Shame on those who said waste it...
Localised infection only?
- Thread starter Sunrise Stalker
- Start date
Overlay
Well-Known Member
Eggsactly if it had made that far, ??? all this seems to suffering from a shuffling goal post to be honest
Someone’s cut off point on waste is it appears the next persons starting point on quality
Worryingly It all seems to go running back to what people perspective is of quality products and all the gold doubloons they can make by wringing out a deer carcase
To be fair, the OP'S question related to whether he should eat it, not whether he should sell it.
I wouldn't sell venison from a carcass like that, and I doubt anyone else on here would. But I'd have no hesitation in eating it myself. All the signs were that it was purely a localised infection, ie, the remainder of the carcass wasn't affected.
"Sell the best, eat the rest" is my motto.
HonestJohn
Well-Known Member
Agreed. Shot many deer with localised infections, and I’m still alive to tell the tale despite eating parts that were not close to the affected area. But yes, wouldn’t put it into the gamedealers, not because it’s not ‘fit’, but because they’d use it as an excuse to condemn it, but would likely still sell it on
Localised infections or systemic infections are big differences. Systemic, Bin. Localised, reject affected part stamp and pass as fit for human consumption. That's the legislation in red meat inspection, but the choice is yours .
Would the local infection have been noticed had a shot been placed higher, or back of head?
Overlay
Well-Known Member
Yep
Plenty of times VSS I have worked in 2 kent ( Charing ) and Cambridge
the op says would you eat itHaving no probable location of where the carcase will be ending up according to the OT my preference NOT knowing whether its a goeshomer or GD
In the incinerator for me
You can make people ill without trying whether a giveaway or sell there is no difference where the upset can be picked up
Myself - I never judge anyone or come away from what I work to or cross a line on bad shot or wound/infection everything has merits all have downsides, trying to make the best call is with the individual, I only eat myself and sell what I’m happy with, but I gather my own so in one respect the OT doesn’t apply because I would have binned it 100%
You can’t get it back when it’s gone. - prevention is better than the cure -pretty old school but still relevant
PhilYep
Plenty of times VSS I have worked in 2 kent ( Charing ) and Cambridge
Having no probable location of where the carcase will be ending up according to the OT my preference NOT knowing whether its a goeshomer or GD
In the incinerator for me
You can make people ill without trying whether a giveaway or sell there is no difference where the upset can be picked up
Myself - I never judge anyone or come away from what I work to or cross a line on bad shot or wound/infection everything has merits all have downsides, trying to make the best call is with the individual, I only eat myself and sell what I’m happy with, but I gather my own so in one respect the OT doesn’t apply because I would have binned it 100%
You can’t get it back when it’s gone. - prevention is better than the cure -pretty old school but still relevant
There were sandwiches made and shipped out to supermarkets obviously fit to eat then you only find out when people start to fall ill. Because people missed (or chose to ignore a problem) it set off a chain of events with people being ill.
The E. coli outbreak is thought to be caused by some supermarket sandwiches containing salad leaves.
You see pictures with nice clean larders 5star ratings stickers on the wall and the next minute
"just cut the infected part out good to go"
I can see the advertising leaflet
All our venison products are selected from the finest cuts.
Because we cut the infected part out
All the cases reported so far developed symptoms before 4 June and the number of cases being reported is now falling, offering hope the outbreak may have ended.
Several food manufacturers removed some of their products from shelves as a precaution.
The Food Standards Agency said lettuce is the likely source, based on tests.
Darren Whitby, head of incidents at the FSA, said: "Earlier this month, we confirmed that several sandwich manufacturers had taken precautionary action to withdraw and recall various sandwiches, wraps, subs and rolls after food chain and epidemiological links enabled us to narrow down a wide range of foods to a type of lettuce used in sandwich products as the likely cause of the outbreak."
Overlay
Well-Known Member
Phil
There were sandwiches made and shipped out to supermarkets obviously fit to eat then you only find out when people start to fall ill. Because people missed (or chose to ignore a problem) it set off a chain of events with people being ill.
The E. coli outbreak is thought to be caused by some supermarket sandwiches containing salad leaves.
You see pictures with nice clean larders 5star ratings stickers on the wall and the next minute
"just cut the infected part out good to go"
I can see the advertising leaflet
All our venison products are selected from the finest cuts.
Because we cut the infected part out
All the cases reported so far developed symptoms before 4 June and the number of cases being reported is now falling, offering hope the outbreak may have ended.
Several food manufacturers removed some of their products from shelves as a precaution.
The Food Standards Agency said lettuce is the likely source, based on tests.
Darren Whitby, head of incidents at the FSA, said: "Earlier this month, we confirmed that several sandwich manufacturers had taken precautionary action to withdraw and recall various sandwiches, wraps, subs and rolls after food chain and epidemiological links enabled us to narrow down a wide range of foods to a type of lettuce used in sandwich products as the likely cause of the outbreak."
Overlay
Well-Known Member
There’s always something waiting to trip someone up
Minimising risk is the best to counter balance, for home consumption people stick to what they accept as you do, that’s up to the individual, anything else you gotta stick to good practice.
I guess everyone has seen the tight packed chill with no air circ and vice versa where there is air space, good chilltemp etc
Then smack bang in the middle of the rack a carcase with green on it, h&l shot so minimal damage but crap gralloch procedure
So where does that go
A. Discarded and stored seperately
B. Washed out in the larder allowed to drip dry in the racks
Well someone’s gotta call it
Everyone has their own interpretation as to where it ends up
Minimising risk is the best to counter balance, for home consumption people stick to what they accept as you do, that’s up to the individual, anything else you gotta stick to good practice.
I guess everyone has seen the tight packed chill with no air circ and vice versa where there is air space, good chilltemp etc
Then smack bang in the middle of the rack a carcase with green on it, h&l shot so minimal damage but crap gralloch procedure
So where does that go
A. Discarded and stored seperately
B. Washed out in the larder allowed to drip dry in the racks
Well someone’s gotta call it
Everyone has their own interpretation as to where it ends up
Just caught up with this thread, unsure if some answers are in jest?
It appears there is a roebuck with an abscess on the neck. Healthy animal otherwise, organs, other lymph nodes and coat no issues, according to the OP.
If the carcass sets and is not wet after a hanging, what’s the problem? Are the trained hunters on here not aware of the role lymph nodes play in the body of a mammal?
You even have mr Buchan, a vet, agreeing with VSS, yet the consensus here is that it should be binned/buried instead.
It seems that here on SD that there is often a race to the most conservative judgement when someone asks for advice, based on no scientific or professional experience whatsoever. Maybe the next respondent in the thread will suggest the entire local deer population be culled or that the stalkers clothing be burned in case of cross contamination (again).
If anyone has purchased beef, lamb or pork produced here in the UK (or elsewhere), you would surely at some point have eaten meat that comes from an animal that had an abscess, pleurisy, a dodgy liver, lungworm, mild mastitis, arthritis…. the list goes on. None of these conditions, alone, will have any bearing on the suitability of the carcass entering the food chain. It will simply be cut out or removed and the carcass passed for consumption.
The lymphatic system is there for a number of reasons, but what is interesting to us as hunters/consumers of the meat is that it arrests or attempts to arrest the spread of pathogens around the body. If we look at the lymph nodes and they are not enlarged/pus filled, we can safely assume any infection discovered upstream has been contained and. assuming the carcass sets, and is not emaciated or poor because of the effects of a single chronic condition, good to go.
So in this case, can anyone explain why the neck should not be removed and the carcass be fit for consumption?
It appears there is a roebuck with an abscess on the neck. Healthy animal otherwise, organs, other lymph nodes and coat no issues, according to the OP.
If the carcass sets and is not wet after a hanging, what’s the problem? Are the trained hunters on here not aware of the role lymph nodes play in the body of a mammal?
You even have mr Buchan, a vet, agreeing with VSS, yet the consensus here is that it should be binned/buried instead.
It seems that here on SD that there is often a race to the most conservative judgement when someone asks for advice, based on no scientific or professional experience whatsoever. Maybe the next respondent in the thread will suggest the entire local deer population be culled or that the stalkers clothing be burned in case of cross contamination (again).
If anyone has purchased beef, lamb or pork produced here in the UK (or elsewhere), you would surely at some point have eaten meat that comes from an animal that had an abscess, pleurisy, a dodgy liver, lungworm, mild mastitis, arthritis…. the list goes on. None of these conditions, alone, will have any bearing on the suitability of the carcass entering the food chain. It will simply be cut out or removed and the carcass passed for consumption.
The lymphatic system is there for a number of reasons, but what is interesting to us as hunters/consumers of the meat is that it arrests or attempts to arrest the spread of pathogens around the body. If we look at the lymph nodes and they are not enlarged/pus filled, we can safely assume any infection discovered upstream has been contained and. assuming the carcass sets, and is not emaciated or poor because of the effects of a single chronic condition, good to go.
So in this case, can anyone explain why the neck should not be removed and the carcass be fit for consumption?
Thank you.
Morning Larry, we have chatted lots of times with you explaining details of questions for me.
My stance is from handling a lot of small game (for want of a better word) pigeons rabbits for many years (too many)
Personally I would not cut out a worm sack out of a rabbit internal or external and give it to the number of older folk I dropped of rabbits to for many years.
I have seen the sign at Ben Rigby's " Pigeon Shooters DO NOT leave fly blown pigeons here"
(I have had Ben's son cherry pick a few birds as I am traying them up looked at them thumbs up)
On a big bag day we do our best to keep the shot birds covered and in the shade but the hard hit and fly blown birds go for the foxes.
I will set out "old pigeons" on cradles and pull their heads off at the end of the day so they don't go back in the chiller.
%100 get the choice made every day in abattoirs by inspectors especially with an expensive Bull on the line ££££
At the game dealers it is say £1.50kg for a 15kg Roe so £22.50 to cut that bit back and sign the declaration would not be for me.
So if it is deer pigeons rabbits It is a matter of choice so for me giving it away, eating it myself or getting £22.50 is the same result as there are lots of deer around so I will not use one like that and shoot a better one.
In all things it is better to be safe than sorry.
Hi Tim
We haven’t spoken in a couple of months, hope you are well.
We are going to have to agree to disagree on this point.
We're talking here about deer, not small game, as the ‘trained hunter’ is a qualification that supposedly enables the stalker to be able to spot issues with deer carcasses.
What’s the point of being a trained hunter if the hunter then ignores accepted protocols based on the lymph nodes and body condition.
If you are really in doubt about signing the declaration on the deer tag, you could take the carcass to the game dealer, either having a word with the vet or inspector during the day, or leave a note on the tag in the space provided when you drop off in the chiller. In this case noting the neck abscess and possibly bringing along the pluck in a plastic bag to show no further conditions arising. You can then happily sign the declaration with a clear conscience.
We haven’t spoken in a couple of months, hope you are well.
We are going to have to agree to disagree on this point.
We're talking here about deer, not small game, as the ‘trained hunter’ is a qualification that supposedly enables the stalker to be able to spot issues with deer carcasses.
What’s the point of being a trained hunter if the hunter then ignores accepted protocols based on the lymph nodes and body condition.
If you are really in doubt about signing the declaration on the deer tag, you could take the carcass to the game dealer, either having a word with the vet or inspector during the day, or leave a note on the tag in the space provided when you drop off in the chiller. In this case noting the neck abscess and possibly bringing along the pluck in a plastic bag to show no further conditions arising. You can then happily sign the declaration with a clear conscience.
Yes all good ready for a fallow/red season also new pup arriving at the end of the month, I take you point which is valid but still stick to my guns as my relationship with a local game dealer is more important to me than a £22.50 Roe.
The small game quote is/was an example of what I have seen so should be taken as such.
I am not a vet but one glance at my dogs I know something is wrong so get them seen to.
The point is for me is that if I am not happy with something regarding the condition of an animal be it a rabbit to a deer if I am not happy with it then it goes no further so should be afforded my opinion or status of training.
Catch up for a chat when the season is in full swing.
Tim
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