Knife project #4: the slender deer knife

[zambezi]

Erm...a bit of a fail.
Stitching went well. The waxed polyester thread cinches up lovely and tight. Here is an example of the half-hitch before it is tightened and thus hidden between the layers of leather

The fail? The leather is too soft. So it tends to pull onto the knife more like a sock than a scabbard. And the knife is razor sharp. That combo meant that the first time I sheathed the knife its razor tip threaded between sheath and welt and sliced through the stitching. So I have had to add a parallel sequence of stiches to seal the rupture . I then got to thinking that by wet-forming the sheath, I might add some stiffness to the sheath. In turn, that could ensure the blade always enters the sheath void with only the welt offered up to the knife edge . Will review a.m. But I suspect a tougher leather, of a thicker guage plus deeper welt is the next job.

I will use this one till it crokes though:

 

[snake_2586]

Looking good,

Some tips I hope will help, I never cut the outside of my welts before the sheath is finished, I use the welt template to draw guide lines on the inside of the sheath leather, and both sides of the welt, cut the inside profile then line up and draw on the other side, I then evo-stick the welt to one side of the sheath, then later evo-stick the sheath up using the guide lines I drew earlier, hope that makes sense.

For leather I would always advise 3 - 3.5mm veg tanned, any thicker and it becomes harder to fold/form. All of my welts I aim to have 10mm wide and run the stitching down the center, 5mm from the edge.

I also wet the center line, inside and out before folding, it makes a neater fold.

Hope this is helpful
Snake

 

[zambezi]

Looking good,

Some tips I hope will help, I never cut the outside of my welts before the sheath is finished, I use the welt template to draw guide lines on the inside of the sheath leather, and both sides of the welt, cut the inside profile then line up and draw on the other side, I then evo-stick the welt to one side of the sheath, then later evo-stick the sheath up using the guide lines I drew earlier, hope that makes sense.

For leather I would always advise 3 - 3.5mm veg tanned, any thicker and it becomes harder to fold/form. All of my welts I aim to have 10mm wide and run the stitching down the center, 5mm from the edge.

I also wet the center line, inside and out before folding, it makes a neater fold.

Hope this is helpful
Snake

Really, really helpful. Thanks.

 

[VSS]

Quenching vertically yes, turning over in the forge no.
On my last knife, when the tapered blade edge faced the burner, it seemed to cause surface micro-ripples View attachment 172410. So I prefer to set spine upward, i.e. spine facing burner.

However, the forge should have been uniformly hot since I had done the normalising cycle first and then edged the flame down to heat treat temp. By the time I did the heat treat, the forge would have been declared by thermocouple to be at 815˚C for over 10 mins. I would hope I could insert metal anywhere within 8cm of the epicenter and be sure that there would be no temp variation. Certainly the metal was uniformly cherry before dunking.

Apparently, if you have your quenching bath aligned exactly North-South, and ensure that the hot blade goes into the oil in that orientation, then it will come out dead straight. If not, then it's quite likely to take on a slight curve.
Sounds like mumbo-jumbo until you consider that the world is one massive magnet, and you're playing about with a piece of metal who's molecules are having the absolute heeby-jeebies.

(Incidentally, I'm not a knife maker, and am ignorant of most forms of metalwork, but this is just one of the little snippets that stuck in my mind from my day in the forge with an artisan knifemaker last year. He was adamant about it).

 

[Alantoo]

Apparently, if you have your quenching bath aligned exactly North-South, and ensure that the hot blade goes into the oil in that orientation, then it will come out dead straight. If not, then it's quite likely to take on a slight curve.
Sounds like mumbo-jumbo until you consider that the world is one massive magnet, and you're playing about with a piece of metal who's molecules are having the absolute heeby-jeebies.

(Incidentally, I'm not a knife maker, and am ignorant of most forms of metalwork, but this is just one of the little snippets that stuck in my mind from my day in the forge with an artisan knifemaker last year. He was adamant about it).

Was it volcanic lava or granite they found aligns with the prevailing polarity on solidifying? I think it is one of the "pointers" that showed the Poles shift over time.

Re. the knife quenching seems a bit of a mixed up bag. Steel becomes non-magnetic as you heat and regains as it cools, so the polarity must take its cue from something...but why should the magnetic polarity cause it to curve?

If there is something other than Bill Ockham's heat differential going one would imagine it could only be if the blade was introduced horizontally, ie with edge up or down...but if introduced vertically the NS magnetic alignment is across the blade and not along it...

Alan

 

[zambezi]

My forge is tiny. It is heated via a single propane burner. However, once the forge has been running for 15mins or so, I expect the central portion [say 10cm³] to be at same temp. But...there must be some gradient fanning out from that single burner. And per the image, the knife was off center right by 3cm, thermocouple off center left by same distance. My thinking with this set up was that thermocouple must be accurately adjudicating temp at that distance from burner. But perhaps a blade warping differential exists anywhere off center?


On the next build I will place the knife centrally in the forge, spine facing upward, directly below the single burner. If the knife still takes a warp, I will have no option but to upgrade the forge. Well, that is how I will open the discussion with my wife regarding the neccessity for:

Evenheat Knife Oven - KF 49.5 Extreme

Go deep with Evenheat's KF Extreme Depth Series Ovens. Our Extreme Depth models are available in depths from 31.5" all the way up to 49.5". They feature dual doors and share the side-element-only design of the LB Series for phenomenal temperature distribution. Users include sword makers, volume...

www.soulceramics.com

 

[Alantoo]

My forge is tiny. It is heated via a single propane burner. However, once the forge has been running for 15mins or so, I expect the central portion [say 10cm³] to be at same temp. But...there must be some gradient fanning out from that single burner. And per the image, the knife was off center right by 3cm, thermocouple off center left by same distance. My thinking with this set up was that thermocouple must be accurately adjudicating temp at that distance from burner. But perhaps a blade warping differential exists anywhere off center?
View attachment 172800

On the next build I will place the knife centrally in the forge, spine facing upward, directly below the single burner. If the knife still takes a warp, I will have no option but to upgrade the forge. Well, that is how I will open the discussion with my wife regarding the neccessity for:

Evenheat Knife Oven - KF 49.5 Extreme

Go deep with Evenheat's KF Extreme Depth Series Ovens. Our Extreme Depth models are available in depths from 31.5" all the way up to 49.5". They feature dual doors and share the side-element-only design of the LB Series for phenomenal temperature distribution. Users include sword makers, volume...

www.soulceramics.com

If you are going to buy a forge you might have a look at my mate Cecil Swan’s Portaforges. His big seller is a forge for peripatetic farriers but they do others.

His are one or two burner pointing vertically down like yours.

With the forges I have built the burners have always been horizontal and tangential to the chamber so the flame swirls around rather than just hitting the floor square on. But mine are on a much heavier basis with thicker linings and fan fed air rather than atmospheric burners. The big advantage for me is that I can adjust the gas air mix to give me a carburising or oxidising atmosphere and because it is pressure fed I can seal the furnace up and not waste heat by having a wide open chamber mouth with the concomitant dragons breath. Even my smallest chamber @ 600xØ150mm will get me up to forging and punching temperature with a bit of 80mm square.

Alan

 

[devon deer stalker]

I was given a quick lesson by my friend who was a saddler, no need for a half hitch, you just double back the stitch, he gave me all the tools and thread, but what a ball ache punching through 10.5mm of leather!
I got half way and then used a drill!
Prior to that I used glue, but didn't have any evo stick so used 'stick likes sh1ite' which was crap, just didn't work, so evo stick next time.
Oh and to get a nice fit I wet the leather, that did work, but beware, rookie mistake, I didn't oil the blade and got a couple of rust spots

Cheers
Richard

 

[I. Farticus]

What a journey we've been privileged to watch, and I'm really looking forward to seeing it in the flesh. Again, thank you