K98 Firing Pin Spring

[drone]

Just acquire a rifle based on a large ring mauser action and had two misfires in my first ten rounds. I've pulled the bullets and dropped the firing pin again but no go so I deprimed and put the much dented primers in a couple of 30/30 cases and ran them through my win 94, both went bang.
Dismantled the bolt and whilst the guts weren't squeaky clean I've used worse.The nose of the firing pin emerges about 1.5mm from the bolt face, FWIW.
So I'd like to replace the spring, but can't find new ones in the UK.
Anyone got any pointers, please?

 

[enfieldspares]

Norman Clarke at Rugby?

 

[drone]

Is he still trading? I wrote him a few weeks back about a rebarrel job I want doing on a single shot and got no response.
I'll try again, thanks for the pointer.

 

[Dunwaters]

It might be cheaper and easier to get a new spring wound locally, especially if you have an original to work from.

 

[drone]

Dunwater, second hand springs are selling for £7.50, I may even have a good spring sitting in my box of someday parts but I think the final solution is to have the existing spring stretched and retempered, in all probability if I opt for that I'll buy the second hand one and get that done. Thanks for the suggestion though as I think I'm saying I don't know of anyone local who may undertake this work. Whereas I feel that I can probably retemper a spring myself, having done a few over the years.

 

[norsk]

Since you have the bolt apart.

Give the bolt body a good clean/ scrape in the recess the firing pin goes into.Brake cleaner is good.

Try again.

If no joy ,measure the firing pin itself,if in spec then just stretch the spring 20%.

Its probably more the crap in the bolt than a weak spring.

 

[welshwarrior]

If the other poster has got a spring drop me a pm I may have a couple.

 

[drone]

Here's an image of the components, the spring's free length, as removed was 123mm, fitted length is 81mm. I really dosed it with brake cleaner and sponged it out, rodded the firing pin leade and really got no crap out. I did stretch the spring and replaced it.
The unencumbered firing pin dropped into and out of its orifice freely, not hanging up at all.

 

[enfieldspares]

Your firing pin end 1/4" looks as if it isn't "true" to the axis of the rest of it?

 

[drone]

When I rolled the whole pin along a work surface it seemed concentric, also it literally drops in freely through what one could consider the "firing distance" for want of a teutonic expression.
I also "sighted" along it whilst rolling it through my fingers and it looked true then, as well.
As it's literally two minutes to strip it down, I'll take it to my shop tomorrow and check it with a clock gauge, though there's a certain degree of uncertainty in this as I remain unaware of the acceptable runout for this component.
On the other hand it may be that my photographic skills are faecal and the apple AI hasn't cut in. Quien sabe.

 

[Smellydog]

Why not just turn the pin in a lathe to increase its stroke about .020" or .5mm and as noted by ES check it's not bent.

 

[Bavarianbrit]

I just checked over here in the reich and the original length says it should be 130mm.

 

[drone]

Bavarianbrit, danke, guess it indicates the spring may be getting tired.
Smelly dog, fired position not restricted by the pin, per se, restricted by the part in the photo above, that is sitting slightly to the right of the word "Second". However, that's not a smart suggestion at all, the firing pin protrudes within the limits, research says optimum is 1.5mm, the one on this rifle protrudes about that much , slightly more in fact. (1.55mm) If you really stop to think,do you really want it any further out where it may pierce the primer?
I'd like to clarify one point, the pin can look as bent as a nine bob piece but as I state above it drops both ways through the firing pin hole freely.
Both these primers were Magtech, as can be seen by the wee "Vs" either side of the primer indentation in the upper primer. The lower one fired on the 3rd time of asking. Indentations seem fairly central for an off centre striker, don't you think/ They also seem deep enough. My only worry is that they weren't hit fast enough.
Maybe the issue is sh1te magtech primers as the factory ammo all went bang to order. But I've used about 1500 of these from the same batch in other calibers and these were my first misfires.

 

[drone]

Went through all the hoops, centred the firing pin, the runout was negligible, massive cleaning job in the bol, reassembled the bolt without the spring all is smooth and slick. On therange today 1 out of 3 reloads fired, all the bloody factory ammo went bang. Perhaps the only positive thing I came away with was the 225 grain Sierra BT sp factory stuff recoil significantly more than the Remington 250 grain psp factory loads.
As usual when faced with the unknown straws get clutched for - I noticed the indentation was ever so slightly off centre on the primers of both the reloads that did and didn't fire and this just didn't sit right in my mind. Why would this be when the indentation on the fired rounds appears absolutely central.
I think I have a theory now so I'll post one image I took of a failed to fire alongside a factory load that did fire.
Top one is the Winchester reload that I necked up from 30/06 to 35 Whelen, lower one is a R-P fired factory load.
You'll have to take my word for it but the heads of the cases are in exactly the same plane. I hope to show the necks of both cases.
No prizes for formulating a theory but mull over the info I've posted above, verified alongside.
These are two fired cases literally from seconds apart and the failed to fire reloads are shown on the right.
I've also come up with a solution, actually two solutions, I need to ascertain which one is successful.
Happy New Year with my puzzler.
PS if you blow the images up, the titles are a giveaway to my way of thinking.....

 

[Edinburgh Rifles]

You beat me to it

If it protrudes 1.5mm and fires factory to en it fires

Check your
1) case sizing (in your case you have identified a forming issue).
Over sizing or bumping neck too much increases case shift on firing enough to produce light strikes in weak systems

2) primer seating depth
Combined with above a deeply seated primer increases the length of pin protrusion required
Try seating the primer slightly above the head so you can just feel the edge
If it chambers and fires you will have fire formed the issue in 1) out of the way

 

[drone]

Thanks for that, I'd started lengthening the the coal to get my (cast) boolits engaging the rifling - just - to remove any excess headspace I'd inadvertently caused but it's a bugger to sort as the lub grooves on the boolits I've cast make it difficult to get a firm grip on the projectile. without over egging the omelet.
There's an image nearby which shows two dummy cartridges, one to my Quicklink derived load the other where the ogive just "kisses" the leade.

 

[drone]

Just to close my resume of the investigation, here's a 1000 words an image of one of my cases in a Wilsons headspace checker. Flush with the top surface = min headspace, flush with the bottom of the machined slot =max headspace. My case is marginally below the bottom of that slot, little wonder they didn't go bang.

 

[Smellydog]

Glad you found it. Might not of needed any more than .010" off the pin stop and suffered no primer perforation.
That would be treating the symptom in this example granted when just correct sizing is all that is required.

 

[25 Sharps]

Bavarianbrit, danke, guess it indicates the spring may be getting tired.
Smelly dog, fired position not restricted by the pin, per se, restricted by the part in the photo above, that is sitting slightly to the right of the word "Second". However, that's not a smart suggestion at all, the firing pin protrudes within the limits, research says optimum is 1.5mm, the one on this rifle protrudes about that much , slightly more in fact. (1.55mm) If you really stop to think,do you really want it any further out where it may pierce the primer?
I'd like to clarify one point, the pin can look as bent as a nine bob piece but as I state above it drops both ways through the firing pin hole freely.
View attachment 453350Both these primers were Magtech, as can be seen by the wee "Vs" either side of the primer indentation in the upper primer. The lower one fired on the 3rd time of asking. Indentations seem fairly central for an off centre striker, don't you think/ They also seem deep enough. My only worry is that they weren't hit fast enough.
Maybe the issue is sh1te magtech primers as the factory ammo all went bang to order. But I've used about 1500 of these from the same batch in other calibers and these were my first misfires.

Some of my rifles don't like the magtech LR primers, have had several failures to fire, others are fine - I now only use them for target ammunition, not for hunting ammunition.

 

[Bell308]

I got one from these gents in the States a while back?

https://www.gunsprings.com/MAUSER/1898/cID2/mID40/dID175