Why did 6.5 Creedmoor make it relative to .260 Remington and 6.5 x 47?

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I really wish the average bloke on here would stop going on about “marketing” and actually step back and learn something for once. As usual on this subject, 99% of the answers you get here will be nonsense.

Saying its just marketing is horribly ignorant. The word marketing is typed out on the screen as if it is a synonym of dog turd.

Thank you @Laurie for a comprehensive rebuttal.

@NewForester there are some good accounts of the Creedmoor genesis and history out there, search Dennis DeMille and Dave Emery and Creedmoor and it will take you right there. It will add some flesh to what Laurie has said particularly about how DeMille saw a great opportunity for an ammunition manufacturer (and reloading tools manufacturer) to lead new product development rather than a rifle manufacturer operating in isolation. Critically he wanted his successful load to be available to the Everyman shooter, and how he convinced Hornady to print the load details on the factory ammunition boxes was an absolute gem of an idea.

The rest is history, the majority of you lot just need to get out of your sheds more, and get over it.
 
I believe Hornady 6.5CM fixed the issues that the other 6.5's had. Sales figures prove it. Customers are not all stupid or believe all "marketing" hype.
I weighed up pros & cons of the main 6.5 cartridges and thought the CM in conjunction with factory ammo offerings seem to be best for me. The biggest difference is if you are forced to use factory ammo and want to use a 20" barrel for Deer. Another advantage, it is a true short action cartridge that can avail of the AICS mags with heavy high bc bullets. As others said it is a combination of advantages. So far the 6.5CM has proven to work quite well for me, no advantage over a 308 up to ~ 300m. Shot plenty deer well beyond that, hind & calf last weekend in a plantation at 395m.
edi
 
I've never understood the antipathy. As soon as you mention the calibre folk are falling over themselves to say how it's no better than their pet calibre, and that users have fallen for the hype. The trouble is the armchair experts keep spouting bollx about how much better it is than everything else, yet funnily enough, those who have used it for what it was designed for quietly realised that indeed it was an inherently accurate long range target calibre that coincidentally happened to be very good at killing stuff. So, homophobic facebook memes apart, stick to your Scottish or Swedish rounds if that's what you want to do, but I'm going to continue shooting foxes at foxing ranges, deer at stalking ranges, and metal targets at silly distances, all with the same smooth and consistent rounds. I won't get rid of the .308, as occasionally I like to remind myself what a "real man's calibre" feels like. :cool:
 
Acm said:
I think there’s also a degree of truth in that the CM came at the right time. It’s come to market at a time when a lot of sportsman are considering lead free. And the 6.5’s really shine with these long for calibre projectiles. I think there’s a degree of timing to the success.
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Really? I think you are vastly overstating the UK/European influence on the market!
 
25 Sharps said:
Keep the cost of brass down you mean (or maybe ammo), the other components cost the same!

But yes, reloading keeps costs down and buying once fired brass drives costs down further, although .260 can be easily formed from .308 which is available in standard and palma and I formed a lot of creedmoor from .243 4/5 years ago as I wasn't going to be losing lapua cases in the field.....
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Oddly enough 100 lapua cases are more expensive new for the CM than the x 47....
 
Laurie said:
What Hornady did do from a year or more before day one was get other manufacturers on board - Savage, Ruger and Howa; GAP and others in the custom tactical field; PT&G and other reamer manufacturers. The ammo was in the dealers and there was a good choice of new rifles launched simultaneously in time for day one, with review examples for US shooting journalists, and the big gun shows like SHOT (which also sees 'range day' testing / trying-out opportunities out in the nearby desert for accredited journos).

Marketing spend? I doubt if Hornady spent as much as Remington or Winchester did on equivalent cartridges. Anybody who shouts 'marketing' implying it's a way of getting customers to adopt a poor product knows nothing about the subject - there are examples by the bucket-load of crap products, or that addressed markets that didn't actually exist, that failed miserably despite massive marketing and PR spends. Hornady did the whole job - design, listening to and working with those out in the field who know their business through and through, getting enough product into local gunshops and the big US chains and suppliers - really well. Remember, the 'Creedmoor' bit of the name is partly an iconic name from US target shooting history of the later 19th/early 20th centuries,
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Laurie,

the above IS marketing! And if you don’t think marketing can promote a bad product and make it a success, with all due respect you don’t understand the power of marketing! That’s not to say that in this case the product was not a good one, and it’s a better idea to have a performing product combined with marketing...however, you can use marketing to highlight very small advantages and make them seem much more significant!

If you don’t believe marketing and promotion work...have a look at the last US president! Apple products, Nike, cigarette companies of yesteryear...and on and on and on....marketing (especially in today’s society) is a massive influence on a product and can make it rise or fall solely on peoples

Anyone that doesn’t recognise the need for marketing or it’s ability to use increase market share of a product clearly has “dog turd” in place of a brain!

Regards,
Gixer
 
Marketing and Industry support.
If no makers produce the cartridge in their off the shelf rifles no maker is going to follow through by producing ammunition.
Hornady got both and had commitments to chamber rifles in CM early.
There isn’t a major brand out there that doesn’t produce ammo for popular chambering
 
dodgyknees said:
Do you not understand the basic principles of supply & demand? Schoolboy stuff...
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Since you directed it at me - Do you understand that limited production quantities can increase the value of a product? Schoolboy stuff....if you don’t know how to post without adding some form of veiled insult why don’t you f** off to one of the NZ forums and try to market your “superior intellect” there?

To be honest all I see is insecurity in the fact you seem to need to self promote constantly and try to tell everyone how good you are....stop being a weapons grade throbber and your points and info may be better accepted. if you didn’t get enough time on the tit as a kid it’s not the other forum members fault.

regards,
Gixer
 
Why DOES the Creedmoor stir up such a lot of emotion??

I have one, I like it, but I don't really see the fuss either way. It's like getting upset about what flavour of ice cream someone likes. Before anyone asks, chocolate is just SO old fashioned, and as a Creedmoor shooter I much prefer artisan made blue cheese and honey ice cream, made with organic cream and manuka honey...
 
There was I, just reading a thread on a calibre I do not own, minding my own business and then this....whoosh!

1614761448970.webp

It's as good as actually being on the Flume!

Keep it going guy, you are making Lockdown III bearable...
 
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gixer1 said:
Laurie,

the above IS marketing! And if you don’t think marketing can promote a bad product and make it a success, with all due respect you don’t understand the power of marketing! That’s not to say that in this case the product was not a good one, and it’s a better idea to have a performing product combined with marketing...however, you can use marketing to highlight very small advantages and make them seem much more significant!

If you don’t believe marketing and promotion work...have a look at the last US president! Apple products, Nike, cigarette companies of yesteryear...and on and on and on....marketing (especially in today’s society) is a massive influence on a product and can make it rise or fall solely on peoples

Anyone that doesn’t recognise the need for marketing or it’s ability to use increase market share of a product clearly has “dog turd” in place of a brain!

Regards,
Gixer
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Sorry to say it, but I somehow think Laurie knows more about promotion and marketing than you give him credit for.

The point being laboured to death here, that poor old Dodgy was trying to make, is that amongst all the other pavlovian reactions to mention of the chambering, people infer or state outright that without marketing, the 6.5cm would be nothing. He's trying, against all the background noise, to say that this is patently incorrect. No one is arguing that marketing or promotion hasn't had a part to play in the success of the chambering, but the 6.5cm is about far more than the marketing. The figures speak for themselves, and those that have them and use them to their potential know this. It's the constant haranguing from people who, for whatever reason take a polarised stance and keep shouting "but it's no better than (*insert similar cartridge of choice here*) so you're all suckers for listening to the marketing bollx" that drives the debate.

After getting on for half a century behind the butt I like to think I can make my own mind up about what works and what doesn't.
 
Scapegoat said:
Sorry to say it, but I somehow think Laurie knows more about promotion and marketing than you give him credit for.

The point being laboured to death here, that poor old Dodgy was trying to make, is that amongst all the other pavlovian reactions to mention of the chambering, people infer or state outright that without marketing, the 6.5cm would be nothing. He's trying, against all the background noise, to say that this is patently incorrect. No one is arguing that marketing or promotion hasn't had a part to play in the success of the chambering, but the 6.5cm is about far more than the marketing. The figures speak for themselves, and those that have them and use them to their potential know this. It's the constant haranguing from people who, for whatever reason take a polarised stance and keep shouting "but it's no better than (*insert similar cartridge of choice here*) so you're all suckers for listening to the marketing bollx" that drives the debate.

After getting on for half a century behind the butt I like to think I can make my own mind up about what works and what doesn't.
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Nobody is saying Laurie doesn’t know about marketing - but to say marketing didn’t have a part in it I’m would be incorrect. It may well have made it, however the marketing and promotion have made its increase in market share much faster and have helped somewhat amplify the pro’s of the chambering.
 
I think in general 6.5 was unpopular world wide, especially in the states for a simple reason, all cartridges on the market had faults that led to customers rejecting them. Hornady fixed this with the 6.5CM and the rest is history. Those who don't believe it should look at stats.
edi
 
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