Cycle Roundabouts

It is, therefore, quite clear that motorists are not parasitic in any why but they actually subsidise other areas of society.
I'm not sure that follows. I can understand that motorists, lik cyclists, pedestrians etc. are not 'parasitic', in that they all use the public road system as allowed by law.
I'm not so sure about the argument that a group of people paying taxes etc. can be said to be 'subsidising' anything? The government takes money off us and spends it on stuff. That's it, really. Whose money they spend on what stuff, how much benefit we get personally from the cash they've had off us - all neither here nor there, really.
 
But does the fact that we are made to jump through more hoops than a dolphin at seaworld mean we should want to force others to do the same? I would rather hope it would make us more aware of the injustice that is brought when people seek regulation based upon ‘collective responsibility’.

This was meant to quite Kes’s last post but that doesn’t seem to have worked...
 
I'm not sure that follows. I can understand that motorists, lik cyclists, pedestrians etc. are not 'parasitic', in that they all use the public road system as allowed by law.
I'm not so sure about the argument that a group of people paying taxes etc. can be said to be 'subsidising' anything? The government takes money off us and spends it on stuff. That's it, really. Whose money they spend on what stuff, how much benefit we get personally from the cash they've had off us - all neither here nor there, really.
I would like to see your thoughts after all cars are electric and the average household electricity bill is estimated to be in the region of £8000 per year, in order to recoup the taxes and duty lost, and this will be whether you actually own a vehicle or not. the Govt will have to recoup the lost revenue and it is only fair that everyone pays their share.
One other point , are certificates Licences, I will let the Govt website where you apply speak for itself, it does state you apply for a licence.
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it also double states it in the last para.
 
It is a while since I've looked at the precise figures so this is out of date by some years but the motorist paid somewhere around £36 - £40 billion per year in tax directly relating to motor vehicles - so fuel, tax on new cars etc. A proportion of this was spent on roads and transport and the rest went into the big pot that paid for the NHS etc. It is, therefore, quite clear that motorists are not parasitic in any why but they actually subsidise other areas of society. This ignores the indirect impact of having an effective and efficient road system on the economy such as allowing business to operate, people to travel as tourists to more remote areas sustaining an economy there, people travelling to stalking even.

I am a motorist and a cyclist, so a parasite from any perspective apparently!

VED and Fuel Duty do generate what sounds like large amounts of revenue, but they are pretty small beer overall in the grand scheme of things.

Here are the numbers from 2017-18.

UK Tax Revenue - 2017.webp

Fuel duty is about 28 billion, whilst VED (which is under "Other indirect taxes") is around 6 billion. The Government, of course, is pushing us to move away from dirty diesel towards environmentally-efficient electric (ha!) so it is not unreasonable to expect sources of revenue to decline going forwards.

Now if I really wanted to be really provocative I would point to the research that has found that the growth in cyclists is "disproportionately an activity of affluent, white men" (source: https://researchonline.lshtm.ac.uk/id/eprint/1179/1/Cycling_and_the_city_published_author_copy.pdf). Hence there is also the possibility that these hated MAMIL cyclists are contributing more through areas like VAT, NI and Income Tax than is raised through car-related taxes anyway. Those full carbon bikes don't come cheap!

Of course the truth is that we have no way of knowing, which is exactly why it is so preposterous for any individual, or group of individuals, to lay claim to ownership of tax funded assets, whether roads, hospitals, or whatever. Such assertions frequently operate on the mistaken belief that the population can somehow be divided up into nice discrete groups - for examples "motorists" and "cyclists". In reality there is a huge amount of crossover, and I speak as someone who has paid three lots of expensive VED and thousands in fuel duty over more years than I care to think about.

As the National Travel Survey found, "over four-fifths (83%) of people aged 18 years+ who cycled held a driving licence and drove". So who owns the roads then - the motorist alone, or the motorist who cycles?

See how dumb the whole concept of an argument about "who owns the road" is?
 
One other point , are certificates Licences, I will let the Govt website where you apply speak for itself, it does state you apply for a licence.
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it also double states it in the last para.
That's easy to explain: it's an error of terminology; and a repetion of the error, once or several times, does not make it any less wrong. Have a look at what the actual document says on it.

One can take one of two views of this. First, that it is an honest error - they have no idea of the difference between a licence and a certificate and they quite innocently use the terms interchangeably; or second, that they know exactly what they're saying and they are using 'licence' aspirationally, because they look forward to a time when there is no longer a right in law to own firearms and therefore a document to permit their ownership (a licence) is required.
 
I've seen that kind of deplorable behaviour from motor-drivers and pedestrians as well, as I'm sure you have too.

I think there must be other, more-profound, reasons for your irrational hatred of all cyclists - but fortunately I'm not qualified to attempt to elicit them.
:)
yes i have when a idiot runs my border terrier over while we were walking on a pavement, and never even stopped to apologize, and no neither me or my dog as ever been run over by a motorist, and no ive never been run over by a pedestrian whilst walking on the pavement, and no i dont have a irrational hatred for all cyclists, just the moronic tossers who cycle on footpaths, when they should be on the road, its heartbreaking watching your dog **** blood for 3 days, and im not in the slightest interested in what cyclists do to motorists and visa versa on the road , just stay off the pavements, you know who you are. leave it to us walkers P1000476.webp bs
 
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cheers matey, yeah tough little bugger, she,s fine this happened some years ago, vet bill hurt me worse thanks , and for the very last time i dont hate all cyclists ok bs.
 
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