C h r i s
Well-Known Member
Check this out.. not sure if this is a new 'drive' to clamp down on FAC holders.
Derbyshire Police Rural Crime Team
Derbyshire Police Rural Crime Team
Derbyshire Police Rural Crime Team have seized approximately 30 firearms
- Thread starter C h r i s
- Start date
Indeed like an internal memo not to take or share pictures of victims of crime.
flatliner
Well-Known Member
Sinistral
Well-Known Member
If it's a Facebook link, as a non-member I'll stay in ignorance, thanks.
If this is of such importance, perhaps you could cut & paste the text.
I get the impression it is not to keep FAC-Holders on their toes: why would they want to do that? I'm sure they'd rather that dubious certificate-holders behaved in ways that would give the FLD ground to rescind: rather than than maintaining a veneer of good behaviour as a result of a Facebook campaign.
I think rather that the article is to show non-certificate-holders that they are responsibly discharging they duties under the Firearms Act.
No complaints from me there, except the use of the 'privilege, not a right' line, which I think first appeared in the preface to one of the HO Guides - and which is AFAIK not strictly correct.
I think rather that the article is to show non-certificate-holders that they are responsibly discharging they duties under the Firearms Act.
No complaints from me there, except the use of the 'privilege, not a right' line, which I think first appeared in the preface to one of the HO Guides - and which is AFAIK not strictly correct.
C h r i s
Well-Known Member
I'm not a member of Facebook either, but its available for all, regardless here is the text:
"Over the last few weeks the Rural Crime Team have seized approximately 30 firearms from Derbyshire residents owing to their conduct and concern over their suitability to be firearms certificate holders.
In Derbyshire there is and always has been intense scrutiny and robust safeguarding around firearms licensing, systems are in place to protect the public 24 hours a day 7 days a week.
The public and in particular firearms certificate holders should be under no illusion that should evidence come to light that an individual is no longer suitable to hold a certificate, their firearms and certificate will be seized by officers and a comprehensive review conducted by our Firearms Licencing Team to establish if that person’s certificate should be revoked. The key word in that sentence is “evidence” all cases will be thoroughly investigated and firearms holders can be confident that the outcome will be evidence based. Any offences involving violence and alcohol or any incident that calls into question the persons fitness to possess firearms will likely result in them being seized.
Can we make it clear to all those who hold firearms certificate and to those who are considering applying for a certificate, your conduct matters and swift, robust action will be taken if your suitability is called into question. The issuing of a firearms certificate is a privilege not a right and we need to be confident that those who hold valid certificates are fit to do so."
"Over the last few weeks the Rural Crime Team have seized approximately 30 firearms from Derbyshire residents owing to their conduct and concern over their suitability to be firearms certificate holders.
In Derbyshire there is and always has been intense scrutiny and robust safeguarding around firearms licensing, systems are in place to protect the public 24 hours a day 7 days a week.
The public and in particular firearms certificate holders should be under no illusion that should evidence come to light that an individual is no longer suitable to hold a certificate, their firearms and certificate will be seized by officers and a comprehensive review conducted by our Firearms Licencing Team to establish if that person’s certificate should be revoked. The key word in that sentence is “evidence” all cases will be thoroughly investigated and firearms holders can be confident that the outcome will be evidence based. Any offences involving violence and alcohol or any incident that calls into question the persons fitness to possess firearms will likely result in them being seized.
Can we make it clear to all those who hold firearms certificate and to those who are considering applying for a certificate, your conduct matters and swift, robust action will be taken if your suitability is called into question. The issuing of a firearms certificate is a privilege not a right and we need to be confident that those who hold valid certificates are fit to do so."
Bavarianbrit
Well-Known Member
Tell that to the police swat team that left the sliding rear side door of the Transit open on a hot day. First sharp corner, yeah.
Following on from mine above, actually it says 'The issuing of a firearms certificate is a privilege not a right' which I suppose is true. Not everyone has the right to issue a Firearms Certificate - just the Chief Officer of Police.
I wonder whether he thinks it a privilege. Certainly it is his duty!
I wonder whether he thinks it a privilege. Certainly it is his duty!
No, it is not his duty to issue an FAC on demand. The applicant has to prove a good reason for any of the weapons on the FAC. Different story with an SGC, of course.
Are all FAC holders saints? No, although we'd like to think we are. Do we all deserve to keep our FACs forever? Not necessarily, although we like to think we do.
I see no problem with a bit of a prompt that FAC ownership is not an automatic right and that we can do stuff/say stuff/post stuff that negates that right. Regardless of our view of the efficiency of Firearms Licencing Departments, if we prove ourselves to be a potential danger to the general public or ourselves (or otherwise break the rules in some way), it would be negligent of the authorities not to do something.
One of my friends/club members killed himself with one of his 12 bore shotguns by a head shot. Seemingly, it was related to a deterioration in his medical health. If he had gone to the GP and talked about serious depression/suicidal thoughts, he may have had a visit from the police to confiscate his weapons. Would he be alive today? Maybe not - there are many other ways of doing away with oneself. But it may have reduced his chances of committing suicide.
30 firearms seized could relate to 2 or 3 FAC holders - the Faceache post doesn't specify - and we don't know on what specific basis (medical/criminal/DBS intelligence) they were seized.
But at least Derbyshire police are looking out for the general public (based on evidence).
I imagine someone in Derbyshire Police with some time on their hands (perhaps doing light duties due to an injury or something) has been given the job of trawling through firearms certificate holders and matching them against incidents which they have had some involvement in and come up with a list. They've then made a "hit list" of folk who have displayed actions that might call their suitability into question, or have suffered from a mental condition and then done the rounds.
However, most forces automatically do this whenever you come to police notice. If, for example you get arrested for something or are engaged in some sort of disorder, domestic incident, drink driving or whatever, as a matter of course, it is flagged and a decision is made concerning your suitability to possess firearms.
I can only surmise that Derbyshire hasn't been doing this, they've realised this (or had it pointed out) and have mounted an operation to rectify this. So whilst it's perhaps normal to think Derbyshire are getting tough with certificate holders, the real worry might well be that they've been allowing people to have guns who simply aren't suitable. So not quite sure why Derbyshire are boasting about this. Polishing a t*rd perhaps.
However, most forces automatically do this whenever you come to police notice. If, for example you get arrested for something or are engaged in some sort of disorder, domestic incident, drink driving or whatever, as a matter of course, it is flagged and a decision is made concerning your suitability to possess firearms.
I can only surmise that Derbyshire hasn't been doing this, they've realised this (or had it pointed out) and have mounted an operation to rectify this. So whilst it's perhaps normal to think Derbyshire are getting tough with certificate holders, the real worry might well be that they've been allowing people to have guns who simply aren't suitable. So not quite sure why Derbyshire are boasting about this. Polishing a t*rd perhaps.
C h r i s
Well-Known Member
I suppose the sad reality is that there are indeed a small number within the shooting community who may behave in a way that society or the law wouldn't appreciate (perhaps more likely to offend over the Christmas period when drinking more than usual...), however I don't suppose for a minute that these same people are visiting the Derbyshire Rural Crime Facebook page on a regular basis to get that particular message. Probably better to write to all FAC holders and remind them that they need to behave, either do it properly or not at all.... I'm sure such letters would go down well!
Stalker62
Well-Known Member
Benelli m2
Well-Known Member
So what did they do wrong
It is his duty to issue FACs and SGC (...shall be granted...) unless there is no good reason, or unfitness to hold, or risk to the public/peace etc. The current wording for each seems to amount to the same thing in the end.
In either case, he he has to explain why he's not issuing one if he decides not to.
We're violently agreeing on a similar point. A CC has more reasons to refuse to issue an FAC than a SGC.
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