United Utilities - please challenge shoot leases decision

[Northern_George]

Shooting or even the country way of life is slowly disappearing from our hands, and it’s a very sad thing to happen.
They have people in positions of power etc that don’t understand the country way of life or at least refuse to understand it.

 

[Cragman]

Shooting or even the country way of life is slowly disappearing from our hands, and it’s a very sad thing to happen.
They have people in positions of power etc that don’t understand the country way of life or at least refuse to understand it.

Exactly this. The new CEO has her own team in place now, all new school, woke heaven I’ve heard

 

[GeoffWood]

I wonder if UU are stopping the leases so they can claim the subsidies?
Must be £millions involved

 

[spanj]

Yes folks need to edit and not copy verbatim but use the key points raised in the original letter.

Dont waste your time. Heres the response i received. Its difficult to decode the business babble that basically says f*** off !

Thank you for contacting us to raise your concerns about the United Utilities’ updated land strategy. Building on decades of successful habitat restoration, we recently reviewed the way we manage our land to ensure we are fully focused on using our catchments to manage water quality, quantity and mitigate flooding, which are of strategic importance to us as we respond to the challenges of climate change.
Addressing these challenges requires a step change in our approach to help ensure a fully resilient ecosystem in which wet moorlands and biodiverse woodlands can improve catchment resilience by slowing the flow of water and improving water quality and retention – this is the primary reason we own this catchment land.
Following that review and to ensure we can focus on those areas, we will not be renewing shooting leases where we own the rights. This follows a decision made some time ago not to issue any such leases on a long-term basis. Stepping away from leasing our shooting rights, as those leases come to their natural expiry date over the next few years, provides an opportunity to work with stakeholders to change the land management approach and support the delivery of this long-term objective for increased catchment resilience.
We remain committed to working with others, to accelerate the restoration and rewetting of our peatlands and the biodiversity of our woodlands. We believe this will help unlock other opportunities to deliver a richer and more diverse approach to habitat management, conserving and improving biodiversity, including protected species, while also developing skills and jobs. We see this as an extension of our catchment management work which has been so successful in other parts of our region.
Our updated land strategy affects 24 licences where we have shooting rights within specific catchments. We are working through this transition with those who are affected by this change as the leases come to their natural end and we remain committed to working with others to help address climate change risks such as wildfires and droughts whilst improving biodiversity. Many current land management techniques will continue and these will form part of new plans, developed and delivered with stakeholders and partners, providing new jobs and economic benefits for those who work in our catchment communities.

​

© United Utilities Group PLC 2023

 

[VSS]

This doesn't apply to all UU land, only on areas where they own the sporting rights. As owners of the sporting rights, it's their perogative to lease them out or not lease them out, as they see fit.
Despite their smoke-and-mirrors response about habitat management etc etc, I should think that the bottom line is a financial decision. Sporting leases don't generate much revenue for the landowner. Certainly not enough to justify any actual (or percieved) hassle that may come about as a result of having shooters on their land. If they've come up with a more profitable option then they owe it to their shareholders to persue it.
Shame though.

 

[Scotty99]

Dont waste your time. Heres the response i received. Its difficult to decode the business babble that basically says f*** off !

Thank you for contacting us to raise your concerns about the United Utilities’ updated land strategy. Building on decades of successful habitat restoration, we recently reviewed the way we manage our land to ensure we are fully focused on using our catchments to manage water quality, quantity and mitigate flooding, which are of strategic importance to us as we respond to the challenges of climate change.
Addressing these challenges requires a step change in our approach to help ensure a fully resilient ecosystem in which wet moorlands and biodiverse woodlands can improve catchment resilience by slowing the flow of water and improving water quality and retention – this is the primary reason we own this catchment land.
Following that review and to ensure we can focus on those areas, we will not be renewing shooting leases where we own the rights. This follows a decision made some time ago not to issue any such leases on a long-term basis. Stepping away from leasing our shooting rights, as those leases come to their natural expiry date over the next few years, provides an opportunity to work with stakeholders to change the land management approach and support the delivery of this long-term objective for increased catchment resilience.
We remain committed to working with others, to accelerate the restoration and rewetting of our peatlands and the biodiversity of our woodlands. We believe this will help unlock other opportunities to deliver a richer and more diverse approach to habitat management, conserving and improving biodiversity, including protected species, while also developing skills and jobs. We see this as an extension of our catchment management work which has been so successful in other parts of our region.
Our updated land strategy affects 24 licences where we have shooting rights within specific catchments. We are working through this transition with those who are affected by this change as the leases come to their natural end and we remain committed to working with others to help address climate change risks such as wildfires and droughts whilst improving biodiversity. Many current land management techniques will continue and these will form part of new plans, developed and delivered with stakeholders and partners, providing new jobs and economic benefits for those who work in our catchment communities.

​

© United Utilities Group PLC 2023

Yes I’ve had their standard response letter as well. We should all write back quoting their objectives for land management and compare them to those objectives of their shooting leasees and suggest most strongly that both have more in common than have differences and urge them to enter into dial with their shooting leasees and together then can best manage the landscape, resources and biodiversity. I suggest we don’t give up at this first hurdle as that is what UU expect. If we continue the dialogue they may change their approach to be more conciliatory rather than the unilateral approach they are taking at the moment.

 

[Whitefront]

I doubt UU have come up with a more profitable alternative, in a strict sense. I think the real reason is connected to what VSS touched on in his reference to "hassle". Driven grouse, in particular, has become a highly highly politicised issue. Some years ago, an estate in Hampshire owned by the John Lewis Partnership stopped game shooting after a campaign by antis. The same estate carries on with game fishing to this day, because that isn't anywhere near so contentious.

 

[Cragman]

They’ll loose lots of goodwill from the shooting and farming community, especially when it comes to fighting moorland fires and moorland management, ie preditor control etc. If you’ve seen the Arse pb tackling a fire, you’ll know what I mean and if they’re serious about providing cleaner water, they need to do something about the thousands of Canada geese shitting in their treatment works and catchment reservoirs

 

[spanj]

They’ll loose lots of goodwill from the shooting and farming community, especially when it comes to fighting moorland fires and moorland management, ie preditor control etc. If you’ve seen the Arse pb tackling a fire, you’ll know what I mean and if they’re serious about providing cleaner water, they need to do something about the thousands of Canada geese shitting in their treatment works and catchment reservoirs

I hope you are right although know most would find it difficult not to help with a moorland fire. When it comes to shooting, sadly, there’ll be fools queuing up to pay to shoot the geese etc or they’ll get contractors in and pass on the bills to the end users i.e us

 

[spanj]

I doubt UU have come up with a more profitable alternative, in a strict sense. I think the real reason is connected to what VSS touched on in his reference to "hassle". Driven grouse, in particular, has become a highly highly politicised issue. Some years ago, an estate in Hampshire owned by the John Lewis Partnership stopped game shooting after a campaign by antis. The same estate carries on with game fishing to this day, because that isn't anywhere near so contentious.

I didnt know this. Will be writing to JL if you could name the estate pls

 

[spanj]

Yes I’ve had their standard response letter as well. We should all write back quoting their objectives for land management and compare them to those objectives of their shooting leasees and suggest most strongly that both have more in common than have differences and urge them to enter into dial with their shooting leasees and together then can best manage the landscape, resources and biodiversity. I suggest we don’t give up at this first hurdle as that is what UU expect. If we continue the dialogue they may change their approach to be more conciliatory rather than the unilateral approach they are taking at the moment.

You are of course correct. @Conor O'Gorman I assume BASC will be responding too ?

 

[Whitefront]

I didnt know this. Will be writing to JL if you could name the estate pls

Leckford. It happened quite a few years ago, mind. John Lewis end staff game shoot - Animal Aid Few companies wish to be associated with game shooting nowadays.

 

[Tom270]

Done with CA

 

[Jim xyz]

Just for interest below is the letter I wrote to UU’s CEO along with her amazingly thoughtful response. I expected nothing else and I’m sure that the 10 minutes it took me to write to her were 10 minutes wasted but about the only option we have is to fill her inbox and make her know that people care. I will also write back to her in a few days to thank her for her response and ask if she could shed a little more light on her reasoning.

It seems futile in the extreme but if only a tiny percentage of certificate holders could take 10 minutes it might at least make them think.



Dear Ms Beardmore,



United Utilities recent decision not to renew shooting licenses on its land is unfortunate in the extreme. The management of land for game shooting provides untold benefits for the biodiversity of these moors as well as supporting local communities both financially and through their personal wellbeing.



The management of land for shooting has been shown in study after study to benefit local flora and fauna while similar landscapes managed by organisations such as the RSPB have demonstrably less biodiversity, ironically, fewer birds and more apex predators. Due to their lack of any landscape management land under their custody also suffers a greater number of wildfires. Due to the much higher fuel load caused by a lack of muirburn these fires also tend to be much more destructive, causing very serious damage to the peat and and sadly destroying many red listed species.



A visit to any shoot day will show a great number of people, from the very young to the very senior getting out, exercising and enjoying good company. They also receive a small but useful supplement to their income in areas where it can be sorely needed. Yes, there will be a small number of people shooting and depending on the shoot they may have paid a great deal of money for the pleasure of spending a day on the moor but shoots are about much more than this.



By ending these days United Utilities will cause great harm to these communities and to the flora and fauna of these environments. It is sad that a very small but very vocal minority of single-minded activists have the ability through the fear companies have of bad publicity to cause such damage both human and environmental to a landscape and way of life that these activists have such little knowledge of or care for.



Yours sincerely,



And the wonderful response:


Dear James,



Many thanks for taking the time to write to me and provide your feedback regarding our updated land strategy.



Kind Regards



Louise

 

[Mickeydredd]

A better approach might be for a few thousand folk to buy a few shares in UU and "attack" from within!

 

[spanj]

A better approach might be for a few thousand folk to buy a few shares in UU and "attack" from within!

This is a good idea

 

[jall55]

I got the standard response
So i wrote back
I have just received another reply from a lady representing the CEO
i have just wrote back advising i wrote to the CEO as it is such an important issue and would not expect it to be passed on
I also copied in the chairman now too - as well as BASC - GWCT and Both my MPs

 

[Conor O'Gorman]

BASC update below:

United Utilities: fighting back - BASC

You can be part of shooting's reprisal against United Utilities' decision not to renew shoot leases on its land.

basc.org.uk

 

[Conor O'Gorman]

Following a conversation with the chief executive of United Utilities, Louise Beardmore, we are encouraged that she has pledged to undertake independent reviews of the 23 shoots that would have been affected by the original decision.

BASC statement on shoot leases on United Utilities land

BASC last night had a constructive conversation with United Utilities' CEO, Louise Beardmore, regarding shoot leases on the company's land.

basc.org.uk

 

[NickJ]

I've emailed three times and had two 'stock' or 'cut and paste' answers.

The second email I 1. asked them what evidence they had to influence their decision (we know it is not evidence based) and 2. I Googled who the UU board were and CC'd in some Board members in as the current CEO seems to fighting her own agenda apparently.

I focused on the effect it would have on rural communities (keepers redundancies, part time work, local pubs and hotels) and also the rare ground nesting species inc Hen Harriers that are thriving on their leased moors.

The RSPB are becoming very influential in UU estates here in the Forest of Bowland and in the Lakes. And we know right at the top of the RSPB's agenda is to get driven grouse shooting banned. They then would like to take the management of those moors over. We all know how that spells the death knell for rare ground nesting species from what we have seen from the likes of their Geltsdale and North Wales reserves.

UU have opened a 'shop' on the high street at Windermere. If you are in the area please pop in and ask them what evidence they used to make this decision.