Hornady .223 problems

[Will the chippy]

I used the 55g v max for a year or so , had the same problem, fox's just running on , sometimes 100yds, perfect
chest shot, then changed to 55g bts , and wow what a difference , I don't think ive had one move more than 2 ft since
using them , and im doing around 5-8 every week.

@Gunner223 what bullets are you using? 55g bts? Not sure which ones you mean. Cheers

 

[Gunner223]

@Gunner223 what bullets are you using? 55g bts? Not sure which ones you mean. Cheers

Yep sorry Nosler Bts 55g loaded with 133, im out 4 times a week , never found a better 223 round.

 

[Boosh]

Thats just .223, shoot a lot and it happens.
(Great round by the way).

 

[Will the chippy]

Yep sorry Nosler Bts 55g loaded with 133, im out 4 times a week , never found a better 223 round.

Cheers. Are they just a bit tougher than vmax? I had an issue last year when I lost a 'fox' with vmax so swapped to soft points which were spot on for them. A deal tougher than a fox. Would you use them on muntjac too? I'd like to find a decent do all bullet.

 

[Gunner223]

Had no problem with muntys

 

[25 Sharps]

I think you don't understand the physics involved here.
If a bullet is designed to fly apart as varmint bullets are it is a fine line at the high velocities they operate at where upon the water in flesh and blood can actually stop the bullet, causing a superficial very shallow surface wound.
Unless a piece of bullet does manage to get to the vitals the problems the op's friend is experiencing can happen. Unfortunately when this does happen the lead content becomes vapour. Anything penetrating will be very random pieces of thin jacket.


Personally the desire for exploding bullets is folly, originally it became popular for prairie dog towns in America. They are fat squirrel sized marmots, not foxes!
All my 222, hornets and 243 rifles I had used soft points and traditional hollow points and never had a problem, not as explosive but one hole in and one slightly bigger hole out. Job done.

This is a misconception of ballistic tipped bullets, they are the same construe in as hollow point and soft point Varmint bullets just with a plastic tips instead of hollow points or exposed lead.

So you can expect similar expansion from a 50 gr sierra blitz soft point as a 50 gr blitz king tipped bullet.

Ultimately the 55 grain v-max is designed to hold up to 22-250 and 220 swift velocities, .223 doesn’t push them to high velocities at all. I use 50 gr v-max at 3500 fps and 35 gr v-max at 3050 fps, they don’t blow up on the surface they get in and expand giving fast kills.

I have on the other hand had v-max bullets pencil though (had one on a magpie last week) because they’ve not expanded at all. This sounds like what is happening to the OP’s mate but with a bit too much regularity.

 

[25 Sharps]

Cheers. Are they just a bit tougher than vmax? I had an issue last year when I lost a 'fox' with vmax so swapped to soft points which were spot on for them. A deal tougher than a fox. Would you use them on muntjac too? I'd like to find a decent do all bullet.

55 or 62 grain game king…

But I prefer a soft bullet for fox and small vermin.

 

[Will the chippy]

55 or 62 grain game king…

But I prefer a soft bullet for fox and small vermin.

I've started using the 55g hornady softpoint and there surprisingly good. Quite tempted to use it for everything and make life simple.

 

[Smellydog]

This is a misconception of ballistic tipped bullets, they are the same construe in as hollow point and soft point Varmint bullets just with a plastic tips instead of hollow points or exposed lead.

So you can expect similar expansion from a 50 gr sierra blitz soft point as a 50 gr blitz king tipped bullet.

Ultimately the 55 grain v-max is designed to hold up to 22-250 and 220 swift velocities, .223 doesn’t push them to high velocities at all. I use 50 gr v-max at 3500 fps and 35 gr v-max at 3050 fps, they don’t blow up on the surface they get in and expand giving fast kills.

I have on the other hand had v-max bullets pencil though (had one on a magpie last week) because they’ve not expanded at all. This sounds like what is happening to the OP’s mate but with a bit too much regularity.

Yes my mistake. I should of said bullets of thicker jacket construction.

 

[25 Sharps]

Yes my mistake. I should of said bullets of thicker jacket construction.

Yep, that’s where the real difference is

 

[Triggermortis]

A one off instance of a fox taking 4 shots would have me questioning not only zero on the rifle but like you bullet performance, if as you say it’s happening time and time again would it not make sense to open the carcass up?
Surely that way whatever you find it is definitive either way, bullet pencilled through, splashed under the skin, misplaced shot or just plain bad luck?
Either way there’s always the answer that cures every fox shooters ailment whatever that may be …..

Buy a .222, job done

 

[Cyres]

Something v wrong here. I am using 40 grn v max in my .204 and they are running at 3,700 ish. Absolutely lethal on anything. Foxs side on often no evidence of entry or exit but when you pick them up you can hear everything slooshing about inside. Head shots completely different and pictures too graphic to post. In .223 I used to use 60 grn V max but now bullet of choice is a 69 TMK both target and live Quarry. Seems to behave more like a Blitz king.
D

 

[Foxyboy43]

A one off instance of a fox taking 4 shots would have me questioning not only zero on the rifle but like you bullet performance, if as you say it’s happening time and time again would it not make sense to open the carcass up?
Surely that way whatever you find it is definitive either way, bullet pencilled through, splashed under the skin, misplaced shot or just plain bad luck?
Either way there’s always the answer that cures every fox shooters ailment whatever that may be …..

Buy a .222, job done

A treble two - wisdom beyond words…..
This vixen didn’t like the triple deuce and 50gns Vmax tonight - 110 yards, no exit, stone dead. As Elon Musk would say - “the fox encountered an unexpected rapid disassembly” or some such utter Musk nonsense.
Next?

 

[NP435]

Having shot thousands of V-Max at coyote, jack rabbit and prairie dogs I have seen a few things. A poor hit and critters don't die. My best example was a prairie dog hit behind the ribs with a V-max at approx. 250 yards. Rear legs and the muscle was gone yet it lived until round 2 hit in the chest. Coyotes have taken 2 shots before, the first would have killed in time but watching a wounded coyote try to sever its own intestine and run is not humane. With proper shot placement I have zero reason to doubt the V-Max when used as intended on small ish vermin. Never would I shoot deer with one.

 

[Rafter]

I've started using the 55g hornady softpoint and there surprisingly good. Quite tempted to use it for everything and make life simple.

What he said.

While reloaders experiment with all sorts here - and I'm as guilty as anyone, when I buy my next 223 I'm just going to buy locally loaded 55gr Hornady sp ammo by the thousand case and be done with it.
All of the pro shooters I know are using that load, and that is a metric **** ton of deer, goats, crows etc al.

Sometimes I think we think too much, and do not enough.

 

[Triggermortis]

I think that once a bullet reaches a sufficient muzzle energy it matters not what bullet you use to some extent, I now favour the sako 50g gameheads SP’s for my .222 as a general purpose round but do load 40g V-max for my homeloads,I also only ever used a ballistic tip round when head shooting deer in a park just to be sure of maximum damage, and reduce the risk of ricochet.

 

[25 Sharps]

I think that once a bullet reaches a sufficient muzzle energy it matters not what bullet you use to some extent, I now favour the sako 50g gameheads SP’s for my .222 as a general purpose round but do load 40g V-max for my homeloads,I also only ever used a ballistic tip round when head shooting deer in a park just to be sure of maximum damage, and reduce the risk of ricochet.

As above ballistic / soft point / hollow point makes no difference, a ballistic tip is just a hollow point with a plastic insert, what makes the difference is the thickness of the bullet's jacket, so a sierra blitz soft point and sierra blitzking tipped are both designed with a thin jacket for violent expansion, one just has a better BC than the other.

 

[Eddie P]

I think a post mortem is in order, to answer the question of inadequate penetration or pencilling through, my guess is poor penetration.

As others have said, varmint bullets were designed to expand in the near side of a prairie dog.

 

[MarinePMI]

Out of interest has anyone had any problems with 55gr hornady vmax .223 factory ammo?
A good friend who is an experienced fox shooter has had numerous foxes get up and run after being hit sometimes multiple times with a certain batch number of hornady ammo. Hes then gone and bought more ammo making sure that its a differnt batch number and the same thing has happened with one fox taking 4 shots to stop it with 3 of those shots all being well placed engine room shoots. As ive already said he is an experinced shot and his bullet placement is fine as is the groupings hes getting but he obviously cant go on like he is with most foxes all of a sudden getting up again and is wondering if anyone else is having the same issues, Ive told him to try and catch a bullet it water and to shoot a milk jug full of water with a board an couple of feet behind to try and going to get some idea of exspansion. Any ideas or experience welcome

Just out of curiosity, can I ask; Is the primer crimped on this ammo?

Based on your description (and as others have already mentioned) this sounds like the round is not expanding. As such, I ask about the primer being crimped for a simple reason.

You may not have varmint ammo. It's not widely advertised, but Hornady supplies Law Enforcement with 55gr TAP Urban ammo, which looks like a VMAX, but has a much heavier jacket (primarily for penetration; clothing, heavy coats, etc.). I'm wondering if during the component shortage, some bullets got misloaded in the wrong production run with the wrong bullet. Or, they simply packaged TAP ammo as Varmint ammo by mistake (hence my asking about the primer being crimped).

I have no basis or proof of this, and this is merely conjecture on my part, but this sounds like it may be the case here.

Just a thought...

55 gr TAP URBAN® - Hornady Law Enforcement

 

[sir-lamp-alot]

Just out of curiosity, can I ask; Is the primer crimped on this ammo?

Based on your description (and as others have already mentioned) this sounds like the round is not expanding. As such, I ask about the primer being crimped for a simple reason.

You may not have varmint ammo. It's not widely advertised, but Hornady supplies Law Enforcement with 55gr TAP Urban ammo, which looks like a VMAX, but has a much heavier jacket (primarily for penetration; clothing, heavy coats, etc.). I'm wondering if during the component shortage, some bullets got misloaded in the wrong production run with the wrong bullet. Or, they simply packaged TAP ammo as Varmint ammo by mistake (hence my asking about the primer being crimped).

I have no basis or proof of this, and this is merely conjecture on my part, but this sounds like it may be the case here.

Just a thought...

55 gr TAP URBAN® - Hornady Law Enforcement

It wasnt my ammo but that of a friends so couldnt tell you about the primers im affraid