I’ve shot enough rabbits but I think you may need to re asses your safety when out shooting. If you are shooting into a flat piece of ground even from an elevated position then there will always be a chance of ricochet with the lr. If you are shooting into hilly ground then it’s physically impossible for a round to zing off anywhere but into the big piece of earth behind .As I said before if your ground is producing ricochets then probably best to use something safer while you build up enough experience to recognise where it is safe to shoot and where it isn’t .
Ricochets....:oops:
- Thread starter phillips321
- Start date
sorry, but that’s absolute twaddle! There are plenty of videos all over YouTube of 22LR ricochets going in some very obscure angles compared to the firing direction.
regards,
Gixer
Sounds like you haven't done much rabbit shooting with your 22lr if you've never had a bullet bounce off the bonce of a bunny!
And when it does, it probably isn't going to end up in the "good chunk of earth behind the target". In fact, last time I saw a ricochet off a rabbit's head the bullet ended up in another rabbit that was a couple of yards away. A bit of a fluke, and no harm done (except to rabbits) but it does demonstrate the unpredictability of projectiles, no matter how certain you are of your backstops.
Did they have a big back stop behind them? If you have a piece of ground behind an rabbit that covers its body and it going upwards then a bullet is not going to hit the rabbit and fly over the top of the hill or come out at 90 degrees. A bullet in theory will only bounce as high as the height you are shooting from so if the rabbit is in front of the ground you are shooting it it from there’s bugger all place for it to go.
Stalker62
Well-Known Member
Really?
Sorry sir that is total crap. I have been behind a trigger over 43 year's and when a projectile does bounce it can and does do about any thing you can imagine.
More total physics than total crap. The angle of the ricochet shouldn’t be greater than the angle that it’s shot from. In simple terms the bullets won’t ricochet higher Than From the point it was shot from. It can spin off at different angles from point of impact even to the point of coming back to you but that is very unlikely. As I have said before if you are getting ricochets then the land you are on is probably unsuitable for 22 lr or any other bullet that is bouncing around on it .
CarlW
Well-Known Member
Might be worth revisiting your geometry.
The angle of reflection is only equal to the angle of incidence when they meet on a perfectly flat plane. A rabbit's head is not flat; nor is a stone; nor is the earth. Also, a bullet is not a beam of light: it deforms (often unpredictably), thus making any prediction on its reflected angle very difficult.
Further, the idea that "the bullet won't ricochet higher than the point from which it is shot" assumes that the bullet magically stops when its reflection has reached the same distance from the POI as the distance between its source and the POI. It doesn't: it keeps on going...
The angle of reflection is only equal to the angle of incidence when they meet on a perfectly flat plane. A rabbit's head is not flat; nor is a stone; nor is the earth. Also, a bullet is not a beam of light: it deforms (often unpredictably), thus making any prediction on its reflected angle very difficult.
Further, the idea that "the bullet won't ricochet higher than the point from which it is shot" assumes that the bullet magically stops when its reflection has reached the same distance from the POI as the distance between its source and the POI. It doesn't: it keeps on going...
I really cant believe some of the comments about this issue, anyone who has done enough shooting will have seen ricochets in any caliber you would like to mention irrespective of having a "safe" backstop with possibly the exception of sand. Go fire enough tracer rounds at dark into a vertical earth embankment (which is about as safe as you would expect in the field) and see what happens when the bullet encounters a buried stone. Anyone quoting a theory about this needs to get a bit more experience and actually see the reality because these events happen no matter how unlikely, just go online and you will see some of the idiots who nearly get killed by bullets ricocheting directly back at them. Its a basic safety rule when shooting that if something can happen at some point it will and you have to do your best to manage and minimise the risk.
Stalker62
Well-Known Member
There is a wee video of a chap firing a .50 cal which comes back at him and takes his ear defenders off.
I am not IT savvy enough to post it on SD - perhaps someone else will be kind enough to do so.
Whilst on the subject (forgive the repost).
I once had a patient who had been shot in the chest - the bullet came to rest at the back of one of his heels.
I am not IT savvy enough to post it on SD - perhaps someone else will be kind enough to do so.
Whilst on the subject (forgive the repost).
I once had a patient who had been shot in the chest - the bullet came to rest at the back of one of his heels.
glasshalffull
Well-Known Member
Yes ricochets big big problem with any night shooting activity. Never mind shooting at misidentified animals. Too many cowboys about with NV bound to be mistakes made. They should all at least sign up for a NV course b4 using
So the theory is sound regarding ricochet. When it hits your quarry I guess it can ricochet off them but I’ve never experienced this and I still can’t see a bullet ricocheting past a decent back drop. That really is the key to safety and if so called experienced shooters are getting Regular ricochets and still shooting on a the same ground with the same round then that’s really scary
FISH BOY
Well-Known Member
I was out last season, sitting in a seat overlooking a field in a valley with a woodland margin with the 243. About 70 yards away a group of fallow appear all moving in the same direction, making their way across the field right to left. All were broadside and I selected a doe near the back of the group and completely clear I pulled the trigger on a heart/lung shot. She dropped like a stone but strangely another doe that had been 10 yards following behind in the line started spinning round frantically finally falling to the floor. Slightly confused I got down from the seat immediately to investigate finding the second animal wheezing heavily. I dispatched with a headshot.
On inspection in the larder, the first shot had been spot on, entering behind the front leg, wiping out the vitals, but then richocetting off the opposite leg and exiting at 75 degrees carrying enough energy to wind the second animal frontal some distance behind.
The shot was as safe as houses, but opened my eyes to what strange things can happen regardless of what calibre is in your hands.
Backstops at a range..... I suppose that you are talking about the large bunds of sand that you get at the butts end of ranges, especially military built ones like Bisley............ try shooting at one at night with tracer and you will see what really happens!
red rounds flying off everywhere ... there is a reason that they have a couple of mile safety zone!
I recall once at Otturburn when the red light didn't stop in the distance like most.... safety rover sent out while we stopped shooting and told the 'courting' couple in the car to f*** *ff and obey the red flag..... they had wondered what all the noise was??!
For what it’s worth, I’ve also had .22LR rounds ricochet off a rabbit’s head. Not much you can do about it in my eyes, unless you only go for body shots (which is a waste of good meat!)...
If you watch this video, it gives an idea of the possibility of CF ricochet angles -https://youtu.be/dq4xnRGZMOI
Bear in mind above that there are probably four rounds of non-tracer FMJ being fired in between each tracer round - they’ll ricochet just as much and to all sorts of different heights and at different angles!
If you watch this video, it gives an idea of the possibility of CF ricochet angles -https://youtu.be/dq4xnRGZMOI
Bear in mind above that there are probably four rounds of non-tracer FMJ being fired in between each tracer round - they’ll ricochet just as much and to all sorts of different heights and at different angles!
The "theory" is highly simplistic, but roughly correct IF the effects of the rapidly spinning bullet, deformation etc are included. The reality is that the path of a bullet striking an object is frequently not calculable in practice. How high do you consider a decent backdrop to be?
Suppose we use your "theory". You're firing at a target area 50 yards in front of a vertical backstop. The bullet strikes a small stone with a flat face inclined at 30 degrees from horizontal. The ricochet would clear a 250 foot high backstop.
If you watch this video, it gives an idea of the possibility of CF ricochet angles -https://youtu.be/dq4xnRGZMOI
Bear in mind above that there are probably four rounds of non-tracer FMJ being fired in between each tracer round - they’ll ricochet just as much and to all sorts of different heights and at different angles!
[/QUOTE]
Also If my memory serves me right ( I have been out of the army for 24 years) look at the tracer still going upwards when it goes out.... they go out at 1100 metres! so going plenty further!
Bear in mind above that there are probably four rounds of non-tracer FMJ being fired in between each tracer round - they’ll ricochet just as much and to all sorts of different heights and at different angles!
[/QUOTE]
Also If my memory serves me right ( I have been out of the army for 24 years) look at the tracer still going upwards when it goes out.... they go out at 1100 metres! so going plenty further!
Well I can't see how any amount of backstop is going to stop a ricochetting bullet that's travelling in a completely different direction from where the backstop is, unless you're suggesting that the whole landscape is your backstop, which I suppose it is. Any hill will do, even if it's hundreds of yards away.
(That jackdaw video from the shitting shur springs to mind).
According to your theory, pretty high.
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