Advice please very worrying times

Braces Airgun Masters
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tony213

Active Member
Can anyone give some advice please. A neighbour has made some allegations against me (been ongoing for past three years) and as a licensed holder these have severe implications.
I can quite understand the police view of removing firearms pending investigation and have no issues but do feel its very one sided approach when numerous reports have been made over harassment , threats to harm but nothing has been done to curtail their actions and suddenly makes a report and held responsible. Does anyone have or had similar cases or what action they took to redress ? Thanking you appreciated.
 
Andyquadra said:
Ignore 99% of the replies you are going to get and seek legal advice ASAP. Are you a member of any organisations like BASC, BDS, NGO.... speak to them
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legal advice via a solicitor will be expensive, agree with your second part if a member of a shooting organisation.

However will give you my 1% from experience of being a club secretary for many years.

The police are very risk adverse ie they will always remove any risk of firearms being used if certain allegations are made.

if you voluntarily allow the removal of the firearms whilst pending investigation, then there is no legal time constraints on the police on how long that may take, many months even years is not untypical.
If they revoke you do have a legal time constraints in which to appeal.

putting the firearms in storage, will remove the potential harm, may also help if it can be shown they were in storage at the time the neighbour made an allegation that you threatened them by pointing your gun at them.
However if in storage they can still revoke your certificate as all the time you have your certificate you can get the firearms out of storage, Once revoked your guns could remain in storage for a very long time, during the legal appeal process.

Two real life examples, one very similar to yours, neighbour made allegation of firearms owners making threatening behaviour that escalated to involving the police. firearms were removed and certificate originally voluntarily surrender.
After many months the advice given to the certificate holder was if he wanted his guns back quick was to move house, so conflict no longer possible. He surrendered permanently his certificate, deciding the costs of moving or reapplying after five years as was also suggested and then possibly still having to appealing were not practical.
He did arrange for one of his shotguns to go on a friend’s certificate and continues to shoot clay pigeons accompanied by his friend at clay grounds with a a section 11(6) exemption.

The other was an argument with a neighbour over parking his car such that he blocked the certificate owners driveway, words were exchanged and the certificate owner thought no more of it, until that evening armed police arrived to remove his firearms as allegations made he had threatened the neighbour that day.
Fortunately the words exchange between the two was all recorded on the certificate holders CCTV which clearly showed no threat had been made just a polite request not to obstruct the driveway. His firearms were not taken and the neighbour got a visit from the police.


If it’s been going on for three years is there no way of reconciling the situation with your neighbour?
 
tony213 said:
yes have house insurance just not sure if it covers legal or not
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check both building insurance and contents insurance, sadly using a solicitor will likely be typically £10,000 by the time it goes to court, Howevere as you are on bail you may be eligible for legal aid.

Phone the 0151 number and get some expert advice on your situation and options.
 
Liveonce said:
legal advice via a solicitor will be expensive, agree with your second part if a member of a shooting organisation.

However will give you my 1% from experience of being a club secretary for many years.

The police are very risk adverse ie they will always remove any risk of firearms being used if certain allegations are made.

if you voluntarily allow the removal of the firearms whilst pending investigation, then there is no legal time constraints on the police on how long that may take, many months even years is not untypical.
If they revoke you do have a legal time constraints in which to appeal.

putting the firearms in storage, will remove the potential harm, may also help if it can be shown they were in storage at the time the neighbour made an allegation that you threatened them by pointing your gun at them.
However if in storage they can still revoke your certificate as all the time you have your certificate you can get the firearms out of storage, Once revoked your guns could remain in storage for a very long time, during the legal appeal process.

Two real life examples, one very similar to yours, neighbour made allegation of firearms owners making threatening behaviour that escalated to involving the police. firearms were removed and certificate originally voluntarily surrender.
After many months the advice given to the certificate holder was if he wanted his guns back quick was to move house, so conflict no longer possible. He surrendered permanently his certificate, deciding the costs of moving or reapplying after five years as was also suggested and then possibly still having to appealing were not practical.
He did arrange for one of his shotguns to go on a friend’s certificate and continues to shoot clay pigeons accompanied by his friend at clay grounds with a a section 11(6) exemption.

The other was an argument with a neighbour over parking his car such that he blocked the certificate owners driveway, words were exchanged and the certificate owner thought no more of it, until that evening armed police arrived to remove his firearms as allegations made he had threatened the neighbour that day.
Fortunately the words exchange between the two was all recorded on the certificate holders CCTV which clearly showed no threat had been made just a polite request not to obstruct the driveway. His firearms were not taken and the neighbour got a visit from the police.


If it’s been going on for three years is there no way of reconciling the situation with your neighbour?
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the background is where i live its a very old building (1700) converted into 11 apartments. Most of the residents are elderly , i am nearly 70, many are much older. A developer at the rear of our property 3 years ago applied to demolish and build 9 houses , we objected , got planning refused and he appealed to the government inspectorate which JULY 2024 has been dismissed.
For 3 years we have had false allegations of harassment, threats, implied court actions etc and i have been targeted specifically over it.
My firearms were removed.
The police and council were notified numerous times over his actions but nothing done about it.
 
Liveonce said:
check both building insurance and contents insurance, sadly using a solicitor will likely be typically £10,000 by the time it goes to court, Howevere as you are on bail you may be eligible for legal aid.

Phone the 0151 number and get some expert advice on your situation and options.
Click to expand...
thank you i am a pensioner so not well off.
 
So, you're on bail? That means that you have been arrested and interviewed. Obviously you have had some sort of altercation/falling out with your neighbour, although you don't say specifically what about or what happened.

It's a bit hard to give good advice with half the craic. I think really you'll have to wait until a decision is made as to whether you'll be charged with anything. That'll have an effect on what happens with your firearms/certificates. But be aware that even if you aren't charged with anything, or are found not guilty if it goes to court, if the police think there's still an ongoing issue with this neighbour, they simply aren't going to rush to give you your guns back.

Be aware that if they offer you some sort of formal warning, acceptance implies an admission of guilt so while it might be better than going to court if there's a likelihood of being convicted, the repercussions will be the same as a conviction. So don't do that without legal advice.

Probably a bit premature at the present, but you will need to work out a way that ensures the aggro with your neighbour is a thing of the past. Which probably won't be easy and in any case will take time, so the police can be satisfied there'll be no recurrence.

Asking the likes of BASC for help if you are a member is a possibility, but they will make a decision to help you if you are perceived to be in the right and if there's a decent chance their help will be, um, of some help.

That might all seem unhelpful and doom laden, but one has to be realistic about things. Hope it all works out.
 
Pedro said:
Be aware that if they offer you some sort of formal warning, acceptance implies an admission of guilt so while it might be better than going to court if there's a likelihood of being convicted, the repercussions will be the same as a conviction. So don't do that without legal advice.
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This!
Accept a caution without advice at your peril
 
tony213 said:
unfortunately not one of my clubs is associated with the NRA but does not cover legal.
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I take it from then that you have never been an individual member of a shooting organisation only a member of a club affiliated to the NRA. The NRA will sometimes give limited legal advise to someone who is only a member of an affiliated club, but from what else has been said I fear that things have advanced to far and that your only course of action is to seek legal advise from a lawyer who specialises in these matters.
As Pedro and Archer have already said never ever accept a caution without legal advise and after taking serious consideration of the consequences.
 
8x57 said:
I take it from then that you have never been an individual member of a shooting organisation only a member of a club affiliated to the NRA. The NRA will sometimes give limited legal advise to someone who is only a member of an affiliated club, but from what else has been said I fear that things have advanced to far and that your only course of action is to seek legal advise from a lawyer who specialises in these matters.
As Pedro and Archer have already said never ever accept a caution without legal advise and after taking serious consideration of the consequences.
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Thanking you , i have never ever been in any such situation before not even a speeding fine and suddenly you face an unbelievable situation where you have absolutely no idea of what is going on. I have joined BACS today appreciate its too late for this. When you consider i have been contacting the police and local council over anti social behaviour over his behaviour and clearly his threats were escalating and have evidence he was specifically targeting me as an individual and they did nothing . A shocking indictment really of where we are. The only concession is that i am not alone others where i live have suffered harassment to and again nothing was done.
 
I've nothing helpful to add advice-wise that hasn't already been mentioned, but it sounds like an absolute nightmare for you. Hopefully it'll be a swift and positive resolution. Wish you the very best of luck with it!
 
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tony213 said:
Thanking you , i have never ever been in any such situation before not even a speeding fine and suddenly you face an unbelievable situation where you have absolutely no idea of what is going on. I have joined BACS today appreciate its too late for this. When you consider i have been contacting the police and local council over anti social behaviour over his behaviour and clearly his threats were escalating and have evidence he was specifically targeting me as an individual and they did nothing . A shocking indictment really of where we are. The only concession is that i am not alone others where i live have suffered harassment to and again nothing was done.
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Your contacts with the council should be recorded, worth digging them out.
Keep your horizons wide, there are many chances to pick up supporting evidence.
Any neutral neighbours that may support you if asked?
 
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