22 hornet extraction problem

[mealiejimmy]

I recently bought a used Weihrauch HW66 in 22 Hornet.
I really like the rifle and it shoots very accurately with both factory (PPU) and reloaded ammunition,
However, with both factory and reloaded ammo, cases frequently fail to extract after firing and have to be pushed out of the chamber with a cleaning rod.
The reloaded ammo is previously used PPU and Hornady brass, or new Nosler brass, small pistol primer, 13g Lil Gun powder and H&N 45gn bullet. COL is 1.710-1.715 (to make them fit the magazine)
I also reloaded some 35gn Hornady V max with 10.5gn of H110 and still had the same issue.
I've had the extractor spring replaced by the RFD I bought it from and he did get a replacement extractor claw from Hull cartridge, but it was different to that in the gun, so the original extractor claw is still fitted
I've cleaned the chamber as best I can and don't see anything obviously wrong.
I don't see any overpressure signs on the primers, but clearly the cases are expanding and still gripping the chamber after the pressure from the shot has passed.
Any thoughts on this??

Cheers

Bruce

 

[pj1]

Not had this problem with my 60j but here are some pics of the bolt / extractor if it helps

View attachment 86899View attachment 86900View attachment 86901

 

[Andy RV]

How do the cases look when offered up to the bolt? Is the fit between the rim and extractor tight? Perhaps it's too tight and the extractor is not dropping over the rim?

 

[pj1]

View attachment 86905View attachment 86906View attachment 86907

Im sure the above question was aimed at the op but again just for refereance

PPU Hornady and PPU.

The claw isnt push out at all by the case

 

[Heym SR20]

1) Make sure the spring for the extractor is nice and strong. If the tip of the extractor is broken / beveled or worn it could quite easily jump over the rim if there is any stickiness in the chamber.

2) use a bore foam and give the whole chamber and barrel a good long soak. Then patch out and give the bore a good scrub - especially around the throat. For the chamber use probably a 7mm / 308 bore brush and give that a good clean.

If that doesn't work then

3) Take a new case, pop out the bullet, powder and primer. Drill out the primer pocket and glue in with araldite a length of metal rod. Now use a little bit of fine abrasive paste - JB Boreshine would be good, or very fine lapping paste, and apply to just the walls of the cartridge and using a back and forth motion between your hands give the chamber sides a bit of a polish.

Most usually there will be a bit of crud, carbon build up or a but of minor pitting that gives enough friction to grip the case. Cases will expand to the chamber size to seal against gas - thats why chambers are tapered so that just amount of reward movement from the bolt - the caming effect on lifting the handle breaks the seal. If there are pits, or crud the case will flow around this making it grip harder.

 

[mealiejimmy]

Thanks for the responses so far.
If I place a round partially in the chamber and move the bolt forward, the claw catches the rim of the case - I can then move the round backwards and forwards by moving the bolt backwards and forwards. I can also fully load the round and close the bolt easily and if I don't fire the round it extracts perfectly.
A bit more info I should have included in my first post.
All of the reloaded rounds have been full length sized and trimmed to length
When a round is fired, but fails to extract, the bolt moves back very easily, implying that the extractor claw somehow lost engagement with the rim of the case.

Cheers

Bruce

 

[Cottis]

Seems odd if the case extracts fine when unfired.

This suggests that either there is some massive expansion of the case post firing or that maybe there is a build up of crud in the chamber that means slight expansion of spent cartridge sees it stick. Still would expect a decent extractor to pull it out.

When you say you popped it out with a rod, is that just how you decided to get it out or did you try anything else. For example, can you get your finger nail in there and just hoik it out or does it require proper effort? ie, is it stuck and needs physically removing?

 

[sauer]

I had same on my .22lr cz452 .....got a chamber cleaning kit with little rectangle cotton pads and was advised to strip & clean bolt itself
Don't know what of the two did it , but never had bother since

Paul

 

[mealiejimmy]

Seems odd if the case extracts fine when unfired.

This suggests that either there is some massive expansion of the case post firing or that maybe there is a build up of crud in the chamber that means slight expansion of spent cartridge sees it stick. Still would expect a decent extractor to pull it out.

When you say you popped it out with a rod, is that just how you decided to get it out or did you try anything else. For example, can you get your finger nail in there and just hoik it out or does it require proper effort? ie, is it stuck and needs physically removing?

Using a rod was the only way I can get the cases out - and it needs a good push on the end of the rod to shift the case.
I tried a pointed tool on the back of the case rim levering against the slot at the side of the chamber where the extractor claw locates and the case wouldn't budge.
.
I tried cleaning the chamber, but maybe I didn't get in far enough - going to try that again.

Thanks again guys

Cheers

Bruce

 

[Andy RV]

Are you getting any rings or marks on the cases after firing? Can you measure the cases pre & post firing to establish how much expansion you're getting and if it's uniform along the neck?

 

[Heym SR20]

Thanks for the responses so far.
If I place a round partially in the chamber and move the bolt forward, the claw catches the rim of the case - I can then move the round backwards and forwards by moving the bolt backwards and forwards. I can also fully load the round and close the bolt easily and if I don't fire the round it extracts perfectly.
A bit more info I should have included in my first post.
All of the reloaded rounds have been full length sized and trimmed to length
When a round is fired, but fails to extract, the bolt moves back very easily, implying that the extractor claw somehow lost engagement with the rim of the case.

Cheers

Bruce

Crud cleaning sounds the solution. Also there will be a cut in the breech face into which the extractor claw fits. Chances are there is build up of crud in there that is lifting the extractor claw, or preventing it from getting a good grip. Get a wee pick into there and give that a clean. I would take the scope and mounts off so you can really get in there.

Also check under the extractor claw on the bolt - you say a new spring was put in, but is the claw seating properly.

99% of rifle problems are due to some form of crud, build up of lubricant or something not being tight.

 

[Ranger22]

A friend of mine had a 222 and it was doing the exact same thing. It would eject unfired rounds but not fired ones or fired ones we put back In the rifle. The extractor was worn