Petition following Plymouth Shooting

[Woodsy]

Sign the Petition

Establish stricter gun licensing regulations and law in UK

www.change.org

No idea where this will get to, if anywhere. My sympathies genuinely go out to those affected by the shooting in Plymouth, and to the woman who started the above petition for what she went through. But if it wasn’t a firearm would it not have been something else that was used to injure or kill? Someone could go on a killing spree with a garden fork - banning garden forks isn’t going to stop domestic violence..

 

[timbrayford]

It rather misses the point, the issue is that the Firearms Act was originally drafted to prevent an armed revolution, not to regulate the peaceful civilian use of firearms. Section 1 is well over complicated and full of stuff of little relevance to the fit to be entrusted & safe use that Chiefs of Police are supposed to determine. S2 makes much more sense and is easier for the police to understand and administer. In each and every serious incident with lawfully owned firearms from Hungerford onwards it has been facilitated by a lack of professionalism and competence by the FLDs responsible for administering those certificates. We can't expect the general public to understand or sympathise, its just a great pity that after Dunblane the John Major government got away with scapegoating the shooting community and their disgraceful 100 year secrecy cover up of what had really occurred.

 

[Woodsmoke]

'Guns are a problem in the UK and we need to do something about it'

Aye, ok . . . . .

 

[Liveonce]

'Guns are a problem in the UK and we need to do something about it'

Aye, ok . . . . .

Yer get more people in to shooting sports, buy more guns and get a shooting organisation like the US NRA.

 

[andyk]

It's not helpful from our perspective that the Nazir Afzal has got behind it, he carries a bit of weight with the media.

As ever though, the petition perpetuates falsehoods, to quote 'You may have wondered how these men were able to get hold of guns, many assume this kind of violence could not happen in the UK. But despite handguns being banned under the 1997 Firearm Amendment, research carried out following the implementation of the Act saw a 40% increase in the number of gun crime incidents in the UK (Politics.co.uk)'. If looked at critically, that shows how little restrictions on legal ownership make to gun crime. I saw the stats the other day for the types of guns used on crime, handguns of one sort or another are responsible for more offences than all else together. So, what she is saying is that we banned handguns yet there was 40% more crime with them.

All that said, I have no issues with points 1 and 5 of the petition and point 2 has some validity. That said, I don't think any mental illness should be a bar, it should be based on the risk posed. The risk with any reform which simply says 'mental illness = refusal/revocation' is that people who need help will not seek it and those who have, and fully recovered, will be discriminated against. Points 3 and 4 can go away.

I have to agree with @timbrayford in this instance. The firearms acts so seem geared more towards preventing people raising armies than stopping the likes of Hamilton and others. I have a feeling that in the case of all of these mass shootings the police could, and probably should, have revoked licenses but did not. Overall, the 'system' appears to work, it is just that concerns need acting upon. I would also rather see FEOs direct their attention to assessing the suitability of those who come to their attention rather than being overburdened with pointless paperwork. I would be interested to know how much time FEOs spend arguing over 'good reason' for another rifle after an FAC has been granted, or wrangling over conditions. Neither assist public safety.

 

[andyk]

'Guns are a problem in the UK and we need to do something about it'

Aye, ok . . . . .

That's the problem though. shooting is seen as an aberration and 'something must be done!'. I doubt anyone will ask whether either of the 2 people arrested for killing 3 people on the M25 yesterday had previously shown an irresponsible attitude to driving...

 

[Rusty Gate]

Sign the Petition

Establish stricter gun licensing regulations and law in UK

www.change.org

No idea where this will get to, if anywhere. My sympathies genuinely go out to those affected by the shooting in Plymouth, and to the woman who started the above petition for what she went through. But if it wasn’t a firearm would it not have been something else that was used to injure or kill? Someone could go on a killing spree with a garden fork - banning garden forks isn’t going to stop domestic violence..

They didn't ban cars after the London Bridge issue either.
Still no noise about the local force failing their duties

 

[Musketeer]

A lot of the comments are with regard to domestic violence. I am ex-police and I have lost count of the domestic violence incidents that I have attended during my police career, but only once was a firearm used and that one was aimed at me and discharged at my patrol vehicle and not the victim of the DV.

Kitchen knives,...now that is a different story.

 

[Woodsmoke]

That's the problem though. shooting is seen as an aberration and 'something must be done!'.

It is, but only by those with an axe to grind. Of course I'm dreadfully sorry for those affected by the Plymouth shootings, we all should be. But yet again we see a vocal minority pontificating about completely the wrong issue tough sheer ignorance. Firearm legislation is not the problem here. The problem is non-cohesive approaches by different forces as to how they choose to interpret it, and subjective decisions made by individuals that fly in the face of what the evidence tells them they should be doing. This guys cheese had quite clearly slid off his cracker, and he was the subject of not only concern from his immediate family, but he was also warned by the police for an assault the year prior to being granted an SGC, not to mention having it temporarily revoked and then returned to him following yet another assault. As with Ryan, Bird, and Hamilton, the signs were all there well in advance of the offences being committed. As an FAC holder myself I'm all for the private ownership of firearms, of course I am, but I'm also in favour of seeing the police exercise their powers to revoke when confronted by overwhelming evidence that an owner is proving unworthy of further trust. The police were at fault in this case, and the police have to answer for it as far as I'm concerned . . . .

 

[finnbear270]

It is, but only by those with an axe to grind. Of course I'm dreadfully sorry for those affected by the Plymouth shootings, we all should be. But yet again we see a vocal minority pontificating about completely the wrong issue tough sheer ignorance. Firearm legislation is not the problem here. The problem is non-cohesive approaches by different forces as to how they choose to interpret it, and subjective decisions made by individuals that fly in the face of what the evidence tells them they should be doing. This guys cheese had quite clearly slid off his cracker, and he was the subject of not only concern from his immediate family, but he was also warned by the police for an assault the year prior to being granted an SGC, not to mention having it temporarily revoked and then returned to him following yet another assault. As with Ryan, Bird, and Hamilton, the signs were all there well in advance of the offences being committed. As an FAC holder myself I'm all for the private ownership of firearms, of course I am, but I'm also in favour of seeing the police exercise their powers to revoke when confronted by overwhelming evidence that an owner is proving unworthy of further trust. The police were at fault in this case, and the police have to answer for it as far as I'm concerned . . . .

BUT, It already seems that the vocal minority have the lead here ............................ Will we be left hanging in the noose again, or will we see some effort from the legal department of the voice?

 

[Woodsmoke]

BUT, It already seems that the vocal minority have the lead here ............................ Will we be left hanging in the noose again, or will we see some effort from the legal department of the voice?

We can only hope so. I suspect, however, that the Voice will robustly bend over and allow us to be shafted once again . . . . .

 

[DVS1]

If it wasn't a firearm used it would've been a knife, a screwdriver, a spade, a pitch fork...if someone's intent on doing others harm they will use anything to hand.

Its not firearms that need anything...a loaded forearm can sit there for years without doing anything, the human behind it is the problem and how do you legislate changes of mood!?!?!? Impossible!