Doctor's letter and marker on medical records

[Foxkiller22250]

What if like myself haven't seen a gp for 25+ years (touch wood) how and what do thay know about me my local landlord of the pub knows more about me than them said this at my last renewal to tvp I buckled in the end and paid the fee for them to see what !!!!!!!!!!
Ps I'm crap with this typing stuff

 

[Foxkiller22250]

What if like myself haven't seen a gp for 25+ years (touch wood) how and what do thay know about me my local landlord of the pub knows more about me than them said this at my last renewal to tvp I buckled in the end and paid the fee for them to see what !!!!!!!!!!
Ps I'm crap with this typing stuff

 

[mealiejimmy]

What if like myself haven't seen a gp for 25+ years (touch wood) how and what do thay know about me my local landlord of the pub knows more about me than them said this at my last renewal to tvp I buckled in the end and paid the fee for them to see what !!!!!!!!!!
Ps I'm crap with this typing stuff

If you haven't been to see your GP in the last 25 years then there will be nothing in your medical records to suggest that you suffer from any of the medical conditions listed in the application form
In that case, the GP has no grounds to say that you are medically unfit to have an SGC or FAC


Cheers

Bruce

 

[Foxkiller22250]

I know that you know that but tvp said they wouldn't continue without the letter so I had to buckle and pay the £80 fee as It was the wrong time of year and didn't want to take risk of it not being granted!!!!!!! May be different next time if I haven't seen my gp might just not pay and see what happens !!!!!

 

[mealiejimmy]

I know that you know that but tvp said they wouldn't continue without the letter so I had to buckle and pay the £80 fee as It was the wrong time of year and didn't want to take risk of it not being granted!!!!!!! May be different next time if I haven't seen my gp might just not pay and see what happens !!!!!

As long as you stay well, there won't be a next time.
The GP is supposed to put a marker on your medical record to highlight the fact that you are a certificate holder and contact the police if your medical condition changes such that you now suffer from any of the relevant conditions listed on the application.
If the police hear nothing from your GP before your next renewal, they assume there is no change in your medical status and do not require you to go through the process again.

Cheers

Bruce

 

[Liveonce]

As long as you stay well, there won't be a next time.

Time will tell, but with not every GP engaging in the process and the police not knowing which are and which are not They will fail safe and ask again for the medical report, unless the statutory guidance has something to say about it but then they are already saying that is not primary law, so just like now with HOG2016 are free to ignore it.

 

[Free range rob]

Here’s a chuckle, my first lot of forms got sent back as the address I used for my gp surgery was incorrect, they had moved 7 years prior, and I had been de registered 2 years prior to them moving, the last (and only) time I saw them was 1997 when I had jabs to travel to Kenya. I had to register with a new gp.

 

[Stiffy]

In Surrey/Sussex any application or renewal where the form doctors letter is nor received within 3 weeks is cancelled and returned to you.

Does anyone know if you get your money back when your application is cancelled?
You can only make a renewal application online with Surrey/Sussex, all in one sitting, and you must pay at the end to finish it.
Then you see a note warning you to submit you GP letter within ten days. A bit if a surprise if you didn't read the pre submission notes before starting the application!

 

[mealiejimmy]

Time will tell, but with not every GP engaging in the process and the police not knowing which are and which are not They will fail safe and ask again for the medical report, unless the statutory guidance has something to say about it but then they are already saying that is not primary law, so just like now with HOG2016 are free to ignore it.

In Scotland, the form which the GP has to complete has a separate box which the GP ticks if they have put a marker on the applicants medical record.
The Police will accept the form if the box is not ticked and can issue a certificate, but if the box is ticked and the police hear nothing from the GP during the validity of the certificate, then there is no reason for the certificate holder to go through the GP process again at their next renewal.

Cheers

Bruce

 

[Liveonce]

In Scotland, the form which the GP has to complete has a separate box which the GP ticks if they have put a marker on the applicants medical record.
The Police will accept the form if the box is not ticked and can issue a certificate, but if the box is ticked and the police hear nothing from the GP during the validity of the certificate, then there is no reason for the certificate holder to go through the GP process again at their next renewal.

Cheers

Bruce

No such box down south when I did mine December last year, the idea is that only after the certificate is granted do the police confirm with the applicants GP that the marker is required, as the application may fail for other reasons.

Never mind they will get a decent consistent process one day with luck.

 

[mealiejimmy]

No such box down south when I did mine December last year, the idea is that only after the certificate is granted do the police confirm with the applicants GP that the marker is required, as the application may fail for other reasons.

Never mind they will get a decent consistent process one day with luck.

For better or worse, we only have one police force in Scotland. You've got 40 plus separate forces in England and Wales and 40 plus different ideas about how to implement the medical rules

Cheers

Bruce

 

[Free range rob]

the idea is that only after the certificate is granted do the police confirm with the applicants GP that the marker is required, as the application may fail for other reasons.

Not the case in practise though as I know 2 new grants this year where the marker was placed before cert was granted, before the home visit had even taken place

 

[Liveonce]

Not the case in practise though as I know 2 new grants this year where the marker was placed before cert was granted, before the home visit had even taken place

Indeed confirms exactly what Bruce was saying 40 ways each different, but HOG2016 clearly states that the marker request should be sent by the Police after the application has been successful, but then we all know the police are ignoring HOG2016.
Matters not, so long as the marker is added and we don’t get shafted at renewal for another GP report.

 

[Patterdale Terrier]

I understand changes are afoot. In future we will obtain a medical report, pay for it and we will submit it with all our applications, that will cut out the police involvement unless there is an issue. No medical report, which means an incomplete application means no certificate. Maybe a positive is less delays and backlogs? Think I heard that right.

 

[Free range rob]

Matters not, so long as the marker is added and we don’t get shafted at renewal for another GP report.

your an optimist then

 

[mealiejimmy]

I understand changes are afoot. In future we will obtain a medical report, pay for it and we will submit it with all our applications, that will cut out the police involvement unless there is an issue. No medical report, which means an incomplete application means no certificate. Maybe a positive is less delays and backlogs? Think I heard that right.

No "medical report" = no certificate is how it's been in Scotland since April 2016 - no exceptions
The problem is that the applicants GP is under no obligation to cooperate and some actively refuse (on supposed ethical grounds) to participate in the system.
There is also no standard fee charged by GPs for providing the medical report.
A few do it for free, but some charge £200 or more
This has led to the formation of Medcert who, for a fixed fee of £50, will obtain a copy of your medical records from your (non-cooperative or overcharging) GP , review them, and if satisfactory, provide the police with the report they require to continue processing the application.
However, the latest word from the chiefs of police is that they are not happy with a doctor other than the applicants GP providing the medical report

Cheers

Bruce

 

[mealiejimmy]

your an optimist then

Everything I hear from Police Scotland is that if you have gone through the medical checks at your grant/last renewal, AND your GP has put a marker on your medical records AND the police have not been contacted by your GP with concerns about you medical condition, then it will not be necessary to get another medical report at your next renewal.

Cheers

Bruce

 

[Liveonce]

I understand changes are afoot. In future we will obtain a medical report, pay for it and we will submit it with all our applications, that will cut out the police involvement unless there is an issue. No medical report, which means an incomplete application means no certificate. Maybe a positive is less delays and backlogs? Think I heard that right.

Really, the medical report was introduced because a tiny number of applicants were found to be economical with the truth regarding their medical history on their application form.
So if these individuals are to obtain and submit the medical report directly to the police what stops them amending, or creating a forgery of their medical report before submitting it to the police. Especially if they use an alternative GP I.e other than their registered GP.
Only hope is that the letter the police send to their registered GP to add the marker to their records that they own firearms causes alarm bells to ring with their registered GP.
But wait this request is now part of the initial request to the GP for the report (or is in Scotland) so the alternative GP ignores it as they are very unlikely to have write access to the applicants digital records and the registered GP never sees the request to add the marker.

Round and round we go back to square one, except the Chief Constables backside is covered as they have a medical report.

 

[bobthedug]

No "medical report" = no certificate is how it's been in Scotland since April 2016 - no exceptions
The problem is that the applicants GP is under no obligation to cooperate and some actively refuse (on supposed ethical grounds) to participate in the system.
There is also no standard fee charged by GPs for providing the medical report.
A few do it for free, but some charge £200 or more
This has led to the formation of Medcert who, for a fixed fee of £50, will obtain a copy of your medical records from your (non-cooperative or overcharging) GP , review them, and if satisfactory, provide the police with the report they require to continue processing the application.
However, the latest word from the chiefs of police is that they are not happy with a doctor other than the applicants GP providing the medical report

Cheers

Bruce

Hi Bruce,
Just had a lengthy conversation with my mate who is an FEO. I had mentioned that my report which is basically ticking 4 boxes was done and returned by the Surgery in a few days. I was impressed as you cannot even get into the Surgery due to restrictions . Anyway, all for £40 but no complaints on the cost front as there is one doctor who has asked for over 1K for ticking the boxes from one applicant.
Needless to say, Medcert have been contacted to enable the renewal to proceed.
Point is, I am told that there is absolutely no concerns from Police regarding the use of Medcert or the likes. Where did you hear there was.

 

[Liveonce]

Bruce hope you do not mind me jumping in on this for bobthedug.

It is in the January 2020 minutes

https://www.npcc.police.uk/documents/FOI%20Performance%20Monitoring/FELWG%20Minutes%20Jan%202020.pdf

Medical
DO Gave update re. recent brief discussion with policing minister, and his intent to meet in the near future to discuss medical arrangements.
The issue of start-up business doing medical checks was discussed, and NB critically asked for clarity for all forces whether policing should accept medical screening not completed by an individual’s GP. DO drew the analogy of locum doctors, and how he would find it difficult to argue against the views of a locum, provided they had full access to an individual’s medical records, but we should not forget the overarching secondary aim of enduring medical markers, and forces must ensure there is some method in place to satisfy this need. DO suggests until the stat guidance comes out, his recommendation is that third party screening is accepted solong as it is signed off by a GMC registered doctor with full access to an individual’s medical records - The correspondence should include a declaration to this effect. Notifications for enduring medical markers must also be sent to the applicants GP by licensing departments on grant. ACTION – NB to circulate the FELWG position until the HO guidance is clear and addresses the same.
National Police Chiefs’ Co