Straight Pull AR .223 recommendations?

[Twotone]

Evening All,

Planning on using it for a target shooting up to 600 yards. I don't want to go overkill on barrel length so I'm thinking around 15", that way it I wanted to do any CSR stuff at Bisley it's not too long (I'd probably chuck a mod on it too).

I'd love to hear from anyone who has one and what barrel length you have & what sort of accuracy/reliability you're getting, plus how you find the quality?

I've used a few different Southern Gun Company ones several times with 14"-16" barrels and have found them absolutely fine but don't have experience with any other brand.

I'm quite interested in a Schmeisser M4FL as they look the business and seem to be well regarded. As do the various options that Bradley Arms offer.

Budget will be £1000-1600 for the rifle when it comes to buying one! Plenty crop up on the usual sites with low round counts etc so some suggestions would be very helpful.

Thanks all

 

[nick.308]

I have a DPMS, build quality is fine and think its a 16" barrel. accuracy is good.
Downside is noisy reloading but fine for range, Also think brass is best full length sized rather than just neck sized as otherwise its tight to close the bolt

 

[saddler]

The no longer made Bradley Arms models have a solid following, for good reason.
IF you can find one, grab it

I found a DPMS that was in a bit of an unusual spec./trim, fugly to look at, which a mate had a 223 slot for.
As it was cheap he grabbed it....then he's spent a little time and effort swapping parts out, etc., selling the bits he didn't need - as a result he's got a really nice build, to his preferences, for not a massive outlay

Agree with the full length sizing only rule for any ammo for a straight pull - you could go a stage further and get some "small base" dies to assist in producing more efficient full length sizing
I also run ALL ammo for all my guns through a case checker at each stage to make sure it's not going to have any issues being chambered, etc.

Have fun finding something

 

[Geoff9]

Bradley Arms are I believe still going despite the passing of Mark. I have an upper he built for me its faultless. I agree with the full length sizing if you reload.
Since you mention CSR, which I have done a few, you would probably find your answers best answered at csrshooter.co.uk if you happen to be a leftie there is an AR for sale on there but your budget might be a bit challenged

 

[xavierdoc]

Bradley Arms is indeed still going, Nick St Aubyn is your man.

Valkyrie make good straight-pull ARs (Dave Wylde)

Southern Gun also good.

I currently have rifles from each of the above- all are entirely satisfactory.

I don't know anyone in CSR using Schmeisser or Lantac. Make sure you get a fast enough twist to stabilise 77gr bullets (1:7-8)

The CSR forum isn't an open forum as such; it's really for people shooting CSR and those that don't shoot, get culled! If you want to get into CSR it's worth joining, though. You will have to make an intro post before you can see any content.

My current 223Rem CSR rifle is 19", my other 223Rem is 21" heavy barrel and I used it for years in CSR before deciding it was too accurate (you don't need a 1/2MOA rifle to win, so I save it for more precise shooting).

My 300Blackout upper has a 12.5" barrel, originally for CSR FIBUA (or urban contact as it's now known) and the close range matches.

Finally, I have a BAR-22 with a 12.5" barrel.

With your budget, you may not get to choose as it's going to depend what comes up.

It's entirely doable though: my current CSR rifle was third hand ("low round count") and cost me £650 about two years ago (originally built by Valkyrie). In the Imperial last week it was good enough for 2 silvers, 2 Bronzes and an HPS cross (highest possible score).

 

[wanderer]

I use a 20 inch barrel for CSR, Bradley Arms, 1:9 twist and 69gn Sierra match king.
For me 20" is a good barrel length without a loss of velocity that the shorter lengths would lead to.

 

[Donkey Basher]

Based on the experiences my brother had with one, I'd say avoid SGC - he was lucky, he got paid out when they banned lever release as his was neither reliable nor accurate.

If you plan to shoot to 600 yards, reasonably accurately, then you may want to re think your requirements on barrel length. I'd suggest at least 20" & a fast twist as others have said.

If you really want to shoot accurately out to 600, or even 300 (McQueen?) then I'd suggest you think about a decent bolt action rifle with a 20-26" 1:8 twist barrel. Granted that's no good for CSR but all depends on what your real purpose for it is.

 

[finnbear270]

Valkyrie rifles, Dave Wylde.

 

[Twotone]

Thanks all for your comments so far.
I've tried to resist the urge to manifest all of the different disciplines/uses in one rifle so anything above 600 will be covered by a bolt action in a bigger calibre e.g. .308/6.5 etc.

From your kind comments on here I've established a 1in8 twist rate is a minimum, especially as I play to use 69grn or bigger loads. This puts the schmeisser options out of the running as they are all 1in9 from the looks of things.

An 18"+ barrel seems to also be suggested which I'm not adversed to, but as I'm quite a slender chap I didn't want anything to heavy to lug around when not doing standard bench/prone shooting at 100/300/600 yards.

I appreciate my budget isn't massive so most likely rules out a new build which I'm okay with!

I do like the look of the used Bradley options I see come up for sale, I'll keep an eye out and make some enquiries with some of the suggested routes.

Happy to hear any other suggestions too.

Thanks

 

[GGG]

Valkyrie rifles, Dave Wylde.

Dave knows AR15s and also shoots them, give him a ring.

 

[Geoff9]

Matt Greenall at ar15.co.uk normally has a selection of bits around to build what you want.
CSR shooter and decent bloke to deal with.

 

[MarinePMI]

I'd think a 1-8 twist would be preferable, as well as at least a 20" barrel. The 1-8 will allow the use of 77 SMK, which excel at longer ranges. Just work up a Mk262 load, and you'll be fine at 600.

 

[Sakoodin1]

I am picking this up Tmoz from Dave wylde, it’s a 1-8” .223 with a 20” barrel on and a sl5 and a tuner on it to see if it tightens things up, it’s all tuned and polished and a trigger tech put in it to. I will let you know how it shoots in a week once it’s shot in. Looks the part though I think I am going to be putting 53 grn vmax through it as it’s a vermin rifle with vit 133 hopefully and magtech small rifle primers with lapua brass

 

[Twotone]

I am picking this up Tmoz from Dave wylde, it’s a 1-8” .223 with a 20” barrel on and a sl5 and a tuner on it to see if it tightens things up, it’s all tuned and polished and a trigger tech put in it to. I will let you know how it shoots in a week once it’s shot in. Looks the part though I think I am going to be putting 53 grn vmax through it as it’s a vermin rifle with vit 133 hopefully and magtech small rifle primers with lapua brass

Looks a lovely bit of kit! Let me know how it goes

 

[long_range_rob]

I used to run this SGC Speedmaster. 20” fluted heavy barrel, Jewel trigger group. Very accurate which caused problems on ETR’s as the tin targets are so full of holes you had to head shoot or go for shoulders to register hits.

 

[badmolassesaccident]

Slight tangent, but how would I get stated doing CSR?

I have a magazine fed 308 I could start off with and get something more CSR-ish later.

 

[long_range_rob]

Slight tangent, but how would I get stated doing CSR?

I have a magazine fed 308 I could start off with and get something more CSR-ish later.

Civilian Service Rifle & Practical Rifle

Well it’s the same as the Service Rifle competitions run by the military, and only differs in the fact that we naturally use UK legal civilian firearms and don’t have to wear belt kit and helmet…..unless you want to! Apart from the timings on a few practices, it is for all intents and purposes...

nra.org.uk

 

[Sakoodin1]

Just finished shooting it in this morning, I plan to use 53grn vmax once I start developing a load but this is the groups with 50grn vmax ( I bought a 100 to shoot it in ), so on the left is a 100 yards and a 10 shot group from shot count count 70-80,the one in the right is the same distance and a 10 shot group from 90-100 using vit 133,22.5 grn I think going out at a average of 3000fps (to slow but I just wanted a steady load to start )with a crap sd of 17.1 over a 20 shot string, bear in mind I done no brass prep at all they were straight out the box and loaded so I would imaging once I full length size them now and mandrel the necks and uniform the primer pockets and flash holes it will not do any harm. I will stick with vit 133 as I’ve a fair bit of case room left and I will see what happens pressure/speed wise. I just wanted to share and say a big thanks to Valkyrie rifles as it’s yet another good shooting gun I have had made. My 5th to be exact that’s it though no more building guns in my wish list I shot it in using my own method kind of so I shot 5 singles cleaning with forest bore foam with a soak of 12 hrs each time then 5 pairs then 3 triples then 6 strings of 6 then a string of 19 then a 30 all with 12 hrs soak then patch out until dry and it was bang in the middle after cleaning so no fowler needed.

 

[PhilSN12]

My foxing rifle is a Schmeisser M4FL.
I love it and get .5MOA using Federal Premium 55g Nosler tip.
Its is zeroed at 165y which means anything out to 200y I just aim straight at it.

 

[DanTheMan]

Another thumbs up for Bradley Arms, mine is a 1 in 8 twist and 18" barrel, perfect for 77gr homeloads and 62gr milsurp which I switch between during CSR matches.
Join the CSR forum asap as there are good s/h rifles for sale on there.