BASC welcomes EU firearms proposals

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People/organisations can stand up and shout/demand all they like but it's very rare that everyone get what they want in any walk of life.

Life works on compromise. This decision is a hell of a lot better than that which was originally proposed. As the saying goes - you can please some of the people all of the time but you can't please all of the people all of the time.

 

[flying felix]

We should not "welcome" any firearms proposals that affect legitimate shooters, regardless of where they shoot.

How many times does it have to be proved that increased firearms restrictions has absolutely no effect on criminal or terrorist activities.

 

[Orion]

Re the 20 round restriction, yes mags are restricted to 20 rounds, that's my understanding

There appears to have been a last minute amendment made before the vote was taken (0.56 onwards) with the ban on 20+ round magazines removed from the proposed legislation but all magazines for either semi-autos (or maybe all rifles?????, it's not clear) to become controlled items!

The speaker following Vicky Ford has the right idea to question why the proposals are being considered and whether any impact assessments have been undertaken.

[video]https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/2qO9emuXFGsgceu7f-XxeCoJ5sf2pejzVsB9ULsHpGJlkMly_jZCVnB-ub37-uJVVR6TvT6M=w640-h360-n-k[/video]

 

[Druid]

This magazines becoming controlled items is going to be ludicrous.
there are a ton of re-enactors, owners of de-acts etc who will be caught out on this.
ive got a number of 30 round AR magazines which I do not currently have a rifle to use them on. What do I need to do? Register them? Hand them in? Bin them? Or apply for a slot for a straight pull or self unloading rifle that takes these magazines?
Im thinking the latter for me personally, but this is ridiculous.

 

[User00021]

People/organisations can stand up and shout/demand all they like but it's very rare that everyone get what they want in any walk of life.

Life works on compromise. This decision is a hell of a lot better than that which was originally proposed. As the saying goes - you can please some of the people all of the time but you can't please all of the people all of the time.

UK Firearms owners have been compromising for over 100 years!

As for reasonable, it's just the usual negotiations trick of starting with outlandish requirements to make their actual requirements look reasonable.

A lot of what has been proposed is already in place in the UK but the problems I foresee are additional or tightening of conditions and the onus on individuals to keep more records of shooting activity.

I have been in the US for just over 18 months, yes it has a lot of problems but the some of the best bits in terms of shooting have been the lack of conditions. I don't have to worry about whether I used a gun in the last year, I don't have to justify having two of the same calibre, I don't have to worry about shooting soft points at paper, ammunition can be ordered on line and delivered to my door, it doesn't matter that I have 600 and 1 rounds, I don't have to buy a load of old toot as a basis to collect guns...

Hunters, target shooters, reenactors, collectors etc., are continually being made to suffer and the problems caused by the government's domestic and foreign policies are being used as the latest excuse.

 

[Orion]

.........Or apply for a slot for a straight pull or self unloading rifle that takes these magazines?
Im thinking the latter for me personally, but this is ridiculous.

I'd caution on that point - you can bet your bottom dollar that FELWG have self-unloaders firmly in their sights for a move to S.5. All they need is an excuse.

 

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UK Firearms owners have been compromising for over 100 years!

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I am not denying hunters rights are being compromised, or that ill founded reasons are being used to change legislation. My point is that everything in life is about compromise. Every negotiator starts from a position that they have no hope of attaining and end up with a compromise.

The way I drive is compromised by people that don't like cars/pollution
What I can but in the shops is a compromise between what I want to buy and what the shop keeper can make money selling.
Our Health Service is compromised by the cash available to it.
The sports I watch on TV are compromised by the big buck of sponsorship going into relatively few sports
ect ect.

 

[Mr. Gain]

If someone wants to force you out of your house and you end up reaching a compromise that permits you to live in the garden shed, is that to be welcomed?

None of these restrictions has any basis other than scapegoating and any appeal other than to uninformed prejudice, and no one should be under any illusions about this.

Next stop, the ditch at the end of the garden.

BASC - it's really important you stop coming across as complacent, or as spinning the news to look better than it is. Unless you make it absolutely clear how you are standing up and fighting our corner, the members, and the money, will go elsewhere. At present, the picture I'm getting from all my shooting friends is that the CA trumps you on politics and the GWCT trumps you on conservation. That's not the way it should be.

 

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If someone wants to force you out of your house and you end up reaching a compromise that permits you to live in the garden shed, is that to be welcomed?

None of these restrictions has any basis other than scapegoating and any appeal other than to uninformed prejudice, and no one should be under any illusions about this.

Next stop, the ditch at the end of the garden.

BASC - it's really important you stop coming across as complacent, or as spinning the news to look better than it is. Unless you make it absolutely clear how you are standing up and fighting our corner, the members, and the money, will go elsewhere. At present, the picture I'm getting from all my shooting friends is that the CA trumps you on politics and the GWCT trumps you on conservation. That's not the way it should be.

Forcing is not a compromise

 

[Druid]

I'd caution on that point - you can bet your bottom dollar that FELWG have self-unloaders firmly in their sights for a move to S.5. All they need is an excuse.

Well I get where you are coming from but they have been around for a few years in 9mm and I am a firm believer that I would rather have something that I fancy and is legal at the moment than not bother to just in case.
if they want to register my legal possessions (scary magazines!) then I may as well have something to use them in.

 

[Greymaster]

BASC - it's really important you stop coming across as complacent, or as spinning the news to look better than it is. Unless you make it absolutely clear how you are standing up and fighting our corner, the members, and the money, will go elsewhere. At present, the picture I'm getting from all my shooting friends is that the CA trumps you on politics and the GWCT trumps you on conservation. That's not the way it should be.

Well said. I wish BASC (I am a member) would stop putting a spin on every capitulation. Save the spin for paid for ads in the shooting press if you like, but please stop selling greater restrictions as some sort of win. PLEASE!

 

[Dalua]

Well said. I wish BASC (I am a member) would stop putting a spin on every capitulation. Save the spin for paid for ads in the shooting press if you like, but please stop selling greater restrictions as some sort of win. PLEASE!

I'm also a BASC member, and I share this view.

 

[David63]

Reporting the facts is not spin. For example -
We were looking at the potential for a ban on all semi autos and we fourght that off, do you not see that as something to welcome?

We were looking at restrictions or bans on under 18's having access to firearms for training etc. - we fought this off, do you not see that as something to welcome?

I am surprised you are not happy with that, but I do take your comments on board, better communication about what we are doing is needed - and this will be on our web site and in our magazine, and through occasional newsletters.

So please keep an eye on these media, maybe I will back off from the forums a bit to focus on other areas of communication.

David

 

[Tartan_Terrier]

What's the deal with repeating rifles and 20+ mag capacity? Are straight pull ARs allowed to use 30 round mags for example?

 

[Mr. Gain]

Dear David,

I'm sorry you feel stung, and realise that things could have been much worse, and appreciate that much hard work often goes unseen and unrewarded.

The last thing I'd want is to see BASC back off from communicating with the wider shooting community. Far better would be a higher profile and a more resolute voice.

Reflecting, let me try again: "Well done BASC! Up and at them! Don't let the beggars grind us down! Keep at it! Give me an "B"! Give me an "A"! Give me an "S"! Give me a "C"! Go BASC! Hurrah!"

Actually, that made me feel happier.

Reporting the facts is not spin. For example -
We were looking at the potential for a ban on all semi autos and we fourght that off, do you not see that as something to welcome?

We were looking at restrictions or bans on under 18's having access to firearms for training etc. - we fought this off, do you not see that as something to welcome?

I am surprised you are not happy with that, but I do take your comments on board, better communication about what we are doing is needed - and this will be on our web site and in our magazine, and through occasional newsletters.

So please keep an eye on these media, maybe I will back off from the forums a bit to focus on other areas of communication.

David

 

[timbrayford]

A step in the right direction https://basc.org.uk/blog/press-releases/latest-news/basc-welcomes-eu-firearms-proposals/

David

Only in so far as it might just maintain the status quo within the UK.

We are still a very long way from restoring full bore semi-auto rifles and pistols to legitimate recreational use, extending certificate life and dispensing with much of the nonsense bureaucracy involved with S1, etc.

 

[Lupus]

Shooting faces 'death by a thousand cuts'. Every 'compromise' is another step, however small, toward the end of civilian/recreational shooting.

Compromise means give and take on BOTH sides. I only ever see the shooting community giving up rights and the authorities taking them away. This is NOT compromise. The bits they've graciously let's us keep today will be the bits they take away next time they need a scapegoat so they appear to be tackling armed crime. And by next time it'll be sold as a 'compromise' because the initial proposals will contain unacceptable (this time round) measures and we'll be made to feel grateful that it wasn't as bad as it could've been. But WE'LL still have lost something, and gained nothing except a temporary reprieve.

Wolfie

 

[Orion]

Shooting faces 'death by a thousand cuts'. Every 'compromise' is another step, however small, toward the end of civilian/recreational shooting.

Which is quite possibly the agenda the police and HO have been working to since the secretive McKay Report of 1972.

"The McKay Report, finalised in September 1972, is widely seen as having been written with a pre-conceived agenda of disarmament and the deliberate destruction of private firearms ownership in Great Britain in mind."

Read the unearthed and available sections linked from here: https://ukshootingnews.wordpress.com/2015/06/25/mckay-report-1972-in-full/#more-308

 

[finnbear270]

Reporting the facts is not spin. For example -
We were looking at the potential for a ban on all semi autos and we fourght that off, do you not see that as something to welcome?

We were looking at restrictions or bans on under 18's having access to firearms for training etc. - we fought this off, do you not see that as something to welcome?

I am surprised you are not happy with that, but I do take your comments on board, better communication about what we are doing is needed - and this will be on our web site and in our magazine, and through occasional newsletters.

So please keep an eye on these media, maybe I will back off from the forums a bit to focus on other areas of communication.Maybe one day in the far distant future, that lovely "Media" centre opened by royalty could be employed more fully, possibly even having more input from the "Membership" on line
Ah but that would be upsetting the apple cart, wouldn't it.
David

bleddy I pads!

 

[Old-YOP]

Read the unearthed and available sections linked from here: https://ukshootingnews.wordpress.com/2015/06/25/mckay-report-1972-in-full/#more-308

Good, many thanks for that link.