BASC's stringent quality control requirements for providers???

[scubadog]

Believe me, paul and myself are not the only ones thinking it!

I guess in answer to your question ..... it depends on what it is you are exactly striving for?
Like I said. After spending my life in education, it is my belief that not every candidate should pass any test.
If 100% pass rate is your standard, then your standard is not high enough!


And no - NO ONE is suggesting that ALL basc accredited trainers are devaluing the qualification.

Please Paul evidence your statement that the BASC accredited trainers and the BASC accredited trainer scheme is devaluing the standard that the education sector is striving for? Surely you are not saying that all BASC accredited trainers are devaluing deer stalker training?

 

[Cris]

Perhaps it's all in the statistics and how you analyse them to show what you want. I spend a lot of my time looking at or working stats for a given result. What we should be looking for is a % passed first time on all aspects of the course. As it stands it is easy to say we have 100% pass rate if a candidate fails on an element and can resit or take those elements 20 times but finally gets to the right pass standard.
Remember the saying that statistics are just lies, lies and more dam lies and to quote my farther who was BT's chief economic adviser before retiring "start with the answer you want and work back".
I dont think this thread is doing anyone from BASC, DMQ, Barony or Jelen any good except maybe Jelen for publicity.

 

[SL6.5]

Is this a private foot shoot or can anyone join in?

 

[I. Farticus]

Is this a private foot shoot or can anyone join in?

Grab a rifle! Just don't come with a Blaser in 6.5x55 or suggest a Lab/Chihuahua for the follow up if you miss

 

[Cris]

Perhaps it's all in the statistics and how you analyse them to show what you want. I spend a lot of my time looking at or working stats for a given result. What we should be looking for is a % passed first time on all aspects of the course. As it stands it is easy to say we have 100% pass rate if a candidate fails on an element and can resit or take those elements 20 times but finally gets to the right pass standard.
Remember the saying that statistics are just lies, lies and more dam lies and to quote my farther who was BT's chief economic adviser before retiring "start with the answer you want and work back".
I dont think this thread is doing anyone from BASC, DMQ, Barony or Jelen any good except maybe Jelen for publicity.

Actually well done to Jelen as by coincidence I have just read their ad on FB and it's states 95% first time pass and 100% overall so as I said it's all in how you wish to split the stats.

 

[Paul at Fechan]

Please Paul evidence your statement that the BASC accredited trainers and the BASC accredited trainer scheme is devaluing the standard that the education sector is striving for? Surely you are not saying that all BASC accredited trainers are devaluing deer stalker training?

David, basc trainers standards are not in question. But a self awared Accreditation status used in marketing to imply such providers are better than other centres teams including the colleges, that is. Calling yourselves approved would be fine, no concerns from anyone. I say devaluing because your handing out Accreditation as an alternative to hard earned professional institute standards for:

*qualifications?
*transparency
*with a self awarding status
*without independant inspection
*or evidence of Quality assurance monitoring
*HMI inspection status for educational provision?
*SEN, EAL and less able provision?
*SEN, EAL, less able equal opportunities policies?

Now take all of this and step back as an assessment centre and consider what I have asked and why...

 

[Taff]

If basc are to use the word stringent quality control requirements ,they must be accountable to what they are ,but it seem's much to my dissapointment that they cannot give any clear and easy to understand answers .witch will and has all ready started to discredited any provider who claims this .And i am not sure if i read it right but basc are offering butchery lesson's i hope they do not claim your are a capable butcher after attending one of these demo's or do you get a bit off paper to say that you can dice up meat ,i would like some more info on this as i have been in the trade for 25 years and there is no way you can learn knife skills in a day, it takes years

But you seem to think that people who attend a DSC 1 are safe and capable stalkers, in fact more qualified than people who have been stalking for 25yrs

 

[SL6.5]

Grab a rifle! Just don't come with a Blaser in 6.5x55 or suggest a Lab/Chihuahua for the follow up if you miss

Can we do a mixed foot and moose hunt while we're at it? I'll bring a .243 and my guide dog, Fenton.

 

[Paul at Fechan]

but yes Taff and I know what you're saying, but paperwork is todays validation measure for the working world. Good faith doesn't cover botty nearly as well as formal training and certification.

 

[jimbo1984]

but yes Taff and I know what you're saying, but paperwork is todays validation measure for the working world. Good faith doesn't cover botty nearly as well as formal training and certification.

I love this do the one about stalkers who don't have the dsc being unsafe ? Pleeeease It's my favourite

 

[7-08Ai]

Iam just glad I sat all these exams/qualifications over 10 years ago and dont have to worry about this farcical bun fight. !!

 

[Dragunov]

I love this do the one about stalkers who don't have the dsc being unsafe ? Pleeeease It's my favourite

It's criminal that somebody who has never handled a rifle before can go shoot with a borrowed rifle pass DSC1 and be classed as a trained hunter!! You really think they're safe to let loose and safer than somebody who has a lifetime of experience handling firearms??

 

[jimbo1984]

It's criminal that somebody who has never handled a rifle before can go shoot with a borrowed rifle pass DSC1 and be classed as a trained hunter!! You really think they're safe to let loose and safer than somebody who has a lifetime of experience handling firearms??

no I do not at all I was being sarcastic ! But certain training providers on here certainly do !

 

[Paul at Fechan]

Jimbo, don't worry I'm sure you'll get plenty more chances to have a go about dsc1 training but this isn't the thread, you wouldn't get on any leases I know of without level 1.... but that's OFF TOPIC

 

[David63]

I am glad we can agree Paul that there is no question about the quality or standard of BASC accredited trainers. Thast put that one to bed....I hope.

But are you saying that unless any trainer can't meet the list of standards that you posted above, then their training is somehow not up to scratch? And/ or that because you have these standards (I assume you do) then your training is better?

Do you honestly think that BASC would accredit trainers if we did not think they were up to scratch? Of course we would not, there is absolutory no point in doing so , is there?

 

[jimbo1984]

You wouldn't get on any leases I know of without level 1 at least but that's OFF TOPIC

I shoot private land as do many others , the landowners I stalk for dint know what dsc is and aren't impressed by pieces of paper

 

[Paul at Fechan]

I am glad we can agree Paul that there is no question about the quality or standard of BASC accredited trainers. Thast put that one to bed....I hope.

But are you saying that unless any trainer can't meet the list of standards that you posted above, then their training is somehow not up to scratch? And/ or that because you have these standards (I assume you do) then your training is better?

Do you honestly think that BASC would accredit trainers if we did not think they were up to scratch? Of course we would not, there is absolutory no point in doing so , is there?

David, there was never a question as to the standards of provision by BASC providers. This all comes down to 'Accreditation' which as a status needs to be justified for the purposes it has been used for.

 

[I. Farticus]

Can we do a mixed foot and moose hunt while we're at it? I'll bring a .243 and my guide dog, Fenton.

.22LR will be fine for that quarry, but only if you're man enough to shoot the moose at 600yds. Looking forward to meeting Fenton - the lab that walks backwards and wags its head!

 

[jimbo1984]

Jimbo, don't worry I'm sure you'll get plenty more chances to have a go about dsc1 training but this isn't the thread, you wouldn't get on any leases I know of without level 1.... but that's OFF TOPIC

Oh you had a think and came up with a bit more ? Clever boy! Not the training I'm having a go at it's providers like you telling everyone that they NEED it to stalk , as I said I stalk private land and the landowners are very happy with my efforts , there's plenty of land out there'd tat can be stalked without bits of paper , maybe you're not the expert on land / landowners that you think you are ?

 

[Paul at Fechan]

Oh you had a think and came up with a bit more ? Clever boy! Not the training I'm having a go at it's providers like you telling everyone that they NEED it to stalk , as I said I stalk private land and the landowners are very happy with my efforts , there's plenty of land out there'd tat can be stalked without bits of paper , maybe you're not the expert on land / landowners that you think you are ?

I'll send everyone to you then that can't get permission... sorted