - it isn't often your supposed opposition is found to be neutral or negatively supportive (excluding the management who are out of touch, as in other places) and the RSPB members clearly deserve our help to support their worthwhile agendas of conservation -here a strong link to GWCT is needed to use their scientific work.
Come on Connor this isn't rocket science, nor is it BASC bashing - Yet. make the C in BASC a rallying point (as opposed to a 'call to action').
 
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The point is worth making in support of shooting and the RSPB that ONLY 14% of a selected group of RSPB supporters think shooting or game shooting should be stopped.
Publish this survey and ask the membership for support on GL discussions to protect birds by controlling corvids, or as justification for their control by shooting.
Video links to clear predation (which we all know about) would help massively.

The point is also worth making that all our orgs should, on this basis, suggest their members have a dual membership and do so to enhance our already strong conservation values by linking to RSPB agendas which support wildfowl etc explicitly. In the longer run, reasonable people could challenge for board places, to support the views of the majority of the RSPB membership, since funds are currently being wasted on legal battles directed by people like Avery and Packham to serve their own agendas and clearly NOT the members, nor is there any willingness to share agendas like e.g. Marsh Harriers. The current president Ms Krestofnicof (sp) however, strikes me as a pragmatist and realist - why not ask her ?
Very strong statements from BASC et al would allow shooters to re-orientate misplaced opinion about raptor predation by simply stating that BASC et all will institute legal proceedings against any members found to be controlling raptors without legal authority. This has been said but needs to be renewed and reinforced as part of a 'handshake' policy change.
This type of support from shooting will be seen for what it is - a genuine revulsion against killing B.O.P. and law- breaking and a genuine willingness to support conservation.
If anybody can make a case for banning lead on conservation and sustainability grounds even if voluntarily , surely such a massively supported agenda by the membership would be a game-changer.

I am sure a sensible policy could be made of this - it isn't often your supposed opposition is found to be neutral or negatively supportive (excluding the management who are out of touch, as in other places) and the RSPB members clearly deserve our help to support their worthwhile agendas of conservation -here a strong link to GWCT is needed to use their scientific work.
Come on Connor this isn't rocket science, nor is it BASC bashing - Yet. make the C in BASC a rallying point (as opposed to a 'call to action').
Good post ^^^^
 
The point is worth making in support of shooting and the RSPB that ONLY 14% of a selected group of RSPB supporters think shooting or game shooting should be stopped.
Publish this survey and ask the membership for support on GL discussions to protect birds by controlling corvids, or as justification for their control by shooting.
Video links to clear predation (which we all know about) would help massively.

The point is also worth making that all our orgs should, on this basis, suggest their members have a dual membership and do so to enhance our already strong conservation values by linking to RSPB agendas which support wildfowl etc explicitly. In the longer run, reasonable people could challenge for board places, to support the views of the majority of the RSPB membership, since funds are currently being wasted on legal battles directed by people like Avery and Packham to serve their own agendas and clearly NOT the members, nor is there any willingness to share agendas like e.g. Marsh Harriers. The current president Ms Krestofnicof (sp) however, strikes me as a pragmatist and realist - why not ask her ?
Very strong statements from BASC et al would allow shooters to re-orientate misplaced opinion about raptor predation by simply stating that BASC et all will institute legal proceedings against any members found to be controlling raptors without legal authority. This has been said but needs to be renewed and reinforced as part of a 'handshake' policy change.
This type of support from shooting will be seen for what it is - a genuine revulsion against killing B.O.P. and law- breaking and a genuine willingness to support conservation.
If anybody can make a case for banning lead on conservation and sustainability grounds even if voluntarily , surely such a massively supported agenda by the membership would be a game-changer.

I am sure a sensible policy could be made of this - it isn't often your supposed opposition is found to be neutral or negatively supportive (excluding the management who are out of touch, as in other places) and the RSPB members clearly deserve our help to support their worthwhile agendas of conservation -here a strong link to GWCT is needed to use their scientific work.
Come on Connor this isn't rocket science, nor is it BASC bashing - Yet. make the C in BASC a rallying point (as opposed to a 'call to action').
You sure you don`t wanna run for BASC council ?
 
The power of words and misuse of statistics....: The same Report could read:

"The RSPB carried out a survey of its members (randomised about 5,500, included 500 volunteers in it and some 2,500 RSPB staff) and concluded that " a maximum of 86 % of respondents had no objections against some form of game shooting".
 
You sure you don`t wanna run for BASC council ?

Blueroll - thank you for your comment - I would willingly run for Council but 'they' do not want me (by omission) and I would not have enough support, soon enough, to change direction to a better way for my liking. John Swift e.g. is still the Chairman of their environmental charity, The Wildlife Habitat Trust. He and his supporters would have to go for me.
Rapid change is required to put shooting in a better light, and dealing with shootings failures is an essential part of that.
My own view would be to build credibility massively, quickly and effectively through initiatives to claim the support of the wider UK community - not just the shooting community and then only a small proportion of that.
Arrogance has to be put aside, apologies have to be given and science and legal action brought to bear.
Probably why they don't want change?
 
Just remember wj/ p ackham/ Avery etal are different to the r spb, may be slight differences but they are different.
But the r spb will be 1 off the biggest individual users off the GL.
Not that they'll ever admit that

Mind a few years ago when candas and greylags were added to GL in England to uproar from wildfowlers, r spb never put up any objection.
Probably very happy now no SL paper trail for licences to inject/oil eggs on there reservers
 
The point is also worth making that all our orgs should, on this basis, suggest their members have a dual membership and do so to enhance our already strong conservation values by linking to RSPB agendas which support wildfowl etc explicitly. In the longer run, reasonable people could challenge for board places, to support the views of the majority of the RSPB membership
That was the case a good few years back, lots of RSPB (shooting) members were threatening to leave for whatever reason, they were advised to remain and in doing so be able to have their say in matters such as this. A good win in this instance
 
The same 'enthusiasts' might dwell on the fact that since hare numbers crashed on one highland estate where hitherto heather had been managed in the first instance for the benefit of grouse shooting but then ceased (a decision in part influenced by the growing clamour from a few years now), choking off the supply of short and new growth, the three eagle eyries present on the estate that had in all earlier years produced viable chicks which duly fledged have all since failed on successive seasons.

Unrelated?

A holistic approach to predator and prey is required, not ill-informed diktat, which serves neither the wildlife nor those who profess to love the birds and 'know what is best' for them.
 
Surprised they made this public. Makes me suspicious
It could simply be a case of, come the 12th Aug "we are being reasonable - look at those nasty people shooting grouse and plovers (illegal) and Puffins (illegal). Both the latter have been suggested by the Packrat
 
It could simply be a case of, come the 12th Aug "we are being reasonable - look at those nasty people shooting grouse and plovers (illegal) and Puffins (illegal). Both the latter have been suggested by the Packrat
They’ve been at that for years and if they’re survey is right it’s not made much difference. I’d be happier if the 86% started making a difference from inside the rspb but I think if you do that you get turfed oot
 
I've just looked at the 'latest news' section of the BASC website.... not one mention of the RSPB survey, not one sentence along the line of >80% of RSPB members are not against shooting..... just how much of an open goal do BASC actually want??
 
Since 2018, 43* hen harriers have been confirmed killed or missing.
We’re calling on our governments to take urgent action now to protect the wildlife and habitats of our uplands, for nature and for people.

If you agree, enter your postcode to email your local politician with our call-to-action now:
*Correct as of Tuesday 11th August 2020.


Can read them like a book, 1 day before grouse Season and Wild Justice puts the above up on their blog.
 
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