Am I in the ball park for achieving reasonable MV.

[purdeydog]

Hello

Recently finished two new load developments to replace varget in my .308 26” barrel. Looking for a little conformation that I’m in the ball park in terms of acceptable/achievable MV. Both loads are N150. Both were worked up per round to pressure test to what I felt was max load and then groupings were done at 100y.

1st was N150 with 178g ELDX. 4 groups of five rounds. This is a compressed load and the bullets of loaded quite deep to fit in magazine.
41.2g
2529 fps
2567
2555
2562
2561 SD 13 Ave MV 2554 Group 0.629

41.6g
2586
2595
2577
2584
2578 SD 6 Ave MV 2584 Group size 0.718. Probably going to go with this load.

42.0g
2545
2574
2568
2580
2580 SD 12 Ave MV 2569 Group size 0.616

42.4g
2556
2600
2619
2622
2618 SD 24 Ave 2603 Group size 1.078


2nd is N150 with Berger 185g. This is loaded quite long with not much jump to the lands.
42.8g
2555 fps
2614
2614
2562
2553 Group size 0,948 - SD 29

43.2g
2593
2602
2576
2567
2573 Group size 0.674 - SD 13

43.7g
2570
2580
2605
2603
2601 Group size 0.703 SD 14

44g
2610
2597
2606
2617
2607 Group size 0.454 - SD 6. Probably going to go with this load.

Many thanks for any help.

 

[Muir]

I mean no offense, but posts like this make my head hurt. In reloading you reach a point where "It is what it is." and you have obviously reached it. It's a compressed load. What do you care about "reasonable" velocity expectations? The velocity is good for a 308 and a 178 and moreover, you've already decided to go with load #4. What is the question?

If you don't like what you have, you can change powders but I wouldn't mess with that load. As it stands, you have two options: Run with the load, or redo the test with 20 rounds to see what the true performance is. SD of 6 is great but 5 rounds is statistically speaking, a non-event. Not being critical here, just looking from the outside, in, as it were. It looks like you have as good load and did good work. Don't put your results up to a referendum.~Muir

 

[purdeydog]

Mr Muir

No problem. I hope your head is feeling better. No offence taken and likewise no offence given. You know your subject and it’s people like yourself I seek advice from as a relative new reloaded. However this is a standard response I’ve come to notice from yourself. It’s 50/50 weather you’ll give a helpful or as in this case not really very helpful post, in the nicest possible way of course.

Getting powder in the UK is a nightmare. No ones got what you want, or luckily if any, anywhere near me. So I make do with what I can.

Fair enough I didn’t actually put a question in my post. People with vastly more loading experience will know if this load sounds about right or not and was hoping to tap into that knowledge. I’ve not made a compressed load before.

Cheers

 

[Muir]

Sometimes help is in the form of no help at all.
The VHIT data for their 175 Sierra load shows velocities that match yours. Hornady's data tops out at about 2600 fps. Your powder charge is about the same as listed in the Vhit data. It is a compressed load. Your ballistic numbers -small sample that they are- are excellent. As I've pointed out, you have done everything well. I could keep saying it, but instead, I'm asking what your point is? All you data is self satisfying as to the velocity expectation question.~Muir

 

[Yorric]

Two things spring to mind to ask yourself purdeydog.

What terminal velocity do you need at the maximum range you will be shooting at? That determines the launch velocity requirement for your particular bullet.
How long do you want your cases to last? -- Over pressuring cases doesn't help case life.

As Muir stated your test sample sizes are way too small for statistics to be useful & additionally the low number of steps in charge weight ladder for each bullet doesn't help you in a search for nodes.

Ian

 

[Rusty Gate]

Hello

Recently finished two new load developments to replace varget in my .308 26” barrel. Looking for a little conformation that I’m in the ball park in terms of acceptable/achievable MV. Both loads are N150. Both were worked up per round to pressure test to what I felt was max load and then groupings were done at 100y.

1st was N150 with 178g ELDX. 4 groups of five rounds. This is a compressed load and the bullets of loaded quite deep to fit in magazine.
41.2g
2529 fps
2567
2555
2562
2561 SD 13 Ave MV 2554 Group 0.629

41.6g
2586
2595
2577
2584
2578 SD 6 Ave MV 2584 Group size 0.718. Probably going to go with this load.

42.0g
2545
2574
2568
2580
2580 SD 12 Ave MV 2569 Group size 0.616

42.4g
2556
2600
2619
2622
2618 SD 24 Ave 2603 Group size 1.078


2nd is N150 with Berger 185g. This is loaded quite long with not much jump to the lands.
42.8g
2555 fps
2614
2614
2562
2553 Group size 0,948 - SD 29

43.2g
2593
2602
2576
2567
2573 Group size 0.674 - SD 13

43.7g
2570
2580
2605
2603
2601 Group size 0.703 SD 14

44g
2610
2597
2606
2617
2607 Group size 0.454 - SD 6. Probably going to go with this load.

Many thanks for any help.

I'm still new & learning the reloading art myself. I've picked up a bit from this thread so cheers for posting.
I've only used five shot groups to see a decent group then several more five shot groups over that grain weight to fine tune some more.
I've been pondering the outlay on a chromo but keep cost down to, what do you all use or start with even?

 

[dully1963]

Accuracy is King , if you can hit your target at the range you want your quarry be it paper or game will not care how fast the bullet was traveling !

 

[Cottis]

I'm still new & learning the reloading art myself. I've picked up a bit from this thread so cheers for posting.
I've only used five shot groups to see a decent group then several more five shot groups over that grain weight to fine tune some more.
I've been pondering the outlay on a chromo but keep cost down to, what do you all use or start with even?

It can be as easy or hard (basically cheap or expensive) as you want to make it.

We probably all start with some fire formed cases, a tub of powder and a small box of primers and a book. Add in a few tools and you put together some ammo that goes bang and hits somewhere close to your intended point of aim.

It really does depend on what you need from your kit. If you are literally shooting deer through the heart/lungs over normal ranges like 50-175yds, then you could really just bang together whatever ammo and test it to make sure you are not exceeding safe pressures and then go and shoot deer. I mean I am yet to put any powder/bullet combo together that will not shoot with the required precision that deer stalking needs. I have come across the odd bullet that my rifle(s) do not like but it is rare. Most will shoot, some much better.

Picking the right bullet for your intended application and then marrying it with a well respected powder of the correct speed for your bullet weight and cartridge is key.

After that, I would say a chrono is certainly useful but not entirely necessary. It seems expensive (£100 up to god knows how much for the top end stuff) but they can save you money and time. I use a magnetospeed and have worked up a load this week in 14 shots. 10 cartridges loaded at 0.4grain incremements all shot over the chrono in to the ground within a couple of minutes. This quickly shows you if your ammunition is safe pressure wise and also gives you the velocity for each charge weight. You could argue that two of each charge weight would be better to get a better average but I have used optimum charge weight for a good while now, so know where to see potential odd velocities, what to ignore and what to believe. Anyhow, within 10 shots it was obvious to me where the 2 velocity flat spots were (accuracy nodes where barrel harmonics are at the their most consistent) I then chose the one that gave me my preferred velocity and loaded up 4 cartridges at that charge weight with the bullets seated 20 thou from the lands. Yesterday evening I put them all into just under half an inch. That is my load development done for that bullet. It could potentially be improved by playing a bit more but I am not sure what that would achieve with this particular rifle that does not need to be as accurate as this load is. I have other rifles that I would play with much more to get insane accuracy from if the application required it.

Prior to this, I started with the old fashioned way of shooting groups and crossing fingers. This took lots of time, components etc. Then I moved on to OCW method which I really do rate. It never ever fails for me and also gets you shooting which is good but it takes time to do it properly. I doubt I will do either of them again. The Satterlee method (shooting for velocity over the chrono to gauge flats spots) is easy, quick and cheap and seems to be a quicker way of achieving the same results from the velocity testing method.

Plenty of ways to skin a cat. Some use Quickload and other methods. As long as you find a load that works, have fun and can justify the cost, crack on and enjoy.

 

[1894]

Only thing I would wonder about is why the 42.8gr loads are nearly the same MV as the 44gr?